Cairns Wildlife Safari Reserve Made it!!!

S

Steve Robinson

Well-Known Member
15+ year member
Congratulations to Jenny Jattke and her team at Koah.

The Cairns Wildlife Safari Reserve has finally been admitted as a Full Institutional Member of ARAZPA.
 
From what has been said in the pygmy hippo death thread about ARAZPA, i don't know why you'd be congratulating Cairns Wildlife Safari reserve for being admitted as a full member?? It sounds like most people seem to think they are a very ineffective organisation?
 
whynot said:
From what has been said in the pygmy hippo death thread about ARAZPA, i don't know why you'd be congratulating Cairns Wildlife Safari reserve for being admitted as a full member?? It sounds like most people seem to think they are a very ineffective organisation?
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I suggest that you read both relevant threads carefully and in their entirety before making such an assumption.

The Cairns Wildlife Safari Reserve of today is NOT the Mareeba Wild Animal Park of old.

The Pygmy Hippo was abandoned in the NT before Mrs Jattke took control of the Park.

Mrs Jattke has worked long and hard to shake off the stigmas that she inherited and her admission to ARAZPA is well deserved.
 
Steve Robinson said:
I suggest that you read both relevant threads carefully and in their entirety before making such an assumption.

The Cairns Wildlife Safari Reserve of today is NOT the Mareeba Wild Animal Park of old.

The Pygmy Hippo was abandoned in the NT before Mrs Jattke took control of the Park.

Mrs Jattke has worked long and hard to shake off the stigmas that she inherited and her admission to ARAZPA is well deserved.
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You seem to have misread MY entire post actually Steve. I was saying I wondered why you thought it was a good thing to be part of ARAZPA, since people obviously think ARAZPA is an ineffective organisation. I said nothing about Cairns WSR not deserving to be in ARAZPA.
 
whynot said:
You seem to have misread MY entire post actually Steve. I was saying I wondered why you thought it was a good thing to be part of ARAZPA, since people obviously think ARAZPA is an ineffective organisation. I said nothing about Cairns WSR not deserving to be in ARAZPA.
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Sorry mate, so I did!

It is true that, in some ways, ARAZPA could be much more effective. The Pygmy Hippo saga probably demonstrates that as well as any. In terms of animal welfare that animal was badly let down by the people "managing" it. I am surprised that the ARAZPA people have still not given us their view of this whole tragedy - and that lack of communication is another area in which the Association could be more effective.

However, ARAZPA is the only game in town. It may not be perfect in many ways but it is already there. If it can get more practical, hands on, "the buck stops here" people on to it's Board it has the potential to be a very good organisation for our region's zoos and their animals. Zoos like CWSR becoming full members will help to achieve that.

Smaller zoos need an organisation like ARAZPA if they are going to make worthwhile conservation efforts as well. On our own, little zoos don't have the resources to assist to improve the big picture. Sure, we can do our bit with education and also with preservation - breeding animals and sharing them out with other zoos, either through our own networks or through the ASMP. But that's about our individual limit.

To make truly worthwhile conservation gains we need to pool our individual resources so that the combined resource is worthwhile. ARAZPA, through it's Wildlife Conservation Fund, gives us the framework in which to do just that.

So, although many of us [including some prominent members of long standing] have our beefs about the way in which the Association does things and it's elitist posturing, that does not mean that we want to bring it down. Rather, with an influx of new blood and more down to earth philosophies, there is a very keen desire to build it up.
 
I'd just like to make something of a defence of ARAZPA as it has come under some critisism here and in other posts.

It should be remembered ARAZPA as an organisation has only about a half-dozen biologists and administrators as staff members, and a limited budget. To expect it to mount "rescue missions" for pygmy hippos or such, for instance, is clearly way beyond it's means and it's role.

It relies entirely on the co-operation of it's members to be effective. If a zoo does not want to provide spaces for genetically valuable animals, and would rather stock something else for show, there is very little ARAZPA can do except provide moral pressure.

ARAZPA has been at the forefront of promoting the need to build sustainable populations in our zoos, pointing out over the last decade that many exotic species are genetically doomed, while most native species rely on wild imports to remain viable. Zoos admit the problem, but are slow to provide the places. Who can blame them? Nobody wants to hold large numbers of animals off limits - it is a heavy overhead. Yet it is becoming increasingly difficult to import animals, or to obtain them from the wild.

