Bronx Zoo Happy the elephant 'unlawfully imprisoned' lawsuit claims

Going into court and telling the majority that their decision is "arbitrary and irrational" is not calculated to win a motion for re-argument. The result is highly predictable given that such motions are very, very rarely granted and that the majority was highly critical of the dissent. This is a futile, quixotic effort. Worry ye not.
 
TinoPup said:
This has been covered several times in here, if you use the search function (you've even posted in one of them). In short, Happy enjoys being alone. Just like some people prefer to be, even though we're a social species, too. There are very few legit sanctuaries, and those that exist are not equipped to handle an animal who needs to be kept in a yard by herself. The zoo staff know her and her likes, quirks, and health. They are most capable of caring for her.
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How do we know she wants to be alone? I know she doesn't get along with Patty, the other elephant there. And they have a fence between them but can see each other. Why is Patty alone? If elephants are so social, is it possible each could find another companion they COULD get along with?
 
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Reenie Mastrella said:
How do we know she wants to be alone? I know she doesn't get along with Patty, the other elephant there. And they have a fence between them but can see each other. Why is Patty alone? If elephants are so social, is it possible each could find another companion they COULD get along with?
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Unfortunately, elephants can be pretty finicky when it comes to companionship - each elephant has a different personality, and introducing Happy or Patty to another elephant can be pretty risky especially given their ages. Bronx has also been pretty adamant that Patty and Happy would be their last elephants (as much as I am hopeful about the line "we'll never keep elephants *this way* again" from The Zoo.) From what I've heard, the fence has actually helped keep the peace between Patty and Happy, and they've even touched trunks a couple times.

Jim Breheny's tweet thread is well worth a read:
https://twitter.com/JimBreheny/status/1462243042916720647?t=Ybn0KD6uTon4iI8VGPpVtQ&s=19
 
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Reenie Mastrella said:
How do we know she wants to be alone? I know she doesn't get along with Patty, the other elephant there. And they have a fence between them but can see each other. Why is Patty alone? If elephants are so social, is it possible each could find another companion they COULD get along with?
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I encourage you to do some research into the history of these elephants at the zoo and the other elephants that have already passed. Even a little bit of research on just Wikipedia would answer a lot of your questions.

~Thylo
 
What has been covered a lot is the lawsuit, not my question. I did search several times and only saw posts about the lawsuit.

If Happy doesn't get along with Patty, has anyone seen if she can get along with another elephant? What about Patty? Why is she alone?

I'm looking to be persuaded that either is happy being alone.
 
Reenie Mastrella said:
What has been covered a lot is the lawsuit, not my question. I did search several times and only saw posts about the lawsuit.

If Happy doesn't get along with Patty, has anyone seen if she can get along with another elephant? What about Patty? Why is she alone?

I'm looking to be persuaded that either is happy being alone.
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Nor is that the question I offered you the ability to answer for yourself.

There's plenty of information available on these elephants. They may get drowned out a bit with the rapid flurry of lawsuits that have been launched against the zoo on the subject, but they are there.

You'll find a fair amount of general information on the zoo's elephants and their respective histories here: Bronx Zoo - Wikipedia

From there you can peruse the sources cited and figure out what additional questions need searching for. I concur with @StoppableSan that reading Jim Breheny's twitter thread is useful as well for answering some of your questions.

~Thylo
 
StoppableSan said:
From what I've heard, the fence has actually helped keep the peace between Patty and Happy, and they've even touched trunks a couple times.
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This is correct. The Zoo season 5 episode 7 features a segment on Happy and Patty, where they discuss Happy and Patty's limited introductions (where they can interact with each other through the fence). At first, Happy is terrified of being in a yard next to Patty's, but eventually Happy realizes that the barrier prevents Patty from hurting her. The elephants become more comfortable around each other over the course of the episode, and by the end we can see Happy and Patty holding trunks on multiple occasions.
 
I just saw this thread and have been following the Happy situation for a few years now.

i do hope the Bronx zoo will consider keeping adolescent bull elephants when the older ladies phase out. They do have quality (not new) facilities that could be adapted for that purpose. Their staff is already knowledgeable about PC and they have shift chutes already. They would have room for three bulls and it would excite visitors to see young bulls interacting with each other.
 
ZCChip said:
I just saw this thread and have been following the Happy situation for a few years now.

i do hope the Bronx zoo will consider keeping adolescent bull elephants when the older ladies phase out. They do have quality (not new) facilities that could be adapted for that purpose. Their staff is already knowledgeable about PC and they have shift chutes already. They would have room for three bulls and it would excite visitors to see young bulls interacting with each other.
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As hopeful as I am for this to happen myself, Bronx has been pretty adamant about Happy and Patty being their last elephants. Maybe it's that hope that is leading to me reading into them saying on The Zoo "we'll never keep elephants *this way* again", and I've resigned that hope to grow slimmer and slimmer with the inevitable passage of time. I would love, more than anything, to be wrong about Happy and Patty being the last elephants at the zoo.
 
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