The Hedgehog
Well-Known Member
@gentle lemur is the vervarium that the girl is peering into still there? Was the Ornagutan area the only part of Monsoon Forest to be consumed by the fire?
Chester Zoo Chester Zoo Discussion and Questions 2021
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@gentle lemur is the vervarium that the girl is peering into still there? Was the Ornagutan area the only part of Monsoon Forest to be consumed by the fire?
No, that whole area was completely gutted by the fire - and in point of fact I believe the fire originated in the heating/electric system for the tanks and vivariums within - and has been comprehensively rebuilt; this being the reason for the current discussion regarding how the design and layout of the area differs from the first incarnation.
The Hedgehog
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@TeaLovingDave if an unknowing person went into this section of Monsoon Forest,would they think it's just been refurbished? In other words is the new incarnation totally different to the one pictured.
We are so lucky that the fire skimmed past the Orangutan House & Enclosure,Chesters Orangutans could have so easily suffered the fate of those at Krefeld Zoo. Ironically Monsoon Forest is almost the same as the Ape and Tropical House that Krefeld lost.
It feels more like a significant refurbishment/redesign; as noted previously the difference primarily lies in better exhibits, less-pronounced theming and other such fine details.
Having been in both, I can say that is complete nonsense
design-wise (and quality-wise) the two couldn't be more different! There is little to no resemblance between them. Quite apart from anything else, the inhabitants of the Krefeld structure had no outdoor access, which is precisely what saved the orangutans at Chester.Conversely, the Gorilla House at Zoo Köln *is* near-identical in basic footplan to the former exhibit at Krefeld of which you speak, although in terms of interior details and exterior exhibits the resemblance is now rather less pronounced.
The Hedgehog
Well-Known Member
It feels more like a significant refurbishment/redesign; as noted previously the difference primarily lies in better exhibits, less-pronounced theming and other such fine details.
Having been in both, I can say that is complete nonsense
Conversely, the Gorilla House at Zoo Köln *is* near-identical in basic footplan to the former exhibit at Krefeld of which you speak, although in terms of interior details and exterior exhibits the resemblance is now rather less pronounced.
@TeaLovingDave would you say that Monsoon Forest is a modern and superior version of the now,burned down enclosure at Krefeld? I have not been in Monsoon Forest or the Krefeld exhibit. Due to this your view is much greater than mine.
With regards to Chester features been installed in Monsoon Forest to prevent another blaze?
Do you think that Krefeld could be to blame for the loss of their Orangutan Family,Gorillas and Chimps. I say this as, it is logical to have an outdoor enclosure for such species. I hope that Krefeld learns from the tragedy of New Years eve 2020,and constructs outdoor areas.
Some comfort can be taken as shortly before the catastrophe Mellony and Lara the Chimps were sent to Welsh Mountain Zoo, meanwhile Hujan the baby Orangutan went to Monkey World for handreaing. Fortunately Hujan now has a new Family and Mellony and Lara are part of a Chimpanzee family. I believe Mellony has even had a baby.
I wouldn't, as they are really nothing alike - you might as well say *any* given ape exhibit or tropical house is a version of the former Krefeld complex.
No, and such speculation/insinuations are both harmful and insensitive.
I don't think any new visitor would realise that there had been a fire in the Monsoon Forest if they didn't know about it previously. The vivaria and aquaria are in the same positions as before, but those on the western side in particular allow better access to the windows and there is less clutter. There is also a new vivarium by the screens and doors leading to the planted sections with free-fying birds etc.
I have never been to Krefeld so I can't make any direct comparison, but the other obvious differences are that that building was completed in 1975 and the ape enclosures had dry moats, whereas the Monsoon Forest was 2 years old and the orangs were behind glass indoors, so they had some time to escape from the smoke.
The Krefeld apes would have had nowhere to escape to - there were no outdoor enclosures - another factor of its age. At the time of the fire the only great ape outdoor enclosure was the one for the breeding group of gorillas, and they had separate housing not in the main house.
OK, I am going to take issue with speculation in a couple of threads recently.
I was accused by someone of being insensitive in supposedly being dismissive of rare breeds breeding in the Jimmy's Farm thread.
Since then a new member started a thread speculating on a keeper death and now this thread has someone making uncalled for speculation on a major tragedy.
I consider both of these unnecessary and the questions unnatural.
Just stop and think before you post things like this, would you be happy if someone started a thread speculating on your personal life?
Use your filters, people!
I was accused by someone of being insensitive in supposedly being dismissive of rare breeds breeding in the Jimmy's Farm thread.
