Leopards & Jaguars

and jaguars are just such beautiful aniamls, the sheer awe, when standing next to one is amazing, and it's a shame, i mean to the basic zoo goer, a 'black panter' is all they wnat to see. common misconceptions aside, the averge goer doesnt realsie and if it gets the through the gates.

and exhibit for them would be great, they area alrge cat, that is very agile, and aboreal, making for a unique exhibit in it's own right, not only then to imerge it into a whole amazonia exhibit.
 
it's u-nanemoius (i dnt bloody know lol) we allw ant jaguar over everything else, now who has the 1000's to import them lol
 
Plenty in south America. The numbers vary over a huge range. Some are seen as far north as Arizona and Texas so they can live in the deserts as well as forests.
The Ones seen in the US have all been young males which travel looking for their own teritories.
I dont think they are common anywhere but they probobly never were.

They are one of my favorite big cats.
 
jaguars have definately suffered at the hands of hunters like so many other big cat species. whilst the amazon basin and some other forest still have decent population densities, believe me, they are being hunted pretty ruthlessly in some parts of their range. they once occoured over a much larger range in the southern US as you mentioned, so few cross the border from mexico that they can barely be considered still an extant fauna of that country. nontheless they are a remarkable and most adaptive cat (maybe not so much as its close relative the leopard however).
 
Our biggest lost are the Clouded leopards, not a big animal which does not need big exhibits, a Stunning looking endandered cat which requires captive breeding, I thought after looking at the Howletts website if a private zoo can keep 19 animals of which there are 5 breeding pairs and produce 27 cubs in 6 years WHY cant our zoos do the same if not better, we dont have bitter cold winters like they do there, we can give them better Housing and a better climate, but no we HAVE to phaze them out, this is another species we were going to take in and run with yet another chance of mind, a another backflip, Did we really give this species a fair go, I dont think so, So what do our zoo leaders want to do?, ah I know, lets import some spotted deer, it just what we need??. Please tell me they are doing a good job because i really feel they are losing there way.
 
Mark, there's only one clouded leopard left in the region. They probably should never have been imported in the first place, as not enough zoos showed interest in housing them. So we ended up with a few animals, that didn't do well, and no other zoos interested in them - hardly a way to manage a species in a region like ours. That's why we are phasing out a single individual that represents a species. It's either that, or try to find another 19 or so animals overseas, and enough spaces to hold them all... But what's that I hear????? Patrick and others yelling out for Jaguars.... And what's that?? Snow Leopards as well?? And so you can see - everyone wants something different, and often, in piddling numbers that are really worthless.

And how can Howlett's do it? Becuase they have access to many unrelated animals in Europe, that are easy to obtain, cheap to transport, and managed in a region that has over 500 zoos. As opposed to here, where they are difficult to obtain, and expensive to import, and only a handful of zoos to hold them.

We, the visiting public, AND the zoos in the region, need to realise once and for all, that unless we can have a number of zoos in the region working together with a species, that are prepared to hold at least 20 animals between them, then we really are wasting our time importing pairs and very small groups of things. It's about time we got out of the stamp collecting mentality and moved on to cooperatively managed species, in viable numbers in the region. It's the only way forward.
 
Zoopro
I think we all understand your very valid aruement. I for one am very jeolous of the European and North American region, being able to have so many zoos and so many wonderful and fascinating animals. I guess this is why when an animal is chosen it needs to be able to represent a significant 'type', region or numbers of habitats. So for instance the big cats - well lions are the apex hunters in Africa, tigers in Asia, and they represent two different 'types' - stripes and plain., as well as different habitats and modes of living (prides, singles)

jaguars could represent the americas, spotted cats, a wide range of habitats and also thet could represent that other spotted cat, the leopard.

Why can zoos not hold more than a pair or single animal, they don't don't have to be on show, the sumatran tiger at dramworld isn't?
 
Where are the Jaguars at Mongo Zoo from and are they are breeding pair . From what I have read The southern America Jaguars which live more in forest are smaller than the northern Mexican Jaguars which range into the US. I have not read it but they sound like sub species. It also sounds like south american countries have an excess of captive animals.
Quote
"The number of jaguars, primarily confiscated from the illegal pet and international trade, in Latin American zoos is enormous. These animals are often kept in sub-optimal conditions prior to confiscation and, unfortunately, largely due to a lack of money and in some cases a lack of knowledge, often remain in sub-standard conditions at the centers that want to preserve these majestic animals."
 
Hi Monty. Both animals are thought to be around 15-20 years old and came from Notre Dame Fauna Park (this place has been closed for a number of years now). Their origins before that are unknown. They've been at Mogo for a little under 10 years. It's quite likely they are siblings.
 
they are bro and sis, and where kept in a concrete cage for about 5 years, this is why oscar the male now has many physical aliments, such as serve arthritus, restrcting his movements in all joints, and a lack of teeth fro health problem incurred at a young age.

from ths fauna park, kitty and rosco also came, the 2 bengal tigers, they two were kept in a cage half the size of there pool at mogo, and from what i hear it was terribble, and the animals were confiscated due to lack of husbandry and care taken to the aniamls. the rspca help mogo house the 4 cats.
 
and they were aquired as cubs, and grew up in those horrible conditions, for the first 5 years, and now fr there last 10, in pure luxuary
 
jaguars, leopards, tarsiers, okapis...

