Multiple Species Enclosures

ah ha, ive been there, whats it called, gremlins forest? couldnt remember the two species being mixed, but glad to hear the combination works, particulalry as these two species could just about be the 'most available' long term here in oz and nz
 
It's called something like that yes. Edinburgh also mixes Socorro doves with Bali starlings. These are the 2 rarest birds in the zoo. There are less than 50 socorro doves in the world all of them in zoos.
 
Zooish said:
Agree with you on the chimps grantsmb.

For orangutans, if there are young and juvenile, they can be extremely playful and are no less active than other primates. They have boundless energy especially if enough of them are around to form a playgroup of sorts. The older ones are more laid back though.

Besides Siamangs, Orangs have been mixed with Asian otters here in Singapore as well as in Germany (Tierpark) as far as i know. Orangs may be the most placid of the great apes but they're still exceedingly strong and i've seen one of our orangs pick up and fling a poor terrapin with malicious force. Thankfully the terrapin landed in the moat and was unhurt.
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Yes, I was really referring to Adult Orangutans- you're right about the juveniles though. Its when they become mature and start just lying around or hiding under woodwool/sacks etc that I think they begin to make a not- very -good exhibit. This is particularly noticeable with Bornean Orangs- they seem to put on fat quickly and are more lethargic generally than their Sumatran counterparts. I'd be interested to know if places like Melbourne's or Adelaide's new enclosures have increased the activity 'budget' for their Sumatran orangs.

You're right about their strength, and they're very cunning too...
 
I was told that Orangs have their main grip in between their middle and index finger wheras ours is Index to thumb. They can break fingers apparently
 
Orangs are real smart, one at the Toronto zoo used to pick the lock of the door in its exhibit and then go and sit up on the top part of the roof every day, the keepers at first could not work out how the Orang could open the door as they could not find any thing that could be used to do that so one day a keeper stayed just out of sight watching to see what was going on, what the keeper saw really surprised them as soon as the Orang thought it was clear he got a bit of wire ( i think it was a paper clip) which he kepted UNDER his top lip all day and jiggled the lock untill open, How start is that!.
 
MARK said:
Orangs are real smart, one at the Toronto zoo used to pick the lock of the door in its exhibit and then go and sit up on the top part of the roof every day, the keepers at first could not work out how the Orang could open the door as they could not find any thing that could be used to do that so one day a keeper stayed just out of sight watching to see what was going on, what the keeper saw really surprised them as soon as the Orang thought it was clear he got a bit of wire ( i think it was a paper clip) which he kepted UNDER his top lip all day and jiggled the lock untill open, How start is that!.
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Yes, I've heard several tales of this sort- as I said above, they are very intelligent but cunning too. As far as strength is concerned, at San Diego one was able to undo bolts in its cage which had been tightened using machinery.

I'm also interested in their nature in captivity, particularly adult males. Some are regarded as highly dangerous and at least one has killed a keeper- yet I've also seen photos of keepers at more than one zoo handfeeding an adult male while in the cage. I have a feeling Bornean males may be the more dangerous.
 
Writhedhornbill said:
Puluh at Chester has escaped onto the roof several times.
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I knew Puloh had been on an 'excursion' at least once as they had to deny him access outside for a while. For all you Oz forum people, Chester's male Sumatran orang 'Puloh' was born at Perth Zoo(Atjeh x Puan). He finally aquired his padded cheeks only quite recently at around 18 years old, but this delay to full maturity seems quite typical for most Sumatran males. Atjeh died a long time ago but his mother Puan at Perth may still be alive- she was a few years ago. Can anyone update me on that?
 
Puluh has produced 2 young with subis. She is a female sumatran orang that my friend hand reared. They still have a relationship with her. they wave to each other across the moat.