Since then a new member started a thread speculating on a keeper death and now this thread has someone making uncalled for speculation on a major tragedy.
I consider both of these unnecessary and the questions unnatural.
Just stop and think before you post things like this, would you be happy if someone started a thread speculating on your personal life?
Use your filters, people!
That point had been made already, so I didn't repeat it. On reflection I think there are a couple of further points which may be significant. After checking I ought to add that the roof of the Ape House at Krefeld was replaced in 2009.The fire at Krefeld started externally when a 'sky lantern' landed on the roof during the night. While the fire in the Monsoon Forest started internally during the day. This is bound to have affected the responses to the fires and their outcomes. I wonder whether any zoos with outdoor ape exhibits have any provision for the animals to have access to those areas if an emergency occurs during the night.
Note for @GaryA, this is not speculation, in my opinion. It's not a pleasant topic, but it is an important one. I think the discussion in this thread has been respectful and appropriate. You are free to disagree and to ignore me if you wish.
Nope I wouldn't do that, everybody is allowed their opinion as I said when someone tried to shame me for a harmless comment.
However, I do think seeking to directly blame someone for a terrible accident, and in the other thread, directly speculating on a named person's death, are insensitive at best, and possibly litigious at worst.
I'm sending you a p.m. about this.
The Hedgehog
Well-Known Member
@GaryA which Zookeeper are you referring too?
Rajang-GOAT
Well-Known Member
Where abouts on this channel
They're not in a playlist I don't think (unlike other series like 'The Zoo' from Dublin Zoo), but the episodes are marked as Zoo Days on the channel:
https://www.youtube.com/c/WildThingsChannel/search?query=zoo days
I'm trying to make a list of the Orangutans at Chester, am I missing anyone?
Sumatran
Can anyone add any further information please?
Sumatran
- Puluh - m
- Emma - f
- Subis - f
- Tuti (Subis x Puluh) - 2012? - f
- Siska (Subis x Puluh) - 2015? - f
- Kesuma (Emma x Puluh) - 2018 - f
- Arga (Subis x Puluh) - 2019 - m
- Martha - f
- Tuan? - m
- Willie - 2002 - m
- Sarikei - f
- Leia - 1996 - f
- Tombol (Sarikei x Willie) - 2017? - m
Can anyone add any further information please?
Emma has a dughter named Hilda and Leia has a daughter named Dot, I believe both were born this year.
The Hedgehog
Well-Known Member
I know this is not really Chester Zoo news. After years of searching I have ordered a DVD of The Zoo Days Chester series. Too say I am chuffed would be an understatement.
Thank you for the names, a quick search on Google - Dot was born June 2020. The latest Sumatran birth was June this year - it doesn't say a name so I'll guess this was Hilda.
Sumatran Orangutan
Puluh (M) 23/09/1987 (Perth)
Subis (F) 30/11/1986 (Chester)
Emma (F) – Subis’ sister 14/11/1987 (Chester)
Tuti (Subis) (F) 13/12/2012 (Chester)
Siska (Subis) (F) 03/09/2015 (Chester)
Kesuma (Emma) (F) 17/12/2017 (Chester)
Arga (Subis) (M) 14/11/2019 (Chester)
Hillda (Emma) (F) 19/06/2021 (Chester)
Bornean Orangutan
Martha (F) 01/01/1965 (Wild)
Tuan (M) (off-show) 18/09/1978 (Cologne)
Sarikei (F) 22/11/1983 (Chester)
Leia (F) 06/02/1996 (Chester)
Willie (M) 17/04/2002 (Apeldoorn)
Tombol (M) (Sarikei) 02/04/2017 (Chester)
Dot (F) (Leia) 18/06/2020 (Chester)
~
Puluh (M) 23/09/1987 (Perth)
Subis (F) 30/11/1986 (Chester)
Emma (F) – Subis’ sister 14/11/1987 (Chester)
Tuti (Subis) (F) 13/12/2012 (Chester)
Siska (Subis) (F) 03/09/2015 (Chester)
Kesuma (Emma) (F) 17/12/2017 (Chester)
Arga (Subis) (M) 14/11/2019 (Chester)
Hillda (Emma) (F) 19/06/2021 (Chester)
Bornean Orangutan
Martha (F) 01/01/1965 (Wild)
Tuan (M) (off-show) 18/09/1978 (Cologne)
Sarikei (F) 22/11/1983 (Chester)
Leia (F) 06/02/1996 (Chester)
Willie (M) 17/04/2002 (Apeldoorn)
Tombol (M) (Sarikei) 02/04/2017 (Chester)
Dot (F) (Leia) 18/06/2020 (Chester)
~
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