ZSL London Zoo Lions at London
- Thread starter Indlovu
- Start date
Ilenia was born on 26/1/97 at London Zoo to Ruchii (f) and Jake (m). Jake was Chester's breeding male but after the death of Ruchii's first mate Arfur in 1996 it was decided to try and breed her with Jake who had already produced cubs with her sister Chandani at Chester. Jake arrived on 18/9/96 and returned to Chester in December of the same year. The litter was 1:3. One of the female cubs died aged just a few days. However the remaing three thrived. A new male named Kamal was sourced from Helsinki as a new mate for Ruchii although he was kept apart from Ruchii until after the cubs left. On 2nd July 1998 Ilena and her sister (name is un-readable, sorry) left for Jerusalem Zoo in Israel. There brother Sam was moved to the former Rhenen Zoo in Holland in August 1998. Sam died at Rhenen on 29th June 2001. The other female died on 1st October 1999 at Jerusalem. The studbook lists Ilenia as being named Yilee and she was still at Jerusalem at the end of 2006.
That would be the one - perhaps she was renamed at Jerusalem as Yllie?
The story of the lions Arthur (Arfur) and Jake – is anybody knows something???
Hi guys
Bellow is the story with the questionable issue I am looking for answer of the origin of Arthur (Arfur) (studbook #1253) and Jake (stud book # 1245) the two British male founders of the
Asiatic lions captive populations in Europe, along with Vanaraj in
Helsinki and Banagriath in Zurich. So the story is little bit complicate because the data in the studbook and the ISIS data differ on the point about the origin. So Arthur and Jake are the two
Asiatic males that arrived in London zoo in late 1990. In the ISIS database Arthur is signed as Captive born, but Jake as Wild born. In the Studbooks (from 1993 to 2006) what I have in may notes is that both are signed as WILD captured i.e. wild born.
What I know from a friend of mine , who was PHD student at ZSL - London zoo at that time ( studding the flemen patterns of carnivores) is the next story: There were two wild lioness captured in Gir - Bijlee and Sukeshi. One of them was pregnant but one of them had already a male cub - few days or so old???. So that cub was Jake, the other lioness - Bijlee gave birth about couple of
weeks late -but already in captivity - again to a male cub - Arthur.
So that is the story I heard from my friend, but I need to confirm this - it is an important issue, despite it seems kind of weird. So I would appreciate if somebody knows something and can provide me any insides of that story or to confirm /disconfirm what I heard from my colleague.
Thanks a lot in advance
Velizar
Hi guys
Bellow is the story with the questionable issue I am looking for answer of the origin of Arthur (Arfur) (studbook #1253) and Jake (stud book # 1245) the two British male founders of the
Asiatic lions captive populations in Europe, along with Vanaraj in
Helsinki and Banagriath in Zurich. So the story is little bit complicate because the data in the studbook and the ISIS data differ on the point about the origin. So Arthur and Jake are the two
Asiatic males that arrived in London zoo in late 1990. In the ISIS database Arthur is signed as Captive born, but Jake as Wild born. In the Studbooks (from 1993 to 2006) what I have in may notes is that both are signed as WILD captured i.e. wild born.
What I know from a friend of mine , who was PHD student at ZSL - London zoo at that time ( studding the flemen patterns of carnivores) is the next story: There were two wild lioness captured in Gir - Bijlee and Sukeshi. One of them was pregnant but one of them had already a male cub - few days or so old???. So that cub was Jake, the other lioness - Bijlee gave birth about couple of
weeks late -but already in captivity - again to a male cub - Arthur.
So that is the story I heard from my friend, but I need to confirm this - it is an important issue, despite it seems kind of weird. So I would appreciate if somebody knows something and can provide me any insides of that story or to confirm /disconfirm what I heard from my colleague.
Thanks a lot in advance
Velizar
I can't help you with this story but it seems quite feasible that one cub could have been born in Gir and the other in captivity. Some of these Lions are semi-tame even in the wild so transferring a mother and her very small cub to a zoo might be more plausible than it first seems.
Incidentally, I believe the name 'Arfur' derived at London Zoo from his having half an ear, so it was 'halfear' (giving the name 'Arfur') and not from the proper name 'Arthur' which it might later have been transcribed as.
Thank you for the reply
Yes - I do think also the story is correct - the person I know that from is one of the most knowledgeable on the subject, however because of the delicacy and the importance of the matter I need a verification, so still have to get it
In the old studbooks for example 1993 - the one that still includes the hybrids - Arfur is called Arthur - but that could be misunderstanding - the studbook is accomplished at US - Knoxville
By the way I am looking also for photos of Arfur - that is the only male lion from the Asiatic population I have not photos of - I need this for a study I am working on.
Photos of Arfur - the London zoo based founder of the Asiatic lion captive population
Hi all
I am looking also for photos of Arfur - that is the only male lion from the Asiatic population I have not photos of - I need this for a study I am working on.
The study is on inheritance of some external characters of lions and is performed by studying those characters along the generations on pedigrees constructed with photos of the males. So Arfur is the only gap I have in the pedigree I constructed for the Asiatic lineages in Europe. Will be great to be able to fill that up
Thank you in advance
V
Hi all
I am looking also for photos of Arfur - that is the only male lion from the Asiatic population I have not photos of - I need this for a study I am working on.
The study is on inheritance of some external characters of lions and is performed by studying those characters along the generations on pedigrees constructed with photos of the males. So Arfur is the only gap I have in the pedigree I constructed for the Asiatic lineages in Europe. Will be great to be able to fill that up
Thank you in advance
V
It shouldn't be too difficult to identify him from any photos you get- by the 'half- ear' which was sufficiently noticeable to name(or rename?) him from. I think 'Arfur' was the cockney derivation...
I suspect the SB holders weren't aware of any of that and thought 'Arfur' was a mispelling- hence it became 'Arthur'.
Yeh - just to find any - looking for it might be since 2000
- - I have seen him when he was young - around 1991, but lost all of the photos and still he was young then. I have Jake well documented but not Arfur - and they are different - technically I have a photo of Arfur - from a newspaper - but a very bad one - when he dragging that guy Silkok or whatever is his name. And he is quite different from Jake - Photos of Arfur - the London zoo based founder of the Asiatic lion captive population
Hi all
I am looking also for photos of Arfur - that is the only male lion from the Asiatic population I have not photos of - I need this for a study I am working on.
The study is on inheritance of some external characters of lions and is performed by studying those characters along the generations on pedigrees constructed with photos of the males. So Arfur is the only gap I have in the pedigree I constructed for the Asiatic lineages in Europe. Will be great to be able to fill that up
Thank you in advance
V
Hi i was wondering if you were able to point me in the direction of those textbooks you’ve mentioned and any publications you’ve produced in the decade since this forum i’m writing a dissertation on captive lions in the UK and would love some sources to look through, unfortunately referencing zoo chat isn’t an option