Auckland Zoo giraffes going to Australia

daveb said:
The issue of genetic diversity is the thing that dictates where you source breeding stock from. With giraffes in particular there is the additional issue of preventing hybridisation. The sub-region has a detailed breeding programme and stock is moved around in order to maximise this diversity whilst also maximising the purety of the species of giraffe each institution holds.
Click to expand...
As glyn says, most giraffes in Australasia are hybrids, the only pure herds being Rothschild’s at Orana and a couple of Australian zoos. Excess animals from these herds go into the hybrid groups at the other zoos (or into the bachelor herd at Keystone). Same situation with zebras, where all the zoos are going towards just maintaining hybrid herds, even Orana which was always making a big song and dance about its endangered Chapman’s zebras has introduced a Grant’s into their breeding stock.

jay said:
These two giraffes were born at Auckland from hybrid mothers and a genetically pure Rothschild father. The father came from Orana which keep a pure rothschild herd. The rothschilds at Perth also came from Orana, the four females are two sisters and the daughters of one. The father of one of the younger females at Perth is Anthony, who is now at Werribee. He is also the father of the breeding male at Melbourne zoo. So really all the rothschilds in the region have sprung from the Orana herd. Which I think only had four founders.
The breeding males at Monarto, Dubbo, Auckland and hopefully soon Wellington are all pure blood rothschilds descned from the Orana herd. Now that they are being integrated with the hybrid herd soon the zoos will once again face the problem of finding unrelated males as breeders.
Click to expand...
Orana has imported five Rothschild’s giraffes into NZ but only three of them were bred from. Jaffa and Celeste were the original pair brought in from Canada in 1982. A female called Mandy was imported from Melbourne in 1987 but I don’t know what happened to her subsequently and she didn’t breed while at Orana. All the young produced up to 1991 were between Jaffa and Celeste except for one female (Marama, December 1991) who was between Jaffa and his first-born daughter Sarita. Jaffa died in August 1991 and Finbarr (re-named Ed?) was brought in from Perth to replace him a couple of months later. Ed died in July 1992 without breeding. Zuri (re-named Harold) was imported from Chicago in March 1994 and has produced several young with Nathalie (Jaffa and Celeste’s second daughter) and with his own daughters.
 
Last edited:
Only three founders at Orana? That means that the entire Rothschilds herd in Aust/NZ is descended from just four founders. (Including the breeding female at Melbourne which came from Europe)
 
is it because of dieseases from other countries that might spread into our animals?
 
It seems the biosecurity authorities in both NZ and Aust are making up for an incredibly lacklustre performance in our early histories but disease is a huge reason, think Avian flu and mad cow disease, those types of scares can destroy whole industries...
 
I see, good thing they are taking such precautions, !! :)

Apparently Equine influenza can be traced back to when two Japanese horses, the winner and runner-up of the melbourne cup. Delta Blues and Pop Rock came to Australia. They think it's Japan's fault!!
 
jay said:
Only three founders at Orana? That means that the entire Rothschilds herd in Aust/NZ is descended from just four founders. (Including the breeding female at Melbourne which came from Europe)
Click to expand...
anyone know anything about the derivation of North American Rothschild's giraffes (number of founders)? Because Jaffa and Celeste were imported together from Canada I've always had a niggle that they could be related to each other (although perhaps not directly).
 
Chlidonias said:
anyone know anything about the derivation of North American Rothschild's giraffes (number of founders)? Because Jaffa and Celeste were imported together from Canada I've always had a niggle that they could be related to each other (although perhaps not directly).
Click to expand...

A little more than you think...Woburn imported 1.3 ret/roth mixed giraffes in 1968. From this stock, African Lion Safari (Rockton, Canada) imported 1.3 roth from Woburn. According to a recent studbook all four of these Rockton giraffes shared the same sire. Jaffa and Celeste were born from the Rockton herd, sharing the same father and being half-siblings (whose mothers are also share the same sire and as does the sire of Jaffa and Celeste). Are you confused yet?
 
Does this mean that they aren't pure Rothschilds after all? Not to mention terribly inbred.
 
they may be...its just that the studbook I use doesnt make a distinction between the Rothschilds and Reticulated subspecies because that's how they are managed in the US.
 
so would Zuri (now Harold) imported to NZ from Chicago in 1994 also be from that same stock, and therefore related to Jaffa and Celeste?
 
essentially, giraffes in australia and new zealand are a genetic basket case. the rothschild giraffes are probably worse off than the hybrids, with no new genes entering the program recently, and rothschild giraffes are worse off than bongo and a host of other species we often look at as being inbred to the maximum.
breeding hybrids is probably the best chance for this species in Australia
 
Chlidonias said:
so would Zuri (now Harold) imported to NZ from Chicago in 1994 also be from that same stock, and therefore related to Jaffa and Celeste?
Click to expand...

No there are other bloodlines in the US...I really havent fully comprehended the ancestry of US giraffes so ask any questions and I'll research it for you.

Zuri is descended, with some inbreeding, from 7 founders imported by Hemmingford, QB via Longleat (Uganda import) and San Diego (Kenya import). Zuri is unrelated to Jaffa and Celeste.
 
okapikpr said:
Woburn imported 1.3 ret/roth mixed giraffes in 1968. From this stock, African Lion Safari (Rockton, Canada) imported 1.3 roth from Woburn.
Click to expand...
okapikpr said:
they may be...its just that the studbook I use doesnt make a distinction between the Rothschilds and Reticulated subspecies because that's how they are managed in the US.
Click to expand...
does that mean that you don't know if the Woburn ones were reticulated AND Rothschild's? They could have been all Rothschild's but the US studbook doesn't say one way or the other? Or were Woburn's definitely of both subspecies?
 
Its odd, I have found some pure rothschild mentioned in the studbook, but all "rothschilds" in the US that I know of also have a ret/roth status under their entry...so as far as the data I have I dont know the subspeciation, but I do have the parentage, or at least what has been recorded as such.
 
I'd be really interested in knowing e parentage of the animals that created the Australian/nz herd. Would you be able to send me the details?
 
in one of my books it says that the Woburn animals were imported from Uganda which would imply they were all Rothschild's. I'll start a thread on the UK forum and see if any of the knowledgeable people on there know for sure. (I sort of suspect that in the US studbook they just put "ret/roth" for any giraffes they aren't 100% sure of the parentage of). However if they were in fact hybrids then that would mean that the only pure Rothschild's to have come into Australasia would be Zuri / Harold (if he is pure-bred) and probably the one imported to Melbourne.
 
@Jay, I know some of Auckland's haerd came from Chester Zoo in the 60's and 70's...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top