The accreditation process is also a source of some comment. My feeling is that ARAZPA is very much on a learning curve here. They went down the Rolls-Royce route, but have found that they can't meet their proposed timetable, either in terms of time or cost. I can well understand this is frustrating for those looking to join, it is also frustrating for current members. They recently introduced a $1000 charge, and are revising the process to streamline it. Hopefully it will be on track again soon.

ARAZPA grew out of an association of directors of the "big 4" zoos, where they would meet once a year to swap animals and yarns. It is far more inclusive than that old association, and has set itself a massive task. No doubt it is not perfect, but it does a lot of good work and needs our support.

A note about species management. Often I read comment here such as "we need jaguars" or "why can't we do more for a conservation program for lions"? It should be realised that a viable conservation program requires not tens but hundreds of animals. This is especially so if is not a "breed & release" program. Something has to give somewhere, there is not enough space or money. My personal opinion? Due to our size and isolation there is very little that can be done in Australian zoos for the conservation of exotic animals. Much better we concentrate resources on our own native fauna, goodness knows there are enough problems there.
 
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MRJ - i hear what you are saying. and its appreciated to have explanations.

but i do feel that to explain why ARAZPA is ineffective in certain areas does not mean that it should be free from criticism on those issues.

i'm going to take a guess and say that when everyone else here, like me, mentions ARAZPA, we basically mean the zoo heavyweights. we mean those same big four zoos that at the end of the day have all the say. the ones that talked their way into getting elephants from thailand and pandas from china. the ones with all the clout.

the ones that make, and consistently break, their own recommendations.

i think it is integral in the 21st century for australasian zoos to have proper cooperation, shared vision, commitment and representation.

ARAZPA, be it in fetal form, is the answer to this. it is the platform for the major zoos of the region to cooperate with eachother and make shared statements and initiatives.

the situation with tipperary/mareeba illustrated to me just how much lack of initiative and foresight there is with our major zoos. here was an opportunity to snag a range of species that are suffering terribly from lack of genetic diversity. a range of species that are not only already held by our institutions - but also invested heavily in. zoos victoria for example had two pygmy hippo pools sitting empty. in what is a much praised, popular and recently constructed exhibit. likewise over at werribee, they had just invested millions in a new, multi award winning hippo river mega exhibit. but the old exhibit, once touted as an off exhibit holding area is free of tenants. there are very few pairings that can be made long term to ensure the exhibit always has an attraction in it.
and just beyond that is a range of field exhibits featuring inbred dying-out antelope species. antelopes that are the "fillers" of any safari experience.

and so here was an opportunity to resolve these threats for the medium term. a gorgeous opportunity wrapped in a bow.

not one taker. not one zoo saw it a suitable investment. not one major zoo purchased a single animal. even worse, they didn't even pool their money in an arrangement that would see the animals divided amongst the major zoos - to be shared further down the track to the benefit of all.

ARAZPA - the association, created by these same zoos to advise them on such issues as animal genetics, failed to convince any zoos to actually take them up on their own good advice.

so thoughtless were the zoos that in the end one of these highly valuable animals was discarded. just thrown away. it was to the zoos worth nothing. it was a pig. a feral pig. meanwhile they were handraising another of its kind in sydney and plastering it on the news.

MRJ - you say its not ARAZPA's role to mount rescue missions for such valuable animals.....

well it #@%*ING WELL SHOULD BE!
 
phoenix said:
MRJ - i hear what you are saying. and its appreciated to have explanations.

but i do feel that to explain why ARAZPA is ineffective in certain areas does not mean that it should be free from criticism on those issues.
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No, nobody should be free of criticism, but it is important that criticism be placed where it belongs not just generally sprayed around.

phoenix said:
i'm going to take a guess and say that when everyone else here, like me, mentions ARAZPA, we basically mean the zoo heavyweights. we mean those same big four zoos that at the end of the day have all the say. the ones that talked their way into getting elephants from thailand and pandas from china. the ones with all the clout.
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Ahhh well yes, but that is not ARAZPA. That is the ARAZPA membership, and as I said earlier, ARAZPA is only as effective as it's members are willing to make it.

phoenix said:
i think it is integral in the 21st century for australasian zoos to have proper cooperation, shared vision, commitment and representation.

