Let's All Have a Moment of Silence for the Newtown School Shooting Victims
- Thread starter ThylacineAlive
- Start date
I can't help but echo Nanoboy's statement. Usually, I feel so far removed from these sorts of tragedies that it's hard to relate but this particular incident is really heart wrenching. I read in the newspaper today about a teacher who was shot after she had hidden the children in her class. That is a whole new level of bravery. I can't even begin to imagine how it must feel to have your life torn apart like this.
Like Anaheim said, the holidays are here in the case of Chanukah, and Christmas and Kwanzaa are coming up, but for some families, that holiday season is ruined. Will they ever go through another holiday season without sobbing on December 14th? Most likely not.
I believe that Americans should have the right to have guns as part of the Second Amendement, but gun control is desperately needed in America, with all the tragedies of shootings going on.
It's almost felt like 9/11 again. Clearly, the death toll for 9/11 was much higher and the whole event was more shocking, but the ages of the children who died in this event, whom I believe were all first graders... it's just heartwrenching. And the adults too! Most of these adults were only in their 20's! They still had to go through their life, a life too quickly robbed.
I believe that Americans should have the right to have guns as part of the Second Amendement, but gun control is desperately needed in America, with all the tragedies of shootings going on.
It's almost felt like 9/11 again. Clearly, the death toll for 9/11 was much higher and the whole event was more shocking, but the ages of the children who died in this event, whom I believe were all first graders... it's just heartwrenching. And the adults too! Most of these adults were only in their 20's! They still had to go through their life, a life too quickly robbed.
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Zooplantman
Well-Known Member
The ages of the dead mean little to me. But when I think of these teachers, the principal, the school psychologist who put themselves in harm's way in order to protect the children it breaks my heart. More may have died but for these adults who not only stood at their posts but did what they could to stop, distract, mislead the gunman and so protect hiding children. Their courage and dedication is humbling to think about.
They were all kindergardeners, only about 5 years old.
President Obama is visiting today.
All articles I've read and from what I've heard on the radio say that they were first graders. Not trying to be mean, but look it up.
Obama to speak at vigil for Conn. shooting victims
The identities of the victims were released. Heartbreaking.
Names of victims in Connecticut shooting released
On several news reports it said kindergarden. Also, his mother was a kindergarden teacher so I thought he was taking his anger out on her poor class. Several of my friends parents contacted them saying kindergarden as well. I really don't think it matters weither it was kindergarden or 1st grade as this was a horrible event either way and arguing the grades isn't helping the poor families.
I just realized, Friday was my friend's birthday. Oh how horrible to have your birthday on such a terrible day.
Zooplantman
Well-Known Member
Please... if you are interested in the "facts" then take it slow. Much of what was in the news on Friday was retracted on Sunday. The story seems in flux and perhaps some of what you think you know or you have heard will soon prove false.
Besides, arguing over whether the children were 5 or 6 or 7 seems just so disrespectful
Besides, arguing over whether the children were 5 or 6 or 7 seems just so disrespectful
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JBZvolunteer
Well-Known Member
The school has actually came out and said they had no records of the mom working as a full time teacher at the school.
You are right. I apologize and I'm sure BZF does as well.
Reading the list of names they appear to be missing the seventh adult.
According to a report I just watched on TV, the children of Sandy Hook Elementary will be temporarily going back to school in the nearby town of Monroe.
I do not think that they should try and get teachers to become trained and carry guns, but making schools and other places gun free zones only encourages nut cases to go there because they know it is a gun free zone. These terrible crimes always seem to happen in places where guns are banned, as cowardly perpetrators know nobody will shoot back. If anyone is licensed to own and carry a gun in public they should be allowed to do so in schools if they area teacher. The possibility a teacher may have a gun may be all it takes to stop these cowards from even trying, as we all know they do not obey gun free zones.
Beardsley Zoo Fan said: Clearly, the death toll for 9/11 was much higher and the whole event was more shocking,. True, but I read one statement that there had been more shooting deaths in the United States over the last six months than all deaths from terrorism and war over the last 25 years.
This seems to be the core of the problem, the notion that gun deaths can somehow be solved by more guns. In Australia, as already mentioned, semi-automatic weapons were removed from public ownership in a buyback in 1996. The results are clear, a significant decline in gun related deaths and 13 massacres in the years leading up to the ban, and not one since. Gun deaths are directly related to the ability of people to access guns.
