Manchester Zoo Manchester zoo

Zooplantman said:
Yes when you consider it must cover many things before the first animal enclosure is constructed:
1. Land purchase
2, Parking facilities
3. Entry/ticketing building
4. Administrative and staff offices
5. Roads & visitor paths
6. Service area
7. Landscaping (even minimal)
8. Equipment, vehicles, etc.

So the plan to begin with small steps may be a modest Madagascar building with attached outdoor enclosures.
The challenge will be to convince the public that this facility is worth re-visitng.
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Planning permission will not be cheap. A quick look shows the following scale of charges (may be higher/lower in Trafford).

Outline application to establish the principle: £11,000 for 2.5ha plus £1,380 per additional hectare. So 30acre (12ha roughly) would be around £24,000.

Detailed application for actual buildings (not sure whether this includes outdoor enclosures): £22,000 for 3,750 sq m plus £138 per addl 75 sq m.

So easily £50k plus to the planning authority; probably a similar sum (at least) to architects and planning consultants.

Before a brick is laid.
 
ThomasNotTom said:
It's a shame to see so much pessimism on this thread. None the less, I can assure you all that far more than £8 million is being spent.

Thanks.
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One person's pessimism is another person's realism.

Creating a viable new zoo from scratch only 30 or so miles from Britain's most extensive and popular zoo will be ... challenging.
 
SHAVINGTONZOO said:
One person's pessimism is another person's realism.

Creating a viable new zoo from scratch only 30 or so miles from Britain's most extensive and popular zoo will be ... challenging.
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Thank you for your somewhat condescending reply.

I like to think positively about the future of Manchester Zoo, as I'm sure many others on this site do too.

As I've said multiple times, the potential sites have been chosen for a reason; Johnpaul is more than aware of Chester Zoos proximity to MCZ.

TNT
 
ThomasNotTom said:
It's a shame to see so much pessimism on this thread. None the less, I can assure you all that far more than £8 million is being spent.

Thanks.
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Without sounding devils advocate, one could also say that some people may be slightly blinded by being close or friendly to those running the proposed zoo.

Within a month of their initial press announcement, they've gone from being ready to open in 2020, to now aiming to be open by the end of 2021.

Their initial press banner suggested this would be a larger attraction with lots of big exhibits and so on. However the latest press release seems to give the suggestion it will start small with a Madagascar themed zoo and a link up to a conservation group out in Madagascar.

Initial funding is said to be around the £8m mark.

Personally I think the press release initially was probably to keep backers happy and it was glossed up a bit big.

Whilst I hope this is a big collection and exciting, I personally would struggle to get excited about just a small collection of Madagascan species, which effectively will have little difference to what Chester are doing with a single exhibit.

Also will these big backers be happy pumping in a lot of money, to have initially a small collection and would it struggle to get visitor interest. I personally can't see people flocking to see a small collection of Madagascan species when these species can be seen as part of a big collection just over an hour away.

I suppose you could say it would be like Wild Place was when it first opened, but even now Wild Place doesn't get a huge number of visitors and is still only an attraction you would spend an hour or two at.

Hope I'm wrong however.
 
Andrew Swales said:
If you ignore all the old 'stuff' surrounding it, and the roof, ceiling, insulation, lining and path - I can see around £1000 in new materials, regardless of labour. The species label could have cost £80 or more on its own...
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Indeed; the following post by @gentle lemur breaks down how it was managed:

gentle lemur said:
I was given a tour of the Park by Douglas Richardson in 2011, arranged through ZooChat and reported in the thread mentioned above. At that time the enclosure had recently been converted for a pair of Pallas's cats and their subsequent kittens. He told me that most of the materials required came from the Park's stores or were recycled, so the total extra expenditure was only £85. I presume that the work was done in-house and so there was no extra cost for labour.
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For instance, I suspect the species label was sent up from Edinburgh Zoo, as they had formerly kept the species, and hence wouldn't have cost anything extra.

