Can you tell me what a 'Bogan' is...?
Zion Wildlife Gardens Craig Busch and Zion Wildlife Gardens
- Thread starter Peter Dickinson
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Ratcatcher
Member
Allegations without proof
I've been reading the posts on here and Zion Wildlife Gardens where a number of allegations have been made about Craig Busch. When asked for proof of the allegations none has been forth coming. For example the person making allegations about death of cubs kept changing their story, no proof of drug taken has been produced. There is a small band of people associated with present management of the park who have repeatedly posted these allegations under different names.
The park has been receiving help from the local community to pay for the feeding of the animals whilst turning away paying visitors who have supported the park for a number of years.
I've been reading the posts on here and Zion Wildlife Gardens where a number of allegations have been made about Craig Busch. When asked for proof of the allegations none has been forth coming. For example the person making allegations about death of cubs kept changing their story, no proof of drug taken has been produced. There is a small band of people associated with present management of the park who have repeatedly posted these allegations under different names.
The park has been receiving help from the local community to pay for the feeding of the animals whilst turning away paying visitors who have supported the park for a number of years.
Peter Dickinson
Well-Known Member
It would appear Ratcatcher that you are making your own allegations without producing proof. Have you read Craig Busch and Zion Wildlife Gardens ? Please do and then point out the incorrect details so I can make corrections.
madbushfarm
Well-Known Member
Ratcatcher your comment is interesting to say the least. You say the same people closely associated with the park are using different names to post allegations about Mr Busch - however I've not hidden who I am and never have. The use of government sourced documents for factual proof is what I use - heresay is heresay. The proof in concrete is another. The declawings happened. The ERA Report from Mr Busch's application for reinstatement is a genuine document also. It gives factual none biased accounts of the situation concerning Mr Busch's dismissal from the park. Doe she take drugs? We don't know. Did he kill cubs? We don't know that either. If the proof is there then it will no doubt in due course come to light. As far as I am concerned the courts are the ones that are the deciding factor. They said/He said won't cut it in the High Court. The judge will be the one who decides the right and fair course to be taken in this dispute.
blackpanther
Well-Known Member
I personally don't see the problem with the local community helping out the park, in England as you will know ratcatcher as you live there, zoo's and parks are happy to recieve help from whereever they can get it, for example monkey world in dorset, they accept donations of toys and blankets and things for the primates there, and also the primate adoptions. Maybe your forgetting ratcatcher that patricia busch came to zion to dig it out of the ginormous hole it was in, that would take a while i understand, who knows what may have happened if she hadn't helped him out
I have followed this story very closely as well as I do watch the Lionman program . There has been an awful lot allegations made against Craig Busch , the only one that can be proven as true is the de-clawing issue, which lets not forget MAF was aware about , everything else has been hearsay
This man has got without doubt a rare talent with big cats , I just don't understand why so many people seem to be so against him?
MadBuschFarm , you have answered a lot of your own questions here
None of us do know if Craig Bush took drugs , killed cubs etc.
If these allegations are proved to be wrong , which I am led to understand were not included as reasons for his dismissal from Zion Wildlife Gardens , there are many people like yourself who have done a very good character assasination job , which I think is very unfair .
Also , although I do not agree with the de clawing issue. MAF were aware that these procedures were being done.
BabylonZoo
Member
Peter Dickinson - in your piece you mention that - "An inspection of Zion found that the cats were kept in 'overcrowded and insanitary conditions'." Would this be the inspection that happened after Craig called in MAF himself because he was worried about conditions brought about by the management failing to provide him with the resources he needed to care for the animals properly?
You may not agree with how Craig has run HIS business in the past but that does not make it OK for you to become complicit in a smear campaign based on allegations by people with a vested interest in doing so. According to you, if someone makes an allegation, it is fact.
It is fortunate that both the serious big cat attacks happened AFTER Craig had been excluded from the park or you would be blaming those on him as well
You may not agree with how Craig has run HIS business in the past but that does not make it OK for you to become complicit in a smear campaign based on allegations by people with a vested interest in doing so. According to you, if someone makes an allegation, it is fact.
It is fortunate that both the serious big cat attacks happened AFTER Craig had been excluded from the park or you would be blaming those on him as well
Well I've seen it all on this one. The rant above? Sorry I doubt anyone on this board takes drugs I know I don't. I go on actual government documents to make my opinions not heresay. You said you're in the UK? I'm in New Zealand an hour from the park and I also happen to know the people on the team. Regardless of the issues only the NZ Courts will decide the outcome - not the public. You're entitled to your opinion but resorting to accusing people of taking drugs - that is heresay and groundless rubbish. Attacking people only reflects upon the person making the attacks - not on those being attacked.