This event is so sad, but even sadder is the apparent unwillingness of the American people to learn the lesson that is so obvious.
This seems to be the core of the problem, the notion that gun deaths can somehow be solved by more guns. In Australia, as already mentioned, semi-automatic weapons were removed from public ownership in a buyback in 1996. The results are clear, a significant decline in gun related deaths and 13 massacres in the years leading up to the ban, and not one since. Gun deaths are directly related to the ability of people to access guns.
This event is so sad, but even sadder is the apparent unwillingness of the American people to learn the lesson that is so obvious.
That is not true. Gun deaths had been declining at the same rate before 96 and have continued to decline at the same rate.
There is also a serious copy cat risk which occurred around 96. The constant mention of events such as this in the media can cause more crimes to happen and I am concerned with the constant media this is getting there will be more.
NZ also had massacres around 96 as well and did not change their gun laws, and have not had another one since either.
Not according to the experts:
Australia?s 1996 gun law reforms: faster falls in firearm deaths, firearm suicides, and a decade without mass shootings -- Chapman et al. 12 (6): 365 -- Injury Prevention
New Zealand does allow some private possession of semi-automatics, but under very restricted conditions:
[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_New_Zealand]Gun politics in New Zealand - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
Great plan ....... until a teacher flips and shoots a load of pupils!
Basically as long as a country has guns and easy access to guns they'll be massacres of this type. It's the price that has to be paid in the same way that if you have loads of automobiles they'll be auto-fatalities. I don't believe the link can be seriously doubted and it's ultimately up to the citizens of each country to decide whether the trade off is worthwhile. Personally I'm happy I live in a country with very strong gun controls.
How a country with so many guns in circulation could now impose gun controls is beyond me (I suspect the horse as bolted) -that's a tricky one for the politicians.
MRJ, Chapman is far from impartial, he is a professional gun control advocate and his figures are dubious.
Here is an article on the causes of massacres.
Gun Expert Lott: Let Teachers Carry Arms, Ban Gun-Free Zones to Halt Mass Shootings
Shorts, you are using the same argument the anti gun groups used when concealed carry was introduced in the US. The opposite has happened and shootings fell once it was possible for people to become licensed to conceal carry. Criminals realize that anyone could be carrying and do not want to face an armed person so crime falls.
Here is an article on the causes of massacres.
Gun Expert Lott: Let Teachers Carry Arms, Ban Gun-Free Zones to Halt Mass Shootings
Shorts, you are using the same argument the anti gun groups used when concealed carry was introduced in the US. The opposite has happened and shootings fell once it was possible for people to become licensed to conceal carry. Criminals realize that anyone could be carrying and do not want to face an armed person so crime falls.
Personally, I find the whole concept of legal concealed weapons (and the idea that anyone around me could have a state-sanctioned concealed handgun) utterly terrifying. It certainly would not make me personally feel more safe.
Like Shorts, I'm very happy to be in a country where even police officers don't have automatic access to firearms. Each country has to make its own mind up, but I'm very happy with what mine has come up with on this one.
I have just had a look at the graphs on Chapman page. It actually shows the decline in firearms deaths not being effected by the 96 law changes.
The only thing it does sow is a drop in firearms deaths due to suicide after 96. This appears good until you look at the suicide by other means graph where there is a large jump in deaths by other means, meaning the actual number of suicides did not vary outside the same range. People do not commit suicide because they have a gun, they just use the easiest method they have available. If they do not have a gun they use another method. His statistics of total firearms deaths is therefore effected by the substitution of suicide method for another.
Overall his statistics surprised me as they agreed with what I said about no statistical change in gun deaths after the 96 law changes if you take into account the substitution of other methods for suicide after 96.
jbnbsn99
Well-Known Member
As someone who works in school on a daily basis, the idea of having teachers with guns scares me. I was in a second grade class today, and if some of those kids got hold of a gun, someone could well have ended up dead. It's the middle schoolers who scare me though. I know several who are in gangs, and wouldn't hesitate.
There was a moment of silence at my school today at 9:30am Eastern Standard Time. Apparently the whole nation (or at least churches) joined in at the same moment.