North American Asian Elephant Population 2023

[Jambo]

It doesn't sound offensive to my ear and none of the other Dublin elephants are getting name changes, so just changing one of their names (The name of the oldest animal at that!) puzzles me. Did the North American Asian Elephant Population already have a Yasmin or something?

Certainly puzzles me too, although I assume they have some sort of reason behind the name change. SheRa is quite an interesting name though; I assume it stands for something - perhaps paying tribute to someone or something.

That would be Billy. Budi's name was changed to Billy in Antwerp I think, but maybe the name change happened in Denver I don't know for sure.
Billy (Budi) at Denver Zoo in United States - Elephant Encyclopedia and Database

Billy's name was changed upon arrival to Denver.

 

[Wisp O' Mist]

Certainly puzzles me too, although I assume they have some sort of reason behind the name change. SheRa is quite an interesting name though; I assume it stands for something - perhaps paying tribute to someone or something.

I'm reasonably certain that the new name is a reference to animated heroine She-Ra: She-Ra - Wikipedia

Since the rename was apparently done at the request of a donor to the Cincinnati zoo, I'm going to assume that either the donor is a fan of the latest TV show featuring She-Ra (Which came out to in 2018 and has since achieved widespread acclaim) or that they have a kid who is. Lol.

 

[15399]

So how many individuals have been imported from Europe in recent years? I know of the 2.2 coming from Dublin to Cincinnati, and I know Smithsonian received 0.2 from somewhere in Europe earlier this year as well, have any others crossed the pond in the last, say, five years or so?

 

[IndianRhino]

So how many individuals have been imported from Europe in recent years? I know of the 2.2 coming from Dublin to Cincinnati, and I know Smithsonian received 0.2 from somewhere in Europe earlier this year as well, have any others crossed the pond in the last, say, five years or so?

Those are the only two European imports in the last couple years afaik. I believe Billy at Denver was the last European import (in 2013) before these two.

 

[Wisp O' Mist]

Those are the only two European imports in the last couple years afaik. I believe Billy at Denver was the last European import (in 2013) before these two.

It should also be noted that Billy (Whose original name was Budi) is Yasmin/SheRa's son. He's her second-born, out of four calves total.

 

[Jambo]

So how many individuals have been imported from Europe in recent years? I know of the 2.2 coming from Dublin to Cincinnati, and I know Smithsonian received 0.2 from somewhere in Europe earlier this year as well, have any others crossed the pond in the last, say, five years or so?

Those are the only two European imports in the last couple years afaik. I believe Billy at Denver was the last European import (in 2013) before these two.

It's been rare to have European individuals come over from Europe within the last few decades, these are the first imports from Europe in a decade.

Billy was indeed the last European import in 2013; and prior to that, I believe Phoebe and Lily to ALS in the early 90's were the ones prior to Billy.

Good news overall as the North American population could use new genetics, and obviously this is something they are looking to further improve (as evident with the two European imports this year).

 

[Jambo]

It should also be noted that Billy (Whose original name was Budi) is Yasmin/SheRa's son. He's her second-born, out of four calves total.

It presents an interesting situation for the two calves at Cincinnati. I'd assume they would be sent elsewhere to a bachelor group (probably within the next year or two).

But considering they're more valuable to the global population than Billy is, there's probably a better chance at least one would be put into a breeding situation. Columbus, who will be soon be sending Sabu back, could be an option.

 

[Wisp O' Mist]

It presents an interesting situation for the two calves at Cincinnati. I'd assume they would be sent elsewhere to a bachelor group (probably within the next year or two).

But considering they're more valuable to the global population than Billy is, there's probably a better chance at least one would be put into a breeding situation. Columbus, who will be soon be sending Sabu back, could be an option.

I think it would do both Kabir & Sanjay good to stay at Cincinnati for the time being, even with Sabu's expected return. While Kabir & Sanjay have lived with a bull in their previous herd (Their shared father, Upali), he was transferred to another zoo when they were only 2 and 1 year(s) old respectfully.

