Have You Met People Who Disliked or Opposed Zoos?

Good evening. My opinion comes from a Latin American standpoint.

I know quite a few people who have a strong distaste for zoos, and I can't blame them. Have animal husbandy and exhibit quality improved over the last few decades? Maybe, but Brazilian zoos still have a long way ahead to become anything similar to First World parks.

How will I be able to defend the concept of captivity when even major zoos in my country keep large gregarious animals by themselves in awful exhibits? Unfortunately, these absurds are still commonplace in the Third World, hence why the anti-zoo sentiment is extremely strong in places like LatAm.

As for politics, people from all sides can be anti-zoo, but left-wingers take the most action against these kinds of places. Neoliberals, however, also help worsen the mess because they promote budget cuts, leaving state-owned zoos (most zoos in Brazil are owned by city prefectures) penniless.
 
I think some people can be anti zoo based on their personal experiences, like seeing antiquated smaller cages grottos or pens with a concrete floor surrounded by beige concrete walls as one example. What indubitaly can also leave a bad taste in some people's mouths is the repetitive purposeless behaviors that captive wildlife can form such as head bobbing and swaying and pacing back and forth found most commonly in big cats bears and elephants as a coping mechanism over the stress and trauma with being confined. These behaviors seemingly used to be seen very frequently in zoos I believe. With amazing enclosures that have been built to prevent these over the past 3 decades or so, I have seen less and less stereotyping in these animals- I have seen most zoo elephants be very happy and do pachyderm behaviors found in the wild such as mud wallowing throwing mud and dust on themselves and even play fighting, and most big cats and bears in zoos are just chill and bask on rocks or the natural substrate etc. But if you don't understand zoos well enough to realize that, then I can see why sights like that can trigger a lingering bad generalization.
 
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In Europe, something like 80-95% of people support zoos, so not often.

Most zoo critics I met, including people working in conservation / ecologists, are quite old. They know zoos from the 70s and 80s, which were indeed usually bare, and never corrected their belief.

It is still sad, when a supposed expert or a PhD declines a proposal to breed endangered species in zoos, and quotes a general publication that breeding X in zoos is difficult ...30 or 50 years ago.

There are supposedly some anti-zoo activists from the 'animal rights' movement, but they are extremely few people, quite in contrast to how much noise thy make. There are also some people who like animals in general and sceptical of zoos, but they are very easily turned into zoo supporters. Basically tell them examples how much zoos care about their animals, and how zoo keepers are committed to care of their animals, and they start liking zoos. If such people get a contact with zoo animals, e.g. work at a zoo farm, they become lifetime zoo supporters.
 
JigerofLemuria said:
I live in Barcelona... it likely isn't a surprise to people that know me, but I swear, around 85% of people I meet either have misgivings about zoos, or are outright against them. I've managed to convince quite a lot of people of the good accredited institutions do for conservation, but some are downright adamant in their fervent disdain for them. Also, for some reason, I swear EVERY Argentinian I've met are in the latter camp! I mean, lovely people, but in my experience they ESPECIALLY hate zoos and want them all shut down.
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Argentina is the case where socially progressive country meets Latin American standards of animal husbandry and exhibit quality. That's why the anti-zoo movement is so strong Buenos Aires no longer has a major zoo.
 
My mum's friend's daughter hates zoos. She thinks animals would be better off in the wild. As a teenager she kept a gerbil in a steel cage with sawdust to cover the floor and a wheel for exercise. Yet a gerbil in a zoo enclosure kept on soil or sand with the opportunity to dig and interact with other gerbils is cruel according to her.

Many people I know who are not zoo enthusiasts have no opinion either way.
 
bongorob said:
My mum's friend's daughter hates zoos. She thinks animals would be better off in the wild. As a teenager she kept a gerbil in a steel cage with sawdust to cover the floor and a wheel for exercise. Yet a gerbil in a zoo enclosure kept on soil or sand with the opportunity to dig and interact with other gerbils is cruel according to her.
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That says it all. No offence to whoever this is, but IGNORANCE is the biggest reason behind any radicalist stance.
In fact, when I was living in Ibiza, I heard from several people that some guy, whom I sometimes saw at a bar with a lovebird, literally STOLE a parrot from Loro Parque because "it looked sad" and thought HE could do better.
It may be a false story he made up to appear cool, but... This seriously, SERIOUSLY marks another tick on my looooong list of things I hate about human beings. The sheer ignorance and selfishness of that act is CRIMINAL, even if he didn't actually carry it out.
 
