Are you sure that all the big cats went to Spain? I thought that Martin Lacey bought and received the grown-on Lion cubs from Glasgow upon the zoo's closure?
Glasgow Zoo (Closed) Glasgow zoo
- Thread starter robertwestby
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bigcat speciali
Well-Known Member
No...Martin acted as delivery/haulage and transportation person. As the lion cubs - 13 months old (x2), were owned by Roger C.(Chipperfields) and having put the two cubs in the cages of the lorry myself. Then no he did not.
Never disputed that you put the cubs into Martin's Lorry but I'm almost certain that the two lions stayed with him and did not leave the country.
bigcat speciali
Well-Known Member
We loaded the two cubs along with the parents (cleo and leo!) into the cages and onto the lorry, I then signed the documentation for travel to Spain, the various Travel Certificates and of course we inoculated them for their travels. After speaking to Roger Cawley some three days later who said they arrived all safe and well. Now....unless Martin Lacy "took" the cubs after they left us at Glasgow I can not say and have no knowledge of however, I do know that I signed as did Lutz or Curator did, we both signed travel permits and certificates and entry into Spain and we know from Customs that the lions were at the port ready for shipment onto Spain, thereafter Roger C. telephoned to say all was fine and they had arrived.
Do you know how the lions are? have they bred?
Did Glasgow ever hold any other leopard species other then African? and were the Leopards housed in the small cat house or in another section? and for the breeding of Lions did you only have one pair/group at a time or several?
Any info would be great
Thanks
Did Glasgow ever hold any other leopard species other then African? and were the Leopards housed in the small cat house or in another section? and for the breeding of Lions did you only have one pair/group at a time or several?
Any info would be great
Thanks
Fine. Then certain facts, whether you are aware of them or not, do not add up.
This thread has already gone off at an alarming tangent so I'm drawing a line under my participation in it.
This thread has already gone off at an alarming tangent so I'm drawing a line under my participation in it.
bigcat speciali
Well-Known Member
No..sorry, I do not know how the lions or the tigers are doing as of now. We had leopard's, jag's and most of cats known, kept in the small cat house. Lions etc, we kept usually a pair but in the past, there were more. Graham Law would be more able to inform you more on the such... But as for the Martin Lacy issue. Having physically put those lions in the lorry and signed the paperwork and Spanish Certification for all four lions, as far as I am aware they all ended up in Spain, back with Roger C. - their owner.
bigcat speciali
Well-Known Member
Can I ask WHY do they not add up? I know that when I signed the paperwork for all the travel and entry for Spain permits, and Roger C. confirmed that they arrived. Then what facts differ...? Because if Martin did take them (bought or otherwise) then that would be a tad unlawful, given that I signed the paperwork...
bigcat speciali
Well-Known Member
I can confirm that the lions went to Roger C. in Spain as I still have a copy of the travel, vet cert, and customs paperwork. There were four of us that day that put the lions into the lorry. However, due to the farce of the vet with her usage of standard size domstic cat inoculations - the lorry left at 17.50pm that day. The four being myself, David Webster, Lut Kuschinski, Billy Linton and the vet. While hovering over our shoulder we had the Chief Inspector of the SSPCA. What happened after that, after the lorry left Glasgow and onto the ferry port is not for me to guess or second guess however, after having Roger Cawaley contact us a few days later informing us of their safe arrival then I can not argue against that.. so the matter is closed.
ontariozoo
Member
Regarding a few of the Glasgow questions from the thread, RANGER was the african lion with the black patch on his inside leg, despite many matings no cubs were born to him so he was according to the then staff infertile.
After his death and his lioness KATIE, the Chipperfield cats were resident.. with mixed {breeding} sucess.
I vauguely remeber other cat species,In the early days most of the small cats did not breed- which was not the case later on when specialisation of the S american cats took over. there were leopard cats in the tropical house, near the old rhino iguana case- this is late 70's early 80's period, I think yes there was a golden cat, margays for sure , jungle cat?, jaguar,did I see an oncilla there????? and breifly in this time young but almost full grown tigers kept in the inside Pigmy goat house den!!!!!! way down the zoo where the cereopcis were later!!!!!!!presumably en route somewhere.
This was Long before the Adimula tiger den which was built to house siberian/indian tigers rescued from euthanasia at Cromers closure- too old to breed .
After their demise it was used for Chipperfield cats, mixed bengal /siberian cats inc a white, the tabby BUTO, some reject circus, ha ha ha ! or too car happy safari cats!.............
The big cats, leopards puma jags, then ultimatley the cloudies were housed in the "large" dens on the s? side of the cat house, the small cats and once upon time binturongs and civets too on the N side in the smaller pens.
The leopards were african asian mixes,the last jag was a spotty I dont remeber a black jag there.With the advent of Graham Law the cat house was transformed origionally it was terrible, concrete slab floor, A [ single] log leading onto the back shelf, but though size wasnt improved all the bark mulch, branching planting etc did make it much better.
Smaller than Edinburghs enclosures for similar animals but at the time probably more stimulating!