ARAZPA, be it in fetal form, is the answer to this. it is the platform for the major zoos of the region to cooperate with eachother and make shared statements and initiatives.
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On this I think we can be in furious agreement.

phoenix said:
the situation with tipperary/mareeba illustrated to me just how much lack of initiative and foresight there is with our major zoos. ...and so here was an opportunity to resolve these threats for the medium term. a gorgeous opportunity wrapped in a bow.

not one taker. not one zoo saw it a suitable investment. not one major zoo purchased a single animal. even worse, they didn't even pool their money in an arrangement that would see the animals divided amongst the major zoos - to be shared further down the track to the benefit of all.
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Frankly I can't comment. I really have no professional interest in exotics, and don't know anything about the animals. The one comment I would make is that this situation goes back further to the Pearl Coast Zoo. And in McAlpine, Anderson and Gill you had three "alpha silverbacks", none of whom are known for their co-operative nature unless it is in their interests.

phoenix said:
ARAZPA - the association, created by these same zoos to advise them on such issues as animal genetics, failed to convince any zoos to actually take them up on their own good advice.
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Broad accusations, hope you have some evidence to back them up. And don't look at me, I have no idea if these animals were as genetically valuable as you claim, or if they were at all suitable for other zoos. You may be right, you may be wrong.


phoenix said:
so thoughtless were the zoos that in the end one of these highly valuable animals was discarded. just thrown away. it was to the zoos worth nothing. it was a pig. a feral pig. meanwhile they were handraising another of its kind in sydney and plastering it on the news.

MRJ - you say its not ARAZPA's role to mount rescue missions for such valuable animals.....

well it #@%*ING WELL SHOULD BE!
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I guess you could join ARAZPA, turn up at the AGM and argue for an increase in membership fees to establish an animal rescue unit...:)

Seriously you would be aware there were complex legal proceedings regarding the ownership of these animals, if the hippo was "rescued", say by a major zoo, almost certainly somebody would have stood up and said thank you very much I'll have my hippo back now. More than likely several parties would have stood up. I guess it would have been a no-win situation.

The mess arose because of a failure of regulation, by several governments, and because of the personalities involved. ARAZPA would have, and continues, to offer to assist when they can, but the reality is they were dealing with individuals with more clout, and less willingness to co-operate, than any major zoo director.

Speaking, of course, as one of the clout-less :rolleyes:
 
Not too sure where I stand with regards to ARAZPA and this pygmy hippo but I must say I was impressed with the speed of the action they took to rehome the two stardust elephants. They arranged meetings, had long discussions etc and it was decided that TWPZ would take them in at great cost to the zoo. The elephants previously had nothing to do with ARAZPA and were of no benefit the regions program. They really did not need to take responsibility for these animals.

Now I am disappointed about the hippo situation and I would be interested to know if ARAZPA put it to it's members to rescue this animal as they did with the two circus elephants??? There is a difference in that the circus asked ARAZPA for help.
 
And the Elephants were public knowledge, This hippo could of just dissappeared into the outback.
 
To keep the elephant situation in perspective -
TWPZ had already made overtures to the circus about placing the elephants there if, at some stage, they wished to do so.

This was because they were, at the time, holding a solo female Asiatic which is against the law to do in NSW. The AR people were gearing up for another stoush and where else were there any Asiatic elephants to go with Burma?

Following the death at the circus, it was a simple matter to pick up the threads and move quickly to place the elephants at Dubbo. There was never the slightest chance that they would go anywhere else.


The only hiccup came from a very senior person at Taronga Sydney who very nearly undid the whole arrangement with his arrogance and intransigence. Thankfully, he was over ruled and is no longer there.
 
Steve Robinson said:
The only hiccup came from a very senior person at Taronga Sydney who very nearly undid the whole arrangement with his arrogance and intransigence. Thankfully, he was over ruled and is no longer there.
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Hmmmm... I wonder who that was?

;););););)

Hix
 
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