I haven't personally talked to anyone who is vehemently anti-zoo, but I have talked to people who are skeptical of them. To be honest, I try to avoid confrontation and just listen to their points and move on. I may throw in a point about their role in conservation, or half jokingly point out that zoo animals live much easier and more peaceful lives than their wild counterparts, but I leave it at that. I have overheard people at zoos complaining about how terrible they think the animals lives must be having to live in a cage, or just saying that they hate zoos and that the animals look sad because they're lying down, but I just don't engage. I did recently have someone talk to me at the Saint Louis Zoo because she was upset that the young adult male Amur tiger was separated from his mom and sister, and I couldn't seem to get her to understand that tigers are solitary animals and that him being separated matches the natural behavior of his species. I find that the concept of solitary animals is difficult for some zoo guests to understand. I hear a lot of comments about how sad it is that solitary species are kept alone, people assume they are lonely. Like I appreciate that they emphasize with and care about the animals, but I promise the jaguar doesn't want a friend.
 
A fact people with these sentiments need to be educated on is some AZA zoos are opting out of housing large mammals like elephants great apes seals and hippos bc of more rigorous care standards now in place and some facilities do not have the physical space or funding for an appropriately sized habitat along with proper social groupings. All zoos by all means do not have every species, and there will always be a reason for it.
 
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Yes, I have on a few rare occasions seen people in zoos (or in some extremely rare cases outside of them) make raging comments about zoos being dumb which I just ignore, but less raging comments I will ask some of their opinions on why and listen to what they say.

For very mean terrorist-sounding comments I overhear, such as "This is the worst place to ever exist!", "This ___ pen is literally HELL for them right now!" or "Why the f*** do people force these animals to serve as slaves on the other side of the world?", are accusations go a bit too far for me and I always makesure leave myself out of it.
For less harsh comments I hear from zoo visitors, for example, "Aww, he looks lonely I feel kind of bad for him" (in this case for when it is a species who generally lives solitary or their exhibit mate(s) like hiding) or "Oh no, it/they looks kinda sad," I will usually briefly explain the point of zoos to them a little bit or tell them that about animal behavior and well-being. While I won't give them a lecture on it, I will respond by giving them a simple explanation on the many benefits of zoos in general and I will describe a few of the good exhibits in the zoo, as well as tell them that zoos don't have animals to attract visitors to see them, but rather to spread around the world that conservation, breeding, and making sure the environment of animals is safe wherever they live are the real goals of zoos.
I do know many people who have some minor cons on zoos, but have luckily come across very few raging comments on zoos.
 
Nile Hippo Expert said:
Yes, I have on a few rare occasions seen people in zoos (or in some extremely rare cases outside of them) make raging comments about zoos being dumb which I just ignore, but less raging comments I will ask some of their opinions on why and listen to what they say.

For very mean terrorist-sounding comments I overhear, such as "This is the worst place to ever exist!", "This ___ pen is literally HELL for them right now!" or "Why the f*** do people force these animals to serve as slaves on the other side of the world?", are accusations go a bit too far for me and I always makesure leave myself out of it.
For less harsh comments I hear from zoo visitors, for example, "Aww, he looks lonely I feel kind of bad for him" (in this case for when it is a species who generally lives solitary or their exhibit mate(s) like hiding) or "Oh no, it/they looks kinda sad," I will usually briefly explain the point of zoos to them a little bit or tell them that about animal behavior and well-being. While I won't give them a lecture on it, I will respond by giving them a simple explanation on the many benefits of zoos in general and I will describe a few of the good exhibits in the zoo, as well as tell them that zoos don't have animals to attract visitors to see them, but rather to spread around the world that conservation, breeding, and making sure the environment of animals is safe wherever they live are the real goals of zoos.
I do know many people who have some minor cons on zoos, but have luckily come across very few raging comments on zoos.
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Have some of these people specifically told you the "Zoos make me sad" sentiments that I have experienced from a few people as mentioned earlier? Are any of the people with 'minor cons' over zoos friends of yours?
 
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The Horse Boy said:
Have some of these people specifically told you the "Zoos make me sad" sentiments that I have experienced from a few people as mentioned earlier?
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Yes, but I avoid any further conversation with them. It makes me sad, but it's their opinions, not mine.
The Horse Boy said:
Are any of the people with 'minor cons' over zoos friends of yours?
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Yes, though I will say I do have many more friends who seem to be more in favor of liking zoos than not.
 