Puluh has produced 2 other young with another female but I don't know her name it might be Emma
 
MARK said:
Orangs are real smart, one at the Toronto zoo used to pick the lock of the door in its exhibit and then go and sit up on the top part of the roof every day, the keepers at first could not work out how the Orang could open the door as they could not find any thing that could be used to do that so one day a keeper stayed just out of sight watching to see what was going on, what the keeper saw really surprised them as soon as the Orang thought it was clear he got a bit of wire ( i think it was a paper clip) which he kepted UNDER his top lip all day and jiggled the lock untill open, How start is that!.
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Not surprising, they're a lethal combination of strength, intelligence and curiosity! The ones in Singapore have been known to pick locks too. They also learn to use sticks or gunny sacks to break hot wires. And when you have a big group of them, they require round-the-clock monitoring. The keepers take turns to keep a constant eye on them while they're on display.
 
Writhedhornbill said:
Puluh has produced 2 other young with another female but I don't know her name it might be Emma
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The other female is Subis's sister- Emma. Emma and Subis were both handraised as their mother Ramona wouldn't look after them. Their father was Oscar- he was born at Bristol zoo and still has one sister(Julitta) living and breeding at Jersey. Bristol don't keep Orangutans anymore.

Despite both being handreared, Emma & Subis have both turned out to be excellent mothers themselves. Do you know the sexes of the two more recent babies they have had?

Puloh is probably the only Orangutan from the Australian region now living in Europe.
 
Chester has 3 male and 3 female sumatran orangs. One of the males is Puluh, 2 of the females are emma and Subis. In 2005 Subis gave birth to budi and Emma Gave birth to Utara.One of these young females must have moved on or died.The other 2 males must be their previous young.

Well I think that's right?!?
 
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Writhedhornbill said:
Chester has 3 male and 3 female sumatran orangs. One of the males is Puluh, 2 of the females are emma and Subis. In 2005 Subis gave birth to budi and Emma Gave birth to Utara.One of these young females must have moved on or died.The other 2 males must be their previous young.

Well I think that's right?!?
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The first two babies of Emma & Subis were one male and one female. One of these may have gone elsewhere, or one of the two newer babies(Budi & Utara) could have died... These would have to be either two males, or one of each sex, depending on whether the older female young is still there or not..
The babies born in 2005 would not have been sent elswewhere(far too young) but one might have died..
 
As far as I know subis's baby is still alive. She is supposed to be a good mum. I don't know how they'll get on with gibbons in the new orang house. They've never seen them before. they've only seen humans and Waldrapp ibises before. They used to have an aviary next to the orangs.
 
Emma & Subis are both good mothers. If one of the newer babies has been lost its because of illness or accident, not neglect (they reared their first babies perfectly..) I think perhaps one of those two older ones could have been moved somewhere else.
 
The first two babies of Emma & Subis were one male and one female. One of these may have gone elsewhere, or one of the two newer babies(Budi & Utara) could have died... These would have to be either two males, or one of each sex, depending on whether the older female young is still there or not..
The babies born in 2005 would not have been sent elswewhere(far too young) but one might have died..
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From my knowledge Budi was a female. I don't know about Emma's baby Utara. I haven't had much dealings with her. I tend to watch Subis and Her young. Usually they're playing under those big brown sacks.

In the new Enclosure they'll have at least 3 times the amount of space that they have now. They be under a net as well. I think that this enables them to climb higher. I don't really know.
 
I can find out what sexes the babies are sometime soon. Orangutans love to cover themselves with sacks etc, but I hope perhaps in the new house they can give them something a bit more natural than sacking to play with- maybe huge banana leaves or something to hide under would be more in keeping with the design.

I think the new enclosure(when it opens) will have both indoor and outdoor areas- for both the Sumatran and Bornean Orangs?
 
Yes. They are thinking of Expanding both groups. I'll Ask someone about the Banana leaves. It's a Good Idea. Has it been done before?
 
I don't know, but I don't really like seeing them playing under Hessian Sacking- it takes away their dignity to my mind, though I know they enjoy it. I'd just rather see them given something more natural....
 
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