IDA's Worst Zoos for elephants...

[redpanda]

Let's not applaud any zoo for sending their elephants to these "sanctuaries"! If they don't have the proper facilities for elephants, then they should send their pachyderms to another zoo! But don't give in to these zoo-hating organizations, IDA and PETA!

Let's do what's best for the animals! If it is a drastic improvement of the elephant's welfare, then the sanctuary should be considered whether affiliated with those we don't like or not. Sometimes, elephants cannot be integrated with herds at other zoos and need somewhere with lots of space where they can live in peace. No, we shouldn't constantly accept what PETA and IDA are doing, but at the same time let us not allow our pig-headedness to stop us from doing the best that we can by our animals.

EDIT: Completely agree with snowleopard.

 

[Dan]

Good posts, reduakari, snowleopard and redpanda.

Also, I´d still like to know what is wrong with the sanctuaries...

 

[snowleopard]

I love to see elephants in zoos, provided that the animals have huge, impressive exhibits that are packed with enrichment for such intelligent animals. The sanctuaries (such as the 3 operated by PAWS and the massive one in Tennessee) offer on average between 100-400 acre enclosures for their retired zoo and circus elephants. Some of the paddocks have enormous lakes that are several acres in size! The major complaint that many people have is that the elephants at the sanctuaries are not for breeding, but in reality most of the elephants arriving at the sanctuaries have led rough lives and are often past the age for breeding.

Zoos such as Fort Worth, Brookfield, etc, should either spend millions to build huge elephant exhibits, or else send their pachyderms away to other zoos or sanctuaries.

 

[loxodonta]

First off, I agree Bronx does not hold the same weight if they lose their elephants.

My problem with elephant "sanctuaries" is not only that they take away from the captive gene pool if they are old enough to breed, but also they have an anthropomorfic mind set when taking care of them. One of these "sanctuaries" wouldn't euthanize one of their ele's after it went down and didn't get up for days. Remember, they are animals and not people. The idea of "retiring" them does not benefit the ele. It would be healthier for the animal to be "working". It keeps them in shape and they have longer lives (circus and working animals easily get into their 50's+ because of this reason). I also don't like sanctuaries because they are private and do not provide people the opportunity to see and appreciate these animals. Nothing grabs a persons attention and makes them care about a species like showing them a 6 ton male or letting them interact with a 53 year old female. Trust me, I see it every week. How are you going to get people to invest time and energy to conserving ele's if you don't even see them? I could go on and on but I digress.

Sadly, if you look at the rate in which elephants in Asia and African are being killed and encroached on we are looking at complete extinction of both species in a couple of decades. Even now there are not true wild elephants left. They are managed in national parks and preserves which still doesn't guarantee protection because of culling and poaching. Elephants are not only going to be in captivity for years to come but they need to. Over the last decade their has been great success with elephant breeding techniques and husbandry care. We can bicker amongst ourselves and the activist nut-jobs but that is getting us no where. Personally, if the ele's residing in this outdated enclosures are old (above breeding age) and used to their routine (in most cases for years) why change it? Keep them comfortable. Also, it takes time to raise the money to build and expand. Some Zoochatters seem to think that zoos can just shell out multi-millions to expand, that they have all this money on hand or can get it by making a few phone calls. Believe me its not that easy. I have tried. Just appreciate elephants and realize its not easy or cheap to care for them and even though you are a "sanctuary" you may be doing more harm then good.

 

[mweb08]

The Bronx Zoos current elephant situation is already a big negative from a vistor/ranking perspective as far as I'm concerned, and it will only get worse when they aren't there. Elephants are a pretty big deal to most people visiting zoos. Perhaps some of us have a hard time realizing that or considering that when we consider what's best. I say that since we go to many zoos, sometimes as part of trips where we visit multiple zoos in a short period of time. Thus, it's not a big deal to us if we don't see elephants or whatever animal, or can only view them for 20 seconds, because we saw them recently elsewhere and will again in the near future.

Concerning sending elephants to sanctuaries, I don't have an issue with it. Either have a good elephant exhibit or send them to a good one, whether thats a zoo or a sanctuary.