ZSL London Zoo Critically endangered callithrids

I would guess so, but they have so many otters now, it may be that they have separated the animals into singe-sex groups.

Gentle Lemur's description of the clore is as you enter from the Round house side; there is a second entrance on the cotton terraces side. The central rainforest biome, imagine you are looking down on it along on of it's longest sides, facing in the direction of the road and the ZSL entrance. Behind you would be the rows of callitichid glass fronted cases, these extend to your right the whole way to the building entrance. These include the old mongoose compartments. At the end of that corridor would normally be a left turn up the corridor we are all saying has been blocked off, which would otherwise take you to the outdoor marmoset cage (the old wombat enclosure) and the triangular outdoor space for maras/otters. It is likely that the tamanduas occupy an area around here. Two male squirrel monkeys were being quarantined here in the spring.
Standing in the same place in the biome, to your left would be the former tree shrew exhibits, and immediately further on round the corner on the same side is a large agouti/goeldi's exhibit, and I think the other main clore entrance is nearby. If you were to turn right when you got to the agoutis, you would see indoor exhibits for gentle lemurs (with their outdoor runs on the outside of this part of the building), and further on, green iguanas. From here my memory is hazy, but I think that the former black rat area and that open old air saki/pine marten/ruffed lemur cage that once stood in that part would have led out to the old mara enclosure from the other direction. I am assuming this and the closed off corridor will open as an extension to the current theme of the clore in the not too distant future.
 
The other entrance is also on the canal side, but at the end of the clore building that is nearest to the cotton terraces. It may well be that this is supposed to be an exit, to guide visitors round one way, but I went through it without really noticing and left the building through the entrance you describe.
 
The clore is a bit of a maze (which to me somehow adds to it's appeal) but I've done my best to figure out a rough floorplan. I've figured this out from accumulated memories (I've visited in 2001, 2005, 2007 and 2008) so some dates may be muddled- particularly between 05 and 07. I've also looked at photos, old and new, and an aerial photo.

I'd be interested to see who agrees with this, and what else can be added to these diagrams. I think figuring out the night zone is the next challenge, which should be very hard!

I've included pictures, and the letters on the map correlate to where the photo was taken from.

Rough list of species I've seen in the clore are (this is off the top of my head so stuff is bound to be missing)- Cotton-top tamarin, golden tamarin, golden-headed tamarin, goeldi's monkey, common marmoset, geoffroy's marmoset, silvery marmoset, emperor tamarin (?), douricouli, saki monkey, titi monkey, Lesser Galago, Greater Galago, Slender Loris, Slow Loris, Potto, Aloatran Gentle Lemur, two-toed sloth, tamandua, mara, green agouti, black rat, Prevorst's tree squirrel, Panay Cloud Runner, African Brush-tailed Porcupine, Bushy-tailed Dormouse, Degu, Spiny Mice, Malagasy Jumping Rat, Tree Shrew, Elephant Shrew, Domestic Ferret, Sand Cat, Dwarf Mongoose, Rodrigues Fruit Bat, Sebas Short Tailed Bat, Striped Possum, Sugar Gliders, Potoroo, Bettong, Anaconda, Green Iguana, Sun Bittern, Aracari, Cane Toad, Red-bellied Piranha. I think there must be some marsupials missing.

[thumb=11793;540;clorejp.JPG]clorejp[/thumb]
[thumb=11792;540;CLORE2.JPG]CLORE2[/thumb]
 
i feel sorry for staff who work there it must take a while to find your way round! im still very confused but well done on the species list!
 
CZJimmy said:
The new otter pool will definately be in the former mara enclosure. There was a piece about it on the ZSL website. It's why the mara were moved to 'meet the monkeys'.
Click to expand...

Am I missing something here? Are the short-clawed otters moving to a new exhibit within the Clore? If so this is less than five years since they moved to the revamped area to the side of the Clore with the underwater viewing.
 
tetrapod said:
Am I missing something here? Are the short-clawed otters moving to a new exhibit within the Clore? If so this is less than five years since they moved to the revamped area to the side of the Clore with the underwater viewing.
Click to expand...

