Exotic Mammals in Australian Zoos
- Thread starter Chlidonias
- Start date
Zoofan15 said:
You're completely right. I've read reviews online on TripAdvisor etc that have a lot of people saying that they feel their ''bang for a buck'' compared to how many species they get to see is very limited. There's a lot of positive mention about exhibit designs including the way the public viewing spaces are designed at the major Zoos that can afford to craft them that way; and while its great to see progressive changes in the enlargement of enclosures spatially more and more the feedback from online reviewers who are interested in seeing a larger number of species diversity is very apparent. Really do think some more space can be found in the big Zoos for more species, while definitely not as many as we'd like to see certainly perhaps a 15% increase perhaps. One example off the top of my head is the 'village' and 'airplane' set up in Taronga's new Sumatran Tiger area. While its noble that they apparently have info on some info about the palm oil production problem in SE Asia on top of deforestation, surely a couple of big signposts could suffice and the space used as another exhibit?
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I think giraffe, plains zebra, Asian elephant, binturong, chimpanzee, tufted capuchin, B+W colobus and black-handed spider monkey are all examples which are managed inAustralasia at the species level due to previous uncertain ancestry, difficulty of import, lack of regional interest to start again etc. Other zoos globally (attempt to) manage them at the subspecific level.
I must admit I thought the original post referred to inter-species hybridization. Yes I think you are basically right, and given the difficulties you outline, as well as there being almost no possibility these animals or descendants will ever be used for reintroduction, what is wrong with that?
See post above re zebras. Re inbred giraffes this is no doubt seen as a way of ensuring giraffes remain on display until more can be imported. Keep in mind that the progany of an inbred animal mated to an animal it is not related to are not themselves inbred.
I've argued before that most exotic animals in this country have no conservation value, no matter what their genetics. In my opinion zoos are completely justified in keeping a show going for the public, while engaging in genuine conservation work either in range countries or with endangered native species.
I do think exotic species in zoos have a valuable role both inspiring visitors with the diversity of the animal kingdom, and for education.
Most yes. In the last three decades the region has contributed exotic animals directly to programmes involved in their release to the wild - with Sumatran orangutan, Przewalski's horse and Nepalese red panda being three examples that spring to mind. Why stop there?
Agreed, but why not aspire to combining this with the concept of these species holding the conservation value any zoo will claim they have. These two concepts don’t HAVE to be mutually exclusive.
I believe you can add Blackbuck antelope exported to Pakistan also in the past!
I believe you can add Blackbuck antelope exported to Pakistan also in the past!
I hadn’t heard of that one, but looked it up and yes - by Taronga Western Plains Zoo.
Absolutely agree that most exotic species have no real conservation value and that they are of primarily educational/display value. But if there is an opportunity to wean the region off subspecific hybrids in favour of more genetically valuable lines then why not? It's not to say lets euthanase all the hybrids, but slowly phase in the purebreds. And keep them separate! Most of the cross-breeding of late has been intentional due to a lack of availability, zoos not committing to species and TAGs which flipflop over direction. Australia's strict quarantine rules plays a part in the problem, but most of the issues stem from poor regional zoo management/direction, some of which goes back decades.
@tetrapod Again you have it in a nutshell.
A lot of the problems do lead back to poor management/direction which begs the question as to why it happens when our large zoos are reducing the number of species, Their job should get easier
.I agree bringing in pure genetic lines should and is happening with a number of our zoos working with the EEP. Zoo management need to lift its game and stop in many cases just using some animal species just as space fillers.
Some zoos are making the effort
@tetrapod Again you have it in a nutshell.
A lot of the problems do lead back to poor management/direction which begs the question as to why it happens when our large zoos are reducing the number of species, Their job should get easier
I agree bringing in pure genetic lines should and is happening with a number of our zoos working with the EEP. Zoo management need to lift its game and stop in many cases just using some animal species just as space fillers.
Some zoos are making the effort
The rampant phase outs are surely tied into this. Zoos that take the initiative to import (a significant outlay) are effectively punished in the long term for such initiative when the region gives up on the species - bearing in mind only a few such initiatives (Malayan sun bear) are enabling enough to recoup the import expenses over that time.