One species lacking was that Glasgow never had the chance to keep snow leopards.In this 70's period I remember a lot of other weird animals at the zoo, dingo, coyote?,przewalski,cassowary, the fake spanish fighting cattle - dexters to keep the local yobs out!, humbolt penguins, white pelicans, indian giant squirrels,grants zebra, nile crocodile- very small ones! and of course Kirsty the Asian elephant.
It was a poor zoo, that tried,did some good work with carnivores and reps in particular,and was saved last minute several times. it could have been survived and done well but sadly extinction was inevitable under its then form.
Happily it will live on with regards to its felid work, documented in kournals and now much expanded on, which is a positive, so many other zoos just vanished without trace!
Good old Glasgow- CALDERPARK ZOO!
After his death and his lioness KATIE, the Chipperfield cats were resident.. with mixed {breeding} sucess.
I vauguely remeber other cat species,In the early days most of the small cats did not breed- which was not the case later on when specialisation of the S american cats took over. there were leopard cats in the tropical house, near the old rhino iguana case- this is late 70's early 80's period, I think yes there was a golden cat, margays for sure , jungle cat?, jaguar,did I see an oncilla there????? and breifly in this time young but almost full grown tigers kept in the inside Pigmy goat house den!!!!!! way down the zoo where the cereopcis were later!!!!!!!presumably en route somewhere.
This was Long before the Adimula tiger den which was built to house siberian/indian tigers rescued from euthanasia at Cromers closure- too old to breed .
After their demise it was used for Chipperfield cats, mixed bengal /siberian cats inc a white, the tabby BUTO, some reject circus, ha ha ha ! or too car happy safari cats!.............
The big cats, leopards puma jags, then ultimatley the cloudies were housed in the "large" dens on the s? side of the cat house, the small cats and once upon time binturongs and civets too on the N side in the smaller pens.
The leopards were african asian mixes,the last jag was a spotty I dont remeber a black jag there.With the advent of Graham Law the cat house was transformed origionally it was terrible, concrete slab floor, A [ single] log leading onto the back shelf, but though size wasnt improved all the bark mulch, branching planting etc did make it much better.
Smaller than Edinburghs enclosures for similar animals but at the time probably more stimulating!
One species lacking was that Glasgow never had the chance to keep snow leopards.In this 70's period I remember a lot of other weird animals at the zoo, dingo, coyote?,przewalski,cassowary, the fake spanish fighting cattle - dexters to keep the local yobs out!, humbolt penguins, white pelicans, indian giant squirrels,grants zebra, nile crocodile- very small ones! and of course Kirsty the Asian elephant.
It was a poor zoo, that tried,did some good work with carnivores and reps in particular,and was saved last minute several times. it could have been survived and done well but sadly extinction was inevitable under its then form.
Happily it will live on with regards to its felid work, documented in kournals and now much expanded on, which is a positive, so many other zoos just vanished without trace!
Good old Glasgow- CALDERPARK ZOO!
bigcat speciali
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the great piece of writing,and for letting the rest know that the zoo had a lot to offer but sadly not the best managed zoo. We made many new areas regarding the welfare and husbandry of both felids and reptiles, and can still be read in many journals. Graham made new advances as did myself and some other staff, but when the zoo closed we also lost a great person. That being the curator Lutz Kuschinski....sadly missed and a great man with a head full of knoweldge.
Cheers for sharing your comments, and I can confirm that they are correct.
Regards...
Cheers for sharing your comments, and I can confirm that they are correct.
Regards...
bigcat speciali
Well-Known Member
That may depend on the list and year? If you wish a list for the zoo from when it closed going back some five years, most likely. But before that, there are no real full lists as such. Sadly when the zoo closed, the zoo committee come management or as they like to call themselves - the zoological committee !! These people left the paperwork at their feet, for the vandles and for riff-raff to destroy and burn, litter and grafetti on. Some paperwork was saved however, as for the my own section. That was saved and full records exist...
Regards.
what they kept all the time they were open
you want a list of animals kept from 1947 to 2003? That's a span of 56 years!
sos mate, was there any species uniqe to the park
The Penguin Guide to British Zoos (1970) lists the first animals at Glasgow were 1.1 lions and 6 wallabies from London and 2 lions from Dublin.
In 1970 animals kept there include ring-tailed lemurs, chinchillas and toucans.
In 1977 species at Glasgow included white rhinoceros, cheetah, Grant's zebra, Pere David's deer, black leopard, jaguar, lar gibbon, ring-tailed lemur, rhinoceros iguana, blue-tongued skink, beaded lizard, potoroo, fruit bat, leopard cat, polar bear, great indian hornbill, common cassowary. binturong, white-throated capuchin and Bactrian camel.
I believe Glasgow was the first UK collection to breed Geoffroy's Cat about 1982.
In 1970 animals kept there include ring-tailed lemurs, chinchillas and toucans.
In 1977 species at Glasgow included white rhinoceros, cheetah, Grant's zebra, Pere David's deer, black leopard, jaguar, lar gibbon, ring-tailed lemur, rhinoceros iguana, blue-tongued skink, beaded lizard, potoroo, fruit bat, leopard cat, polar bear, great indian hornbill, common cassowary. binturong, white-throated capuchin and Bactrian camel.
I believe Glasgow was the first UK collection to breed Geoffroy's Cat about 1982.