Given that so many North American bull elephants of both subspecies are behavioral non-breeders, with a lack of social development from growing up in cow-only herds most commonly blamed... I don't think them getting to witness a proper breeding bull "in action" so to speak would be remiss.

 

[Nile Hippo Expert]

It presents an interesting situation for the two calves at Cincinnati. I'd assume they would be sent elsewhere to a bachelor group (probably within the next year or two).

But considering they're more valuable to the global population than Billy is, there's probably a better chance at least one would be put into a breeding situation. Columbus, who will be soon be sending Sabu back, could be an option.

Kabir and Sanjay will probably stay in Cincinnati for the time being, because they're on five and six years old right now, and bull elephants don't normally leave their mothers before the age of about 10 years, so they're still on the young side. I can also see the boys starting a bachelor herd with Sabu when he returns.

 

[Zorro]

Plus the young bull from the Melbourne zoo Australian herd imported a couple of years ago to Miami

 

[Jambo]

Kabir and Sanjay will probably stay in Cincinnati for the time being, because they're on five and six years old right now, and bull elephants don't normally leave their mothers before the age of about 10 years, so they're still on the young side. I can also see the boys starting a bachelor herd with Sabu when he returns.

Bulls can certainly be kicked out earlier than that; as early as four years of age in some circumstances. It really depends on the individuals and the adult females in the group - how long they can tolerate them for, so to speak.

It's certainly possible they could form a bachelor group with Sabu, but with females nearby, I'm not sure how well this would pan out.

 

[Jambo]

Plus the young bull from the Melbourne zoo Australian herd imported a couple of years ago to Miami

It's been a shame to see they haven't made use of Ongard yet.

The initial plan was for cows to be acquired for him at ZooMiami once their older individuals pass. He was also trained for AI in the meantime, which I don't think they've used him for yet.

He's a very valuable male though - being the offspring of two founders (and the only offspring of his mother)

 

[Nile Hippo Expert]

Plus the young bull from the Melbourne zoo Australian herd imported a couple of years ago to Miami

This post specifically meant animals imported from Europe and not around the world.

So how many individuals have been imported from Europe in recent years? I know of the 2.2 coming from Dublin to Cincinnati, and I know Smithsonian received 0.2 from somewhere in Europe earlier this year as well, have any others crossed the pond in the last, say, five years or so?

 

[Zoofan15]

Plus the young bull from the Melbourne zoo Australian herd imported a couple of years ago to Miami

It's been a shame to see they haven't made use of Ongard yet.

The initial plan was for cows to be acquired for him at ZooMiami once their older individuals pass. He was also trained for AI in the meantime, which I don't think they've used him for yet.

He's a very valuable male though - being the offspring of two founders (and the only offspring of his mother)

I hope we’ll get to see Ongard participate in the regional breeding programme soon given his genetic value. The North American and European population consists of numerous well represented elephants, but Ongard will be the only offspring of his founder mother. North America will never receive a more valuable bull from Europe.

It appears he’ll be the only Australasian export for a while. Sabai is surplus, but may be needed for social reasons e.g. to mentor bulls at Dubbo; or to join Luk Chai at Werribee.

 

[Wisp O' Mist]

Columbus, who will be soon be sending Sabu back, could be an option.

Would have to be Kabir if that's in the cards then. Sanjay's maternal grandfather Alexander is the full brother of one of Columbus' cows - Phoebe.

 

[Zoofan15]

Kabir and Sanjay will probably stay in Cincinnati for the time being, because they're on five and six years old right now, and bull elephants don't normally leave their mothers before the age of about 10 years, so they're still on the young side. I can also see the boys starting a bachelor herd with Sabu when he returns.

Bulls in captivity mature earlier than their wild counterparts and several zoos begin the transition of the bulls out of the herd around six or seven, completing this process a year or so later. Certainly by eight or nine years, young bulls can be strongly motivated to breed and cows are less tolerant of their presence.