I don't know. Johnstoni seems to think it'll be for a single-sex group to make space in the main pool.

Edit: just found the article
Maras monkey around - News - ZSL London Zoo - ZSL

To make way for a renovated otter pool, a new home needed to be found for the rodents
Click to expand...
 
yes remeber all those youngsters that were born they needed more room so they made an extra pool? but has anyone actually seen it yet?
 
^Chris^, I think you've got the plan just about right. The only correction I can make is that the Alaotra gentle lemurs are the east end, opposite the end of the rainforest (near point C) they have the large outdoor enclosure there. The area you have labelled 10 was always the keeper's kitchen etc, so I guess it still is.
The nocturnal enclosures are to the south and east of the rainforest, under the area that is closed to the public. Several of these are being renovated at the moment, so that section is rather empty.

Tigerlemurguy said:
yes remeber all those youngsters that were born they needed more room so they made an extra pool? but has anyone actually seen it yet?
Click to expand...

No you can't see it, because as the plan shows you cannot get past the barriers to see that courtyard. There used to be a window from the corridor (over the stairs to/from the moonlight section), but that is blocked off too now.

Alan
 
hey,
yeah that's pretty much how I remember it. The row of enclosures to the north of the main biome hold marmosets (including the black-tailed) and some tamarins. The middle '2' on your plan is the indoor area for some of the gentle lemurs. The areas I can't picture are 8 and 9, I don't know what these now hold.
Is that a definite then about the tamandua enclosure?
I think the old row of African brush-tailed porcupines cages with the weird little moat thing still exist, but I can't remember where in the building they are nor what is held in them now.

I think the general consensus is that the otters have been breeding like crazy of late and they aren't replacing the existing exhibit but in fact creating an 'overflow' for some of them....
 
johnstoni said:
hey,
yeah that's pretty much how I remember it. The row of enclosures to the north of the main biome hold marmosets (including the black-tailed) and some tamarins. The middle '2' on your plan is the indoor area for some of the gentle lemurs. The areas I can't picture are 8 and 9, I don't know what these now hold.
Is that a definite then about the tamandua enclosure?
I think the old row of African brush-tailed porcupines cages with the weird little moat thing still exist, but I can't remember where in the building they are nor what is held in them now.

I think the general consensus is that the otters have been breeding like crazy of late and they aren't replacing the existing exhibit but in fact creating an 'overflow' for some of them....
Click to expand...


Number 8 is the open topped enclosure for sakis, it was glass walls on 3 sides, mesh on the back, and wire on the roof.

In your piece you said "...I think that the former black rat area and that open old air saki/pine marten/ruffed lemur cage that once stood in that part would have led out to the old mara enclosure from the other direction." That's 8 & 9, I can picture it, but can't describe it.

I am certain that that is where the tamandua indoor accomodation were located in 2005. I may have misremembered the outdoor accomodation, but I seem to think there is a wire cage with some climbing branches in that little corner there.

I do not remember the porcupine enclosure you speak of, I've only ever seen the brush-tail porcupine in the night zone, opposite the bats, and cape porcupines in the Casson Pavillion.
 
johnstoni said:
hey,
yeah that's pretty much how I remember it. The row of enclosures to the north of the main biome hold marmosets (including the black-tailed) and some tamarins. The middle '2' on your plan is the indoor area for some of the gentle lemurs. The areas I can't picture are 8 and 9, I don't know what these now hold.
Is that a definite then about the tamandua enclosure?
I think the old row of African brush-tailed porcupines cages with the weird little moat thing still exist, but I can't remember where in the building they are nor what is held in them now.
Click to expand...

Number 8 was a courtyard as ^Chris^ said. Number 9 opposite this area was a section of three cages, which held a range of species over the years including squirrels (such as fire-footed), striped grass mice, Nile rats and even weasels.
The row of cages for porcupines were, in my opinion, the least successful in the old Clore. They had open fronts except for a glass wall about 30 cm tall, and there was a moat about a metre wide between the front and the public area. They were demolished to make part of the space for the rainforest. The small cages opposite them are still there, to the south of public area. They were used for small rodents etc (I remember short-eared elephant shrews too), but they now hold insects.
The last time I saw the tamanduas, the adults were separated, but both were in the unusual full-height enclosures which had shuttered windows. One was at the south end of the row that's now closed off, it could be opened onto the mara paddock, it was beside the door to the path beween the mara courtyard and the marmoset/wombat one. The other one was at the north end of the row opposite (which had two cages which were used for animals in quarantine). It was next to the window which looked west into an outside cage for one of the marmoset species (which was added after the main building, like the one for the gentle lemurs at the other end of the building).

