Why am I reading this thread and thinking of the Simpsons episode where Ned Flanders needs to fill the ark. "two of every animal, both male, as we dont want any of that hanky panky".
Homosexuality In zoos
- Thread starter foz
- Start date
I must admit that I lost any interest in this voluminous thread after the first day or so.
Now, with Baldur's gloomy forecast of another 90 - 100 posts yet to come to cover the lesbian side of things [and we haven't even started on trans-gender critters yet] may I ask that someone actually defines lesbianism in animals before you all get started?
For example, are cow elephants that fondle each other's breasts with their trunks actually lesbians?
But, if they don't worry about the breasts but fondle each other's ears [or inside each other's mouths] are they lesbians?
Now, with Baldur's gloomy forecast of another 90 - 100 posts yet to come to cover the lesbian side of things [and we haven't even started on trans-gender critters yet] may I ask that someone actually defines lesbianism in animals before you all get started?
For example, are cow elephants that fondle each other's breasts with their trunks actually lesbians?
But, if they don't worry about the breasts but fondle each other's ears [or inside each other's mouths] are they lesbians?
sooty mangabey
Well-Known Member
Hmmm. I'm not sure there is any evidence to support this claim. What about bonobos, amongst whom female-on-female genital rubbing and oral sex is well known? And although I've not seen anything, I'd be surprised if there wasn't something along these lines amongst hyenas...
KCZooFan
Well-Known Member
You're right. This is purly speculation.
RowanGreen
Well-Known Member
I think bonobos basically don't care who they do it with.
Female cows are known to frequently mount each other.
It seems most of the cases of gay male animals mentioned are more about pair bonds than sex? If so maybe that's what we should be looking for in lesbian animals? Are any female animals that raise young jointly lesbian? If so there'd be quite a few!
Female cows are known to frequently mount each other.
It seems most of the cases of gay male animals mentioned are more about pair bonds than sex? If so maybe that's what we should be looking for in lesbian animals? Are any female animals that raise young jointly lesbian? If so there'd be quite a few!
Can we add (I think) Mourning Day Gecko for Lesbian animals, there are no males of the species and the females mate with each other before they can lay fertile eggs.
Are you talking aboput a parthenogenetic species? Females don't mate with each other - they give birth when the conditions are right for breeding. Saying they are 'lesbian' is just silly.
Hix
Are you talking aboput a parthenogenetic species? Females don't mate with each other - they give birth when the conditions are right for breeding. Saying they are 'lesbian' is just silly.
Hix
I don't think so, I've actually heard that this particular species (I could have the wrong species, but it's definately a gecko), requires actual sexual behaviour with another of its species beforehand - whether this is a different form of parthogenesis that requires a 'kick start' or something different altogether I don't know - it's just something I've heard. Will do some digging to see if I can find out more
A famous case of female homosexual pairing in gulls, as reported in that respected scientific journal, er, Time Magazine...
The Sexes: Lesbian Gulls - TIME
(fair play, they do have this article in normal online article format despite it apparently being over three decades old...)
(as a further aside, however we interpret animal homosexual behaviour, 'gay' and 'lesbian' are most definitely human social concepts, to my mind)
The Sexes: Lesbian Gulls - TIME
(fair play, they do have this article in normal online article format despite it apparently being over three decades old...)
(as a further aside, however we interpret animal homosexual behaviour, 'gay' and 'lesbian' are most definitely human social concepts, to my mind)
I agree with you, but i just thought it easier to decsribe the behaviour in thsi way (how else do we describe it...particularly as we still havee no clear definition). A very interesting article by the way.
Thnak you and to everyone else
I agree with you, but i just thought it easier to decsribe the behaviour in thsi way (how else do we describe it...particularly as we still havee no clear definition). A very interesting article by the way.
Thnak you and to everyone else
No worries
I'd have liked to have given a slightly more scholarly reference, but the book it's in is not with me at the moment.
I don't think so, I've actually heard that this particular species (I could have the wrong species, but it's definately a gecko), requires actual sexual behaviour with another of its species beforehand - whether this is a different form of parthogenesis that requires a 'kick start' or something different altogether I don't know - it's just something I've heard. Will do some digging to see if I can find out more
Bynoe's gecko is an Australian species that is parthenogenetic and although they can quite happily rep[roduce without a male, they do mate with males and breed in the normal way if given the opportunity. But when density is low and there is only a slight chance of encountering a male, females will produce young without any mating necessary. The offspring are clones, genetically identical to the female (and obviously all female themselves).
My understanding was that all parthenogenetic geckos had similar breeding systems, but if you have evidence of a different system I'd be interested to read about it.
Hix
Good call!
Can't believe I forgot Google Scholar - practically lived on that website at Uni.
Jesse
Well-Known Member
Bynoe's gecko is an Australian species that is parthenogenetic and although they can quite happily rep[roduce without a male, they do mate with males and breed in the normal way if given the opportunity. But when density is low and there is only a slight chance of encountering a male, females will produce young without any mating necessary. The offspring are clones, genetically identical to the female (and obviously all female themselves).
My understanding was that all parthenogenetic geckos had similar breeding systems, but if you have evidence of a different system I'd be interested to read about it.
Hix
The same applies to some species of stick insect.
Bynoe's gecko is an Australian species that is parthenogenetic and although they can quite happily rep[roduce without a male, they do mate with males and breed in the normal way if given the opportunity. But when density is low and there is only a slight chance of encountering a male, females will produce young without any mating necessary. The offspring are clones, genetically identical to the female (and obviously all female themselves).
My understanding was that all parthenogenetic geckos had similar breeding systems, but if you have evidence of a different system I'd be interested to read about it.
Hix
I heard it from somebody as opposed to somewhere, so next time I see them I shall ask if they have a reference
. A quick google for 'lesbian gecko' didn't come up with anything, so I could have gotten something mixed up I heard it from somebody as opposed to somewhere, so next time I see them I shall ask if they have a reference
On the train this morning i was reading the metro and they had a small piece on lesbian lizards..not that i can remember the species
woopsSexual Nature: Let your animal instincts guide you for Valentine's Day | Metro.co.uk
it was attatched to this articlee but i cat seem to find the insert.