Of course, this kind of thing doesn't actually apply in the case of Manchester Zoo as @SHAVINGTONZOO notes - I was just noting that it *is* possible to do things "cheap and cheerful" and then add the shine and glamour down the line.
 
I am looking forward to it. The key will be two things: how they manage to differentiate themselves from Chester, and how they are located so sufficient visitor base would find the transport easier to the new zoo than to Chester.

On the first part, although Chester is great, there are ABC animals which are not well covered. And they can differentiate experiences and exhibit types, too.
 
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Zooreviewsuk said:
Without sounding devils advocate, one could also say that some people may be slightly blinded by being close or friendly to those running the proposed zoo.

Within a month of their initial press announcement, they've gone from being ready to open in 2020, to now aiming to be open by the end of 2021.

Their initial press banner suggested this would be a larger attraction with lots of big exhibits and so on. However the latest press release seems to give the suggestion it will start small with a Madagascar themed zoo and a link up to a conservation group out in Madagascar.

Initial funding is said to be around the £8m mark.

Personally I think the press release initially was probably to keep backers happy and it was glossed up a bit big.

Whilst I hope this is a big collection and exciting, I personally would struggle to get excited about just a small collection of Madagascan species, which effectively will have little difference to what Chester are doing with a single exhibit.

Also will these big backers be happy pumping in a lot of money, to have initially a small collection and would it struggle to get visitor interest. I personally can't see people flocking to see a small collection of Madagascan species when these species can be seen as part of a big collection just over an hour away.

I suppose you could say it would be like Wild Place was when it first opened, but even now Wild Place doesn't get a huge number of visitors and is still only an attraction you would spend an hour or two at.

Hope I'm wrong however.
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I'll happily address some of what you've said this evening.
 
I think the proximity to Chester could be a bit of a red herring.

Knowsley and Welsh Mountain are a similar distance from Chester, and they do OK.

I can imagine that there is a place for a collection that is more casual, more intimate, more convenient, less crowded and less expensive for a Manchester family than Chester is.

Good luck to Manchester. A new collection with their aims and aspirations has to be a good thing.
 
Blue Planet is also close to Chester, there was much debate about the impact it might have on Chester when it opened.
 
Blue Planet is an aquarium though? Chester has a very small Aquarium. Also Blue Planet is near a shopping centre. So it picks up visitors from those who go to the shopping centre. I don't see any comparison in say Blue Planet to Chester, as there would be Chester to Manchester.
 
The fact remains that many people debated the possible impact on Chester with Blue Planet opening
 
ThomasNotTom said:
Thank you for your somewhat condescending reply.

I like to think positively about the future of Manchester Zoo, as I'm sure many others on this site do too.

As I've said multiple times, the potential sites have been chosen for a reason; Johnpaul is more than aware of Chester Zoos proximity to MCZ.

TNT
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Not meant to be condescending. Would love to see a successful zoo in Manchester (and many other towns and cities). I was greatly impressed on my visit to Birmingham Nature Centre; a model which I think could be used elsewhere. But the original material on this seems to be in danger of overpromising.
 
The Zoo's Facebook page also mentions that a small group of Wagner's gerbils (three of the seven individuals in the UK, none in public collections as per Zootierliste) is already being kept.
 
Zooreviewsuk said:
Blue Planet is an aquarium though? Chester has a very small Aquarium. Also Blue Planet is near a shopping centre. So it picks up visitors from those who go to the shopping centre. I don't see any comparison in say Blue Planet to Chester, as there would be Chester to Manchester.
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Ned said:
The fact remains that many people debated the possible impact on Chester with Blue Planet opening
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I can't help thinking that it was not a coincidence that Chester's plans for new aquarium developments were shelved around that time.
 
I'm no expert,but I was assume it better to start out small and gradually build out the collection,unless they have clear funds to start out big and continue to spread out,given the availability of space. Howletts and Wingham are within 3 miles or so of each other in Kent. Are they each feeling the negatives from the other,? If not,then maybe Manchester might not affect Chester and vice versa in years to come. That remains to be seen?
 
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