Nile Hippo Expert said:
Yes, but I avoid any further conversation with them. It makes me sad, but it's their opinions, not mine.
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What makes me 'sad' to hear that is that it can be about the quality AZA facilities which do not mistreat their animals and prioritize in their all being and use enrichment programs to keep them robust and preservation and education initiatives. I always interpreted it as them saying they feel that way about every single zoo they know, making it an unfair generalization.
 
Nile Hippo Expert said:
Yes, though I will say I do have many more friends who seem to be more in favor of liking zoos than not.
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I feel that I'm on the same boat friend. Most of the people I have experienced to makes negative comments on zoos was short lived and there was a high change I would not get involved with them much in the future. Much of my friends and fam have positive things to say on accredited zoos like San Diego.
 
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Nile Hippo Expert said:
Yes, I have on a few rare occasions seen people in zoos (or in some extremely rare cases outside of them) make raging comments about zoos being dumb which I just ignore, but less raging comments I will ask some of their opinions on why and listen to what they say.

For very mean terrorist-sounding comments I overhear, such as "This is the worst place to ever exist!", "This ___ pen is literally HELL for them right now!" or "Why the f*** do people force these animals to serve as slaves on the other side of the world?", are accusations go a bit too far for me and I always makesure leave myself out of it.
For less harsh comments I hear from zoo visitors, for example, "Aww, he looks lonely I feel kind of bad for him" (in this case for when it is a species who generally lives solitary or their exhibit mate(s) like hiding) or "Oh no, it/they looks kinda sad," I will usually briefly explain the point of zoos to them a little bit or tell them that about animal behavior and well-being. While I won't give them a lecture on it, I will respond by giving them a simple explanation on the many benefits of zoos in general and I will describe a few of the good exhibits in the zoo, as well as tell them that zoos don't have animals to attract visitors to see them, but rather to spread around the world that conservation, breeding, and making sure the environment of animals is safe wherever they live are the real goals of zoos.
I do know many people who have some minor cons on zoos, but have luckily come across very few raging comments on zoos.
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It’s a very strange use of the term ‘terrorism’ to describe someone expressing opinions on a zoo, however objectionable you might find those opinions.

Though I do appreciate that it may speak more to your lack of experience with the realities of terrorism in the real world, it’s odd to see words like that thrown around so casually.
 
I had a recent account with a female visitor of WdG who claimed to be against zoos. It was kinda fun to discuss and dismantle the arguments she brought to the table, most of them being the usual Robert Lehmann half-truths, propaganda or even lies. In the end, we parted in a friendly was, with her truly enjoying WdG.
 
My parent has a negative perception of Marine Mammal parks because of Parks like Seaworld, and the whole Depressed Orca fin in captivity ordeal.
My sibling also believes that Zoos don't properly cater to the needs of social pack animals like Elephants
 
Cuban-Floridian said:
My sibling also believes that Zoos don't properly cater to the needs of social pack animals like Elephants
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I imag your sibling's opinion comes from seeing how elephants used to be housed alone or with several unrelated individuals which is what used to be done far too frequently.
 
A few months ago, my boyfriend was manager of a shop, and they all have this little sign with a bit of introduction about the manager and some pictures. The text said he loves animals, visiting zoo's and in particular lions, with a picture of him feeding a lion at Dudley zoo.

One day, he was off, but had to go to the shop and pick something up, and according to his colleague covering for him, this had just happened 20 minutes before we showed up.

A costumer was complaining to the colleague about the sign. The costumer was going of at him even though he could see from the picture, it wasn't my boyfriend, how awful this is, and how you can't keep this animal for your own pleasure.
The guy is like "Well, that ain't me on there, I'm covering his day off, and you think I have a lion in my backyard or what?" (that's what the costumer sounded like he was saying that he owned it??)
The costumer then goes on with "This is wrong, this is awful, this is animal abuse, I am going to call head office and put in a complaint about the manager of this shop!"

Good luck mate ... Head office don't care + head office made that sign.
 
Just this morning and last Thursday, I was volunteering with an elder woman at a local state park and when i was getting to know her, I gradually introduced a conversation of my love for accredited zoos alongside our knowledge of the local flora and wildlife. She accepts their conservation and education value and how much they have overall progressed, but still finds it sad compared animals's ability to roam wherever they like in the wild and insists they're better off there, wherever they originated, in spite of my knowledge of the pros and passion for them. It's kind of cryptic to me as she seems to have been to them fairly often in her lifetime, appreciates some of their advantages and thankfully does not want them eliminated. Over the past couple of years I have started to fear that zoos are starting to become less and less popular in the future, especially in America, and they will all shut down. Call that Zoo-mageddon :D
 
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