Mountain Gorillas in captivity.

[Pertinax]

This confirms that Sumaili, at the Bronx, and thought at the time to be a Mountain Gorilla, was in fact graueri, because she came from Cordier.
I should probably know this, but were Mbongo & Ngagi [San Diego pre-war] graueri as I suspect?

So also was the young male 'PiliPili' which they obtained from Antwerp as a 'mate' for 'Sumaili' who had grown up with the Western Lowland male 'Mambo'. For a while Bronx then exhibited a pair each of Eastern Gorillas(Sumaili/PiliPili) and Western Gorillas (Mambo/Oka.) at the same time.

Mbongo and Ngagi were definately 'graueri' also.

 

[Pertinax]

Does anybody know for sure?

Never been sure about Meng. Do you have any photos you could put up of the various young Gorillas ZSL received?- Meng, Reuben, Tanga?

 

[Tim May]

Along similar lines, the gorilla 'Meng' that London Zoo acquired in 1938 was then considered to be a mountain gorilla. I assume that this animal, too, was really an eastern lowland gorilla but am not certain. Does anybody know for sure?

Never been sure about Meng. Do you have any photos you could put up of the various young Gorillas ZSL received?- Meng, Reuben, Tanga?

I have an old 1930s postcard depicting the young ‘Meng’.

Although I recall seeing the genuine mountain gorilla ‘Reuben’ several times in the old London Zoo Monkey House, circa 1960/61 I was only a very young child at the time and sadly took no photographs of him. There is, though, a very nice photograph of ‘Reuben’ in the ZSL Annual Report for 1960.

I don’t recall ever seeing photos of ‘Tanga’ who, was, I think, acquired as a mate for ‘Reuben’ and was considered to be a mountain gorilla but was really an eastern lowland.

I can scan both the postcard on ‘Meng’ and the ZSL Annual Report photo of ‘Reuben’ and send them to you.

However, I’m always worried about posting such published pictures on a public forum for fear of contravening copyright regulations.

 

[Pertinax]

However, I’m always worried about posting such published pictures on a public forum for fear of contravening copyright regulations.

Good point. Don't worry about sending though...

 

[tschandler71]

Yes, they were eastern lowland gorillas not genuine mountain gorillas.

Along similar lines, the gorilla 'Meng' that London Zoo acquired in 1938 was then considered to be a mountain gorilla. I assume that this animal, too, was really an eastern lowland gorilla but am not certain. Does anybody know for sure?

Just an educated guess but considering the areas that Eastern lowlands inhabited were British colonies that would make sense.

 

[FBBird]

Mountain Gorillas

Never heard of Tanga; I imagine that, like Reuben, she was short lived?

 

[Tim May]

Never heard of Tanga; I imagine that, like Reuben, she was short lived?

Yes, sadly she was short lived.

 

[IanRRobinson]

Just an educated guess but considering the areas that Eastern lowlands inhabited were British colonies that would make sense.

Nope.
graueri is only found in DRC, which was Belgian.
beringei is found in DRC (see above) and Rwanda (German until 1918 and Belgian thereafter). The Bwindi Forest is in Uganda, which was British, and is where I believe "Reuben" came from.

Until 1918, when the German colony of Kamerun was partitioned between the UK (the northern part of the British mandate is now in Nigeria, the southern joined the French element to form Cameroon), the only other gorillas in British territory would have been the Cross River animals.

Most Western Gorillas were found in French territory, apart from Equatorial Guinea (Spanish until 1968, which is why Snowflake went to Barcelona), and the Angolan enclave of Cabinda (which was Portuguese until 1975).

 

[tschandler71]

I was thinking Eastern Lowlands were in Uganda my mistake.

 

[Pertinax]

The Bwindi Forest is in Uganda, which was British, and is where I believe "Reuben" came from.

I believe 'Reuben' came from the Kisoro district of Uganda, and from the Virunga volcanoes rather than Bwindi- a small portion of the Virungas is in Uganda too- so he was a true 'Beringei'. His capture is described in Walter Baumgartel's book' Up Among the Mountain Gorillas'. Baumgartel ran a hotel for tourists 'The Traveller's Rest' at Kisoro. 'Reuben' was found locally in the forest by a gameguard, he was sitting by the dead body of a Silverback and appeared to have become isolated from his natal group.

 

[Pertinax]

Never heard of Tanga; I imagine that, like Reuben, she was short lived?

For a very short period circa 1960-2, ZSL exhibited all three Gorilla races/subpecies/species then known- G. gorilla(Guy) G.graueri (Tanga) G. beringei (Reuben) at one time.

 

[snowleopard]

I recently came into possession of a San Diego Zoo guidebook from 1947, and it differentiates between the mountain and lowland gorillas that the zoo held over the years. Mbongo apparently weighed at least 618 pounds and was at the zoo for 10.5 years; Ngagi weighed 635 pounds at his death in 1944. A sentence in the guide states that "these gorillas were captured by the Martin Johnsons in the autumn of 1930 when they were probably between four and five years old."

There is a photo of an adult mountain gorilla as well as a second photo of two immature mountain gorillas. The guidebook explains how San Diego up to that time had also kept 5 lowland gorillas at various times over the years, including a trio of infant specimens that were named Albert, Bata and Bouba.

 

[FBBird]

Mountain Gorillas in captivity

Mbongo and Ngagi were Eastern Lowland, as were most of the 'Mountain' Gorillas imported (like Chester's Noelle and Mukisi)

 

[Pertinax]

The guidebook explains how San Diego up to that time had also kept 5 lowland gorillas at various times over the years, including a trio of infant specimens that were named Albert, Bata and Bouba.

The photos would probably have been of the same animals i.e. Mbongo and Ngagi as youngsters and then one of them as adult.

I saw Albert, Bouba and Bata in thier concrete 'grotto-style' enclosure on my only visit to San Diego circa 1980. Those three never bred, having been reared together from babies, but Albert did breed in his middle age with a later, younger female 'Vila' to produce San Diego's first ever baby- a female 'Alvila'.

The other two Lowlands they had previously were two young females 'Kenya'(the older one) and(I think, from memory) Kivu which came together from the dealer Trefflich's, part of a consignement of eight young Gorillas which went to various US Zoos. They were actually obtained as 'mates' for the two adult Eastern Lowland males(Mbongo and Ngagi). Kivu died very quickly, and the big male 'Mbongo' around the same time. That left 'Ngagi' and 'Kenya'. I believe (from Belle Benchley's book 'My friends the Apes) that despite a fairly large age difference, they were going to be put together but both died before it could be organised.