Whether they could be integrated with Sabu and for how long depends on the personalities of all involved.

 

[Jambo]

Would have to be Kabir if that's in the cards then. Sanjay's maternal grandfather Alexander is the full brother of one of Columbus' cows - Phoebe.

That's true; considering Sanjay's close relation to a fair few of the individuals within the region, I'd assume Kabir would have more chance in being used as a breeding bull going forward.

 

[Wisp O' Mist]

Good news overall as the North American population could use new genetics, and obviously this is something they are looking to further improve (as evident with the two European imports this year).

I'm not so sure about that...

1993: Lilly & Phoebe. Full sisters, also full sisters to Alexander who will be mentioned with regards to other imports.

2013: Billy/Budi. Son of Alexander and Yasmin/SheRa. Nephew of the above mentioned Lilly & Phoebe.

2022: Trong Nhi & Nih Lihn. Trong Nhi's father is Alexander, making Nih Lihn Alexander's granddaughter. Niece and grand(?)-niece of Lilly & Phoebe. Half-sister & half-niece of Billy/Budi.

2023: Yasmin/SheRa, Anak, Kabir & Sanjay. Yasmin/SheRa is the mother of Anak, Billy/Budi & Kabir. Anak is the mother of Sanjay. Both Anak & Billy/Budi were sired by Alexander. Making them full siblings, Lilly & Phoebe's niece & nephew, half-siblings of Trong Nhi & half-aunt/uncle to Nih Lihn.

Kabir & Sanjay were sired by a bull named Upali, who thankfully isn't related to any of the above. However, Kabir is Yasmin/SheRa's son, making him Anak & Billy/Budi's half-brother. And Sanjay's half-uncle via Anak. Sanjay & Kabir are also 3/4 siblings thanks to their maternal relatives and shared father.

So yeah...

When it comes to genetic diversity, those four European imports? Not the best source of it, lol.

 

[Zoofan15]

I'm not so sure about that...

1993: Lilly & Phoebe. Full sisters, also full sisters to Alexander who will be mentioned with regards to other imports.

2013: Billy/Budi. Son of Alexander and Yasmin/SheRa. Nephew of the above mentioned Lilly & Phoebe.

2022: Trong Nhi & Nih Lihn. Trong Nhi's father is Alexander, making Nih Lihn Alexander's granddaughter. Niece and grand(?)-niece of Lilly & Phoebe. Half-sister & half-niece of Billy/Budi.

2023: Yasmin/SheRa, Anak, Kabir & Sanjay. Yasmin/SheRa is the mother of Anak, Billy/Budi & Kabir. Anak is the mother of Sanjay. Both Anak & Billy/Budi were sired by Alexander. Making them full siblings, Lilly & Phoebe's niece & nephew, half-siblings of Trong Nhi & half-aunt/uncle to Nih Lihn.

Kabir & Sanjay were sired by a bull named Upali, who thankfully isn't related to any of the above. However, Kabir is Yasmin/SheRa's son, making him Anak & Billy/Budi's half-brother. And Sanjay's half-uncle via Anak. Sanjay & Kabir are also 3/4 siblings thanks to their maternal relatives and shared father.

So yeah...

When it comes to genetic diversity, those four European imports? Not the best source of it, lol.

We need to face facts though that Europe aren’t gonna send North America their most genetically valuable elephants. The elephants they’re sending are surplus to their breeding programme for precisely that reason.

In the next 10-20 years, I anticipate we’ll see more imports of Australasian born elephants, which will hold far greater value to the North American programme. Australasia doesn’t currently have a large surplus, but it’s undoubtedly coming.

 

[Jonathan Petersson]

Cincinnati does not plan to move out Kabir and Sanjay anytime soon. Ideally the zoo wants to keep them in a bachelor herd but until then the two boys get along very well with Anak and SheRa.