Chester Zoo Congo Buffalo

bongorob said:
Apparently about 20 years ago an impure giraffe was bred with pure bred Rothschild's, thus contaminating the gene pool.

However I was told that the person who made this discovery based his dientification on a photograph of the animal in question. Chester Zoo refer to them as Rothschild's Giraffes.
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Can we rewind a bit here... This news indicates that crossing occurred in a captive group somewhere a long time ago. Is the suggestion that MANY(even all) Rothschild's giraffe in UK originate from this source so they could also be suspect? So this applies not only to the ones at Chester?

And do you know where CHester's came from ?
 
grantsmb said:
Can we rewind a bit here... This news indicates that crossing occurred in a captive group somewhere a long time ago. Is the suggestion that MANY(even all) Rothschild's giraffe in UK originate from this source so they could also be suspect? So this applies not only to the ones at Chester?

And do you know where CHester's came from ?
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The male came from Edinburgh,the 2 females from Belfast,as for the purity of the male is not in question the females are in doubt but talking to someone who knows the stud-book co-ordinator at Hagenbecks Zoo on the 1st September it looks like any doubt will be ended shortly as the co-ordinator had just gone to Belfast to have a look at their Giraffes in person.
 
I am very sceptical if anyone can identify a hybrid giraffe by a PICTURE. The phenotype of rothschild`s giraffes (and other giraffe subspecies, too!) both in zoos and in the wild is very variable and there can be animals in one herd of which one looks more like a massai or reticulated giraffe then a pure rothschild.

And I would not think one impure giraffe has ruined the rothschild`s population forever, since there are areas in their natural habitat where they mix with massai and reticulated (I think) giraffes. If the so-called impure giraffe was of these subspecies, it only happened what happens in the wild too.
 
Yassa said:
I am very sceptical if anyone can identify a hybrid giraffe by a PICTURE. The phenotype of rothschild`s giraffes (and other giraffe subspecies, too!) both in zoos and in the wild is very variable and there can be animals in one herd of which one looks more like a massai or reticulated giraffe then a pure rothschild.

And I would not think one impure giraffe has ruined the rothschild`s population forever, since there are areas in their natural habitat where they mix with massai and reticulated (I think) giraffes. If the so-called impure giraffe was of these subspecies, it only happened what happens in the wild too.
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I agree with you about the picture the co-ordinator was looking at Belfast records which show where the animals were caught as all of their founding stock were wild caught,and you are correct with the species that over lap with the Rothschilds
 
zoogiraffe said:
The male came from Edinburgh,the 2 females from Belfast,as for the purity of the male is not in question the females are in doubt but talking to someone who knows the stud-book co-ordinator at Hagenbecks Zoo on the 1st September it looks like any doubt will be ended shortly as the co-ordinator had just gone to Belfast to have a look at their Giraffes in person.
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I have already commented that the hybrid question is an uneasy one. However, if one giraffe from the hybrid zone or a neighbouring subspecies has somehow been mixed up with the Rothschild's, that is just what happens in the wild. And it does strengthen the genes of the Rothschild's species anyway.

As for giraffe Coordinator, he is at Overloon Zoo in the eastern part of Holland. His name is Marc Damen. If he would come down to Belfast just to take a peek, it would not say that much ... rothschildi, massaicus and the like are so variable (even reticulata has darker and lighter colour phases). So, do not think to much of it all .......
 
Of course, with Giraffe, zoos can't really do any conservation work for a rare SPECIES, its only some of the races that are numerically rare. So they concentrate on something like the Rothschild's, but as several others have posted, there are natural gradations between the different races anyway so its all a bit of a hypothetical exercise anyway....
 
jelle said:
I have already commented that the hybrid question is an uneasy one. However, if one giraffe from the hybrid zone or a neighbouring subspecies has somehow been mixed up with the Rothschild's, that is just what happens in the wild. And it does strengthen the genes of the Rothschild's species anyway.

As for giraffe Coordinator, he is at Overloon Zoo in the eastern part of Holland. His name is Marc Damen. If he would come down to Belfast just to take a peek, it would not say that much ... rothschildi, massaicus and the like are so variable (even reticulata has darker and lighter colour phases). So, do not think to much of it all .......
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I thought Marc Damen worked at Burgers Zoo at least he did 4 years a go if hes moved i was not aware of it.
 
I think he is now working for zoodiak zoos, an organisation which owns serveral small but excellent zoos in the Netherlands. Overloon is one the zoodiak parks.
 
zoogiraffe+Yassa,

You are both right. Marc used to be a curator of sorts in Burgers Zoo. He moved on to Overloon a while back and has continued as EEP Coordinator for giraffes (even though Overloon does not keep them at present).
 
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