i think everyone on this forum has ideas on what animals we should have, but face it, what zoo pro said isnt ground breaking, its just a bit of genetic theory up against stringent quarantine leglislation.
if our zoos are to have any exotic animals in the future its better they concentrate on breeding fewer species. slow breeding species like elephants and rhinos and hippos and great apes are ideal candidates. big cats and primates are also good, but they have less generation time.
im happy with the carnovores we have already that are thought of as viable. the only others id like to see added to that list would be the sun bear, binturong, dhole, fishing cat and golden cat. after that, i think its best if we focus on the them and the other 8 species known to be viable.
rather than be jealous of the diverse european and american zoo collections lets instead pride ourselves not only on our native animals but also being able to give fewer exotic animals more space, and the fact we dont have foot and moth outbreaks...
 
i like that comment, and it's true, we have what no other zoo community has in the world, a diverse collection of native fauna, and whats luckier is most can be seen wild in our own backyards.

i would still like to import as many animals as possible, as we all would, but what glyn said is right, what we have is a good lot of stock, especially our rhinos, and our 70 million dollar elephants, our cats are breeding well, and we can contribute to international breeding progarms. the only thing i can comment on is what we already know, and that is the inroduction of new blood, such as the case of ringo, and maybe for now lets concentrae on species which we have and can import, and keep them going well.

though we do need those jags and okapi ;)
 
Nicely summarised Glyn, thanks. The region's zoos are planning on holding enough numbers of sun bear, binturong and dhole to make them viable programs, so hopefully, the imports will start to happen in the next year or so to increase the number of these species. Both Dubbo and Melbourne are planning to hold decent-sized groups of dhole.

The region is continuing to discuss fishing cat and golden cat, as zoos are interested in both species. There is very limited availability of golden cats for this region, and that makes them an unlikely candidate for a decent population here. In addition to these two species, we currently hold another 8 small felid taxa. A number of these are ear-marked for being phased out, so we can better concentrate on a few. As you said "if our zoos are to have any exotic animals in the future its better they concentrate on breeding fewer species".
 
well taronga is continuing to try breeding sun bears isnt it, and what about perths new imports, sounds great. as well tarongas new bintorong are totally new pair from sigapore was it?

can you expand on dubbo and melbournes dhole project, this sounds great, so how many do we currently have in region, is it only tarongas 3? also adelaides masterplan still says dhole i beleive.

see things in our region isnt really that bad, i think it's pretty darn good.
 
yes things are good

firstly ill say that more work could be done to more effectively manage species, but considering our quarantine laws and small number of zoos i think that ARAZPA's regionally managed programs are evelving fast and in many ways we are leading the international zoo industry. i mean, we had model ssp or studbooks decades before america, just out of neccesity, to manage our small zoo stock of species like hippo, giraffe and cassowary.
if you look back in time, particularly the last 15 years, our regional breeding programs have really started to work.
theres been some failures along the way , and grandicose plans for species like bongo, malayan tapir and golden lion tamarin, who all may fall by the wayside. unfortunate events or unexpected deaths may have jeapordised the viabilty of programs, again underscoring the importance of having more individuals of fewer species. think of the death of congo, our only bull african elephant, or the male pygmy hippo from hawaii who died at taronga because of a disease transmitted by rats.
there were big plans for maned wolves and asian lions, until ARAZPA and ZPB of NSW saw the sense in cooperating on just one species. weve seen species like peccary and sitatunga slip towards regional extinction, and the future of others like agouti may lie in preserving a closely inbred population. weve seen what a lack of regional coordination can result in, with once viable number sof capybarra and cavy crashing suddenly because of decisions to castrate and short generation times which leave no time to right the wrongs and get a population back on track.
weve seen quarantine laws relaxed and tightened. we continue to watch as hybrid orangs are phased out. we watch and see if mouse deer will turn up, or spotted deer from the phillipines. taronga has decided to go it alone with indian rhinos, mogo with white lions and seaworld with polar bears. all species must be managed as international programs, and whilst they hold high advocacy and education values it is perhaps the commercial imperatives associated with such high -profile species which sees zoos turning their backs on what we now know we need, well managed, cooperative programs.
having said all that, i feel that us zoo visitors have an exciting future ahead of us. our zoos will have great collections of great apes, big cats, elephants, gibbons and many lesser primates. red pandas, giraffes and meerkats. fewer species equals better exhibits and more room. and rather than looking at near identical collections at sydney, melbourne, perth and adelaide as monotonous, us zoogoers who are really interested will have the joy of comparing and contrasting exhibits in the same way as we do with melbourne and sydney for gorillas, elephants and orangs.
good on ARAZPA for the role they are playing, and lets hope stuped mistakes continue to be eliminated and zoos work even more closely together.
 
O my god, wow thts all i can say wow. thats is like woot woot, cudos to you glyn, thats one of the most amzing things i have ever read in realtion to zoos. wow. thnx tht is like wow. thankyou.

and i agree with all of it.
 
ZooPro said:
The region is continuing to discuss fishing cat and golden cat, as zoos are interested in both species. There is very limited availability of golden cats for this region, and that makes them an unlikely candidate for a decent population here. In addition to these two species, we currently hold another 8 small felid taxa. A number of these are ear-marked for being phased out, so we can better concentrate on a few. As you said "if our zoos are to have any exotic animals in the future its better they concentrate on breeding fewer species".
Click to expand...

We have a fairly stable breeding program for Asian golden cats here in Singapore, with litters being produced every year. We've sent goldies to NZ before i believe, and perhaps Oz too (can anyone confirm?). If Oz zoos can start a breeding program too, then we could work towards a regional program that will ensure long-term viability.
 
Correct Zooish, a number of the golden cats here are quite related to yours. Others have come from Wuppertal in Europe, and many of the world's captive golden cats are related to those animals. We've had a few successes with this species over the years, but also some failures - Melbourne has bred loads of males, and a couple of pairs have never bred. We do have a well-managed program for them though, with a planned population of around 30 animals. If only more unrelated animals were available....

It's a shame they are so few and far between, and so related, because they are a beatiful species, one of my favourites.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top