ZSL London Zoo New Western Lowland Male Gorilla

Kesho/Mjuku current organisation.

Do Mjuku + baby go outside on a daily basis now, and if so, what happens with Kesho- does he then go in the dayroom, or do the females still have access indoors as well? Is Kesho given access outside seperately, for part of the day as well?
 
I think the keepers organise the gorillas as they think appropriate throughout the day. On Wednesday Zaire was on her own outside, and Effie and Mjukuu and baby were in the gym – splendid views of Tiny, and the visitors are so awed and moved! – and Kesho was nowhere to be seen (there are off-show spaces as well, of course, though not outdoors). Often he's in the overhead corridor watching everyone. As far as I can make out it's not predictable where the animals are.
 
It was mentioned in another thread that since the loss of the baby, 'Kesho' and the females are now together as a group.
 
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Perhaps Tinkywinky had got wind of the rumour that has been circulating for a while, and is now confirmed as fact: Kesho has been found to be infertile. It's so ironic, after all the trouble he went to to ensure his genes would carry on, and no one else's! He has something called Klinefelter syndrome (found in humans, but very rare in gorillas, though not unknown) which has caused him to be sterile.

The news will probably be in the press over the weekend, with more detail no doubt.
 
Argh, another nail to London's gorilla breeding curse. :( Terrible news; do you reckon they'll risk sourcing a new fertile male whilst sending Kesho to a bachelor group elsewhere, but then I'm assuming that'll be too disruptive to the group's social structure.
 
Is he definitely infertile? According to Wicki in humans they are sometimes infertile or have reduced fertility. So just because he has it doesn't automatically mean he can't breed?
 
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RowanGreen said:
Is he definitely infertile? According to Wicki in humans they are sometimes infertile or have reduced fertility. So just because he has it doesn't automatically mean he can't breed?
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I thought the same thing. If its very rare in Gorillas how can they be sure he's infertile so soon- if it was after a long period without any pregnancies then certainly yes, but this does seem very early to be so positive that's the case.:confused:
 
If true thats just awful luck - does anything good ever happen for the Gorillas/keepers/staff at Gorilla Kingdom?
Does any anyone know how poor Mujukuu is now? What must have been a very traumatic time for her. How is she with Kesho?
 
Mjukuu is absolutely fine. She's a gorilla, not a human, and doesn't have anything like the same reactions that we might. She was mating with Kesho a couple of days after Tiny's death and the whole group of four has now settled down nicely and are together all the time.

As for Kesho's infertility, I can quote the memo to staff: "Our male gorilla Kesho has been found to suffer from a chromosomal abnormality which means he has an additional ‘X’ chromosome, so he has XXY chromosomes instead of just XY.

"In humans this disorder is recognised as Klinefelter syndrome. There is only one recorded case of this occurring in a gorilla in the past, but a common side effect in humans is infertility.

"Further tests by our vets have confirmed that Kesho is functionally sterile because of this abnormality. While we are obviously disappointed that Kesho is not a breeding male, we remain absolutely committed to his welfare, and that of our three female gorillas.

"There are no plans to remove Kesho from the group, and at the moment all four gorillas are exhibiting very positive behaviours and have settled into a good routine. Our primary objective is to have four happy, well adjusted, gorillas, and our wish is to maintain this social cohesion for as long as possible."
 
volvox said:
Mjukuu is absolutely fine. She's a gorilla, not a human, and doesn't have anything like the same reactions that we might. She was mating with Kesho a couple of days after Tiny's death and the whole group of four has now settled down nicely and are together all the time.

"Further tests by our vets have confirmed that Kesho is functionally sterile because of this abnormality. While we are obviously disappointed that Kesho is not a breeding male, we remain absolutely committed to his welfare, and that of our three female gorillas.

"There are no plans to remove Kesho from the group, and at the moment all four gorillas are exhibiting very positive behaviours and have settled into a good routine. Our primary objective is to have four happy, well adjusted, gorillas, and our wish is to maintain this social cohesion for as long as possible."
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1. I like the way you phrased that...;) In nature its a case of 'that baby died, oh well, let's get on and make another'.

2. I guess time will tell how accurate their tests are regarding whether Kesho is really sterile or not.

3. I think they may change that plan in the future if no more babies are forthcoming- I am quite sure that longterm they will still want a breeding group as against a non-breeding group of adults which, lacking young in the group, isn't normal from a social aspect and less of an attraction as an exhibit.

4. In all my years of tracking the fortunes of captive Gorilla groups, I've never come across such an illfated group as London Zoo's- it does seem as if it has a curse on it.
 
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Yes, it is a shame – for ZSL, but not for the gorillas, who are blissfully unaware of the implications! I know that breeding might take precedence in the future, but for the time being let's hope nothing else goes wrong and Zaire, Effie, Kesho and Mjukuu can settle down and enjoy themselves. They were certainly full of beans on Sunday!
 
I was wondering, does Kesho have a younger brother? I'm thinking it might be possible to have a second adult male in the group in that case, who might get a few matings even if Kesho is leader?
 
He's got three, the eldest is called 'Alf' (or Sekani) and he's 8. I'm sure Kesho would be happy to see him again! But I can't see that scenario happening somehow for various reasons;-

a. London would probably be nervous in case he carried the same thing.
b. Dublin only have a small group and probably wouldn't want to lose another animal from it at present.

But bringing in a different younger male could be a possibility if they don't want to upset the existing arrangement. A younger male in a group will often mate females when the silverback isn't looking, though I still remain to be convinced that Kesho is really a write-off in the breeding stakes.
 
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Unusually I can't agree with Pertinax here. It's a shame in many ways, but as he has a genetic abnormality he should be vasectomised if there is the slightest chance that he might be fertile.
It is certainly right to keep him with the females so he can mate with them and keep the group stable. There is no real hurry to find another male at the moment, but I bet they will test potential replacements very carefully.

Alan
 
Klinefelter syndrome isn't hereditary, it can't be passed on. It is "genetic" in that it's caused by a mistake in cell division during development in the womb, but it won't go further than the male it occurs in.
 
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