In turn, the lack of genetic value of these imports due to limited or no support from the regional breeding programme adds weight to the argument of why they should be phased out.
The obvious solution is to function as an extension of European or North American regional breeding programmes when we haven’t got the numbers to run our own regional breeding programme (like we do for Snow leopard); and grow out of this obsession management seems to have of bringing something new to the role (which in practice just undos the work of the previous management). Progress for the sake of progress must be discouraged.
Your quite right and since our region lacks the number of zoos such as the USA and Europe being part of the EEP and the SSP for a number of species would make a lot of sense.
With modern air travel it makes transporting just about any where fairly easy compared to the past.
On the other hand as @tetrapod has pointed out having poor management issues which are making bad judgment calls causes set backs for different species. While I know we have had some excellent Directors in the past and I have often mulled over the reason as to why things have gotten to where they are today the word amateurish often comes to mind.
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I guess it’s a double edged sword as import restrictions have replaced logistical restrictions and are even more problematic to navigate. Giraffes anyone? And we’re still breeding from a line of condors imported in the 70’s.
That said - for felids, primates, zebras etc. there’s no excuses. They can and should be imported as required. A thriving breeding programme for Grant’s zebra could easily be established - like it was decades ago with a handful of imports by Auckland Zoo.
A reoccurring theme seems to be the appointment of management with little to no knowledge of zoology. A recent example being the zoo board of Zoos Victoria.
As one past Director of one of our major zoos had told me in the past, We (Australia) are to far from the main game to count. But as you say there was no reason to phase out Onagers, they could of split the group into 2 or 3 herds around the country and brought in some new blood, but in the long run a lot of wasted effort, time and money to just put aside like an old lawn mower.
True importing Zebra ect could of been done much sooner by the major zoos instead of the smaller regional zoos picking up the bits.
Well with wokeness creeping into some parts as it is these days it appears to some they have to tick all the boxes regardless if they have no knowledge or back ground in animal matters, it appears to be all about appeasement
True importing Zebra ect could of been done much sooner by the major zoos instead of the smaller regional zoos picking up the bits.
Well with wokeness creeping into some parts as it is these days it appears to some they have to tick all the boxes regardless if they have no knowledge or back ground in animal matters, it appears to be all about appeasement
The condors arrived in 1949.
The problem is that joining EEP or SSP programs would be a one way street. Traditionally in programs the receiving zoo pays transport costs. Why would a European or American zoo want to pay to import an animal from Australia when they could get one from down the road? Unless animals are moving both ways there is no real participation in the program, and program managers will be reluctant to export genetically valuable animals.
While air transport certainly makes moving animals much easier, it is not cheap. I recently attempted to send a dog to France for in-laws. Even with our contacts it was going to cost over $5000. It ended up travelling in the cabin for free as my niece's "companion". (Don't ask). However the paperwork still cost me over $1,000, and then nobody looked at it after check-in.
Again I have to say I do not have a stake in any of this, only observe it from the sidelines. I think many of the comments made here have some validity, However I also believe things are more complex than some seem to think.
Taronga have Binturong again. Perth Zoo's annual report confirmed that two males have been transferred out to Sydney.
Annual report: https://perthzoo.wa.gov.au/PerthZoo... PDFs/Perth-Zoo-AR-2021-FINAL_INTERACTIVE.pdf
I appreciate your opinion @MRJ and like yourself I also have no stake in this I am also an observer.
I do see your point about the shipping costs and understand your view but if small private zoos can bear the cost of doing this I am sure our big government run zoos would not flinch to much, In fact when one sees the amount of money they do waste, the transport costs would be just pocket money to them.
I do have some understanding regarding costs involved and how complex it can be. I have imported and exported dogs (As dogs are my hobby) world wide for over 20 years also going through the process of importing/exporting frozen dog semen. While I do not consider myself an expert I do have some understanding how it works. Regarding costs yes they are massive but if a private citizen can foot these bills multiple times I am sure the large state run zoos can do the same. Since you mentioned prices, One cost of importing 2 dogs from Toronto to Perth (flight only) not including one months quarantine and the flight from Perth to Brisbane was almost $9000 and that was 21 years ago.
Thats a shame they don't, thanks heaps for finding out though