Alan
 
thats so strange because last time in went to the rainforest lookout, i saw the old mara enclosure and wondered why it wasnt occupied, this was in 2006 though
 
Tigerlemurguy said:
thats so strange because last time in went to the rainforest lookout, i saw the old mara enclosure and wondered why it wasnt occupied, this was in 2006 though
Click to expand...

I don't think the rainforest look-out had been opened in 2006 and a number of the animals from the Clore were kept briefly in cages in the Casson pavillion, so it is likely the Mara were there.
 
gentle lemur said:
Number 8 was a courtyard as ^Chris^ said. Number 9 opposite this area was a section of three cages, which held a range of species over the years including squirrels (such as fire-footed), striped grass mice, Nile rats and even weasels.
The row of cages for porcupines were, in my opinion, the least successful in the old Clore. They had open fronts except for a glass wall about 30 cm tall, and there was a moat about a metre wide between the front and the public area. They were demolished to make part of the space for the rainforest. The small cages opposite them are still there, to the south of public area. They were used for small rodents etc (I remember short-eared elephant shrews too), but they now hold insects.
The last time I saw the tamanduas, the adults were separated, but both were in the unusual full-height enclosures which had shuttered windows. One was at the south end of the row that's now closed off, it could be opened onto the mara paddock, it was beside the door to the path beween the mara courtyard and the marmoset/wombat one. The other one was at the north end of the row opposite (which had two cages which were used for animals in quarantine). It was next to the window which looked west into an outside cage for one of the marmoset species (which was added after the main building, like the one for the gentle lemurs at the other end of the building).

Alan
Click to expand...

Yes, you memories seem to correlate with mine, there are a few differences in species, but they changed quite frequently. I'd remembered the tamandua slightly wrong then, it seems they were opposite where I have put them.

I have to say I still don't really remember these porcupine enclosures- though the area you describe, I seem to remember seeing sandcats in 2005, thought the exhibit was glass fronted. Had the old porcupine enclosures been renovated before they were knocked down completely for the rainforest room?

Looking at my photos and map, were they on the right hand side of photo F?
 
CZJimmy said:
I don't think the rainforest look-out had been opened in 2006 and a number of the animals from the Clore were kept briefly in cages in the Casson pavillion, so it is likely the Mara were there.
Click to expand...

2007 i meant sorry, thats the year it opened isnt it? as i went a few days after it opened maybe they hadnt finished boarding up that area, i know it was the old mara enclosure cos i had seen it a few years before.
 
^Chris^ said:
Yes, you memories seem to correlate with mine, there are a few differences in species, but they changed quite frequently. I'd remembered the tamandua slightly wrong then, it seems they were opposite where I have put them.

I have to say I still don't really remember these porcupine enclosures- though the area you describe, I seem to remember seeing sandcats in 2005, thought the exhibit was glass fronted. Had the old porcupine enclosures been renovated before they were knocked down completely for the rainforest room?

Looking at my photos and map, were they on the right hand side of photo F?
Click to expand...

They have always moved animals around within the Clore, so I expect we're both right about the tamanduas. You're right about the porcupine enclosures in photo F. Alternatively if you had turned round after shooting photo B, taken a couple of steps and then turned left, you would have been at the other end of that row. The first cage was larger and had a sloping glass front like the marmoset enclosures etc - it held margays when I visited first, and may well have held sandcats (and other things) later on. Then there were the three (I think) porcupine cages.
Your other comment has got me wondering, I think you may be right: those cages may have been modified some years before they were finally removed. I don't remember exactly (which probably means that they didn't hold anything that took my interest).

Alan
 
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