Well in your own words" Attacking people only reflects upon the person making the attacks - not on those being attacked."
[/QUOTE]Reading many of your comments you seem to be making an awful lot os unsubstansiated comments and facts about Craig Busch
Does that mean there is one rule for you and not for others?
madbushfarm
Well-Known Member
Reading many of your comments you seem to be making an awful lot os unsubstansiated comments and facts about Craig BuschWell in your own words" Attacking people only reflects upon the person making the attacks - not on those being attacked."
Does that mean there is one rule for you and not for others?[/QUOTE]
In that particular comment members of this board were being accused of taking drugs. I don't quite know what you are trying to get at by referring in particular to my posts and stating what I have written is unsubstantiated. - yes it is. The person I was addressing at the time was offensive and out of order in their remarks. Have I accused Craig Busch of killing cubs and taking drugs? No - because there is no proof. Yes I have the declawing report which I obtained from MAF then made public. I have the ERA report. I go on facts and not heresay. People are allowed to have their say on this board - does that mean it is also one rule for you and one rule for others. The difference is I can back everything up - those who have come in defence of Mr Busch state things as fact yet they can't back it up. Did he call MAF in? - He may have or he may not have. Your arguements go nowhere. Point out exactly where I am incorrect and I will correct it. Documents? Reports, Links?
A rare talent, or a large set of pinchers? I'm afraid I cannot be bothered to argue with people whose main point seems to be "you have no proof", however saying that Craig Busch has a rare talent is absolute rubbish. Anyone can go in with a declawed, hand-reared tiger (as demonstrated by the fact tourists were allowed into the cages for pictures); the animals at Zion were turned into nothing more than big pussy-cats used to enlarge his ego
So, before you consider replying again, perhaps try practising what you preach and finding a little "proof" yourself because, as madbushfan has just so amply demonstrated, it is actually your own allegations which are the ones with no grounding in reality.
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madbushfarm
Well-Known Member
Can you tell me what a 'Bogan' is...?
Taken from Wikipedia for the definition of Bogan
According to the stereotype, the speech and mannerisms of "bogans" indicate poor education, cheap clothing and uncultured upbringing. 'Bogans' usually reside in economically disadvantaged suburbs (often outer metropolitan) or rural areas[1].
[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bogan]Bogan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
You could have left the last three words off that quote.
That makes you and me both "bogans"!!!! LOL
madbushfarm
Well-Known Member
Well Steve I guess i can live with being a "Bogan" hah hah hah! Oh well I'm off to the economically disadvantaged op-shop now to get new gumboots and chew on the hay. LOL
ah, another Lion Man thread that's going to end up being locked thanks to what I guess could be called "spammers" from the other side of the world who cannot use the internet in a civilised manner. AUSSIE-LEE really made me laugh though.
Is a chav the ecological equivalent of a bogan me-wonders?
Is a chav the ecological equivalent of a bogan me-wonders?
madbushfarm
Well-Known Member
Well close I guess. Another Wikipedia search here.
The stereotypical "chav" is an aggressive teenager or young adult who often engages in anti-social behaviour,[1] such as street drinking, drug abuse and rowdy behaviour. They are often assumed to be unemployed or in a low paid job,
[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chav]Chav - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
I'm going back to being a Bogan now...
I've used the word 'Bogan' interchangeably with 'Drongo'. Or 'Dork'.
In western NSW there's a Bogan River, a place called Bogan Gate, and many towns have a Bogan Street. I've tried (unsuccessfully) to find out who Bogan was, or how the river was named. Nobody seems to know.
Hix
In western NSW there's a Bogan River, a place called Bogan Gate, and many towns have a Bogan Street. I've tried (unsuccessfully) to find out who Bogan was, or how the river was named. Nobody seems to know.
Hix
Having lived in both regions where bogans and chavs reside, I would have to say no.
I always connected bogans with AC-DC, black desert boots and tight jeans.
Chavs are those on estates that follow affordable fashions and celebrities. It's more complicated than that, but you get the jist...
madbushfarm
Well-Known Member
Okay then I'll be a Bogan then after all I have AC/DC albums? Not sure about the tight jeans and black desert boots though.
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