Paignton Zoo orangutan bulu

how many orangutans are at fungirola ? and when did kadim die ? and no i dint know about nanggi good new - if there are more females there more babies
 
orang09 said:
how many orangutans are at fungirola ? and when did kadim die ? and no i dint know about nanggi good new - if there are more females there more babies
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Fuengirola has Nakal, female Mukah, their son Banggi, and male Bima. I was wrong when I said Lee Lee was there. He's been moved to Palmitos, in the Canary Islands, with male, Peek, and hybrid male Bassir. I'm afraid I don't have any details about Kadim ~ I'll keep looking!
 
so lee lee is still alive great news - are there any females there as 3 males arent gonna produce the goods lol so lee lee was kupo - kupo and giles offspring kk
 
orang09 said:
so what is bulu family tree ???? so she had 11 off spring and only nakal and gambira surrvied ? and is senja and bulu related as they both came from london zoo ?
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I've now seen some of Bulu's family tree in black and white rather than through hearsay etc. This is what I've got so far ~ I've got lots more data to plough through:

197? Bulu x Boy Stillborn
21/6/71 Bulu x Boy Suka (f)
30/5/74 Bulu x Boy Jantan (m) died 12/4/86
15/11/76 Bulu x ? miscarriage
17/9/77 Bulu x Saleh Sakan (f) died 25/9/77
3/3/79 Bulu x Dodo Bintang (m) died 23/11/84
22/4/83 Bulu x Anak Kadim (m) died 11/6/01
27/7/87 Bulu x Anak Stillborn
23/1/89 Bulu x Saleh Nakal
22/3/97 Bulu x Nakal Gambira

I was surprised to learn that Senja was not Bulu's daughter as I'd been led to believe, but was the offspring of Saleh and Kate. Chinta is Bulu's granddaughter, but through Kadim not Senja. Unless I've been misinformed, there's another son who died in France fairly recently. That would make 11 pregnancies but maybe her genes have not spread as far as we might have thought.
 
thank you ever so much so only two of bulu offspring are alive how sad but at least nakal has kept breeding so ggod news there - do u know any of the names of the deceased - many thanks gigit keep going on the info
 
The list hasn't come out exactly as I typed it. If you put a couple of spaces between, for example, Bulu x Boy and Jantan, you'll see that the 3rd name for each date is the offspring's name:)
 
Bulu's daughter Suka.

Suka was the other offspring of Bulu that survived to maturity and has bred.

She was sent in 1992 from ZSL to St Aignan sur Cher, in France, together with her young daughter 'Janah' born the previous year 1991 at ZSL(father Dodo)

I do not know if either of these two are still living..

Before she left ZSL, Suka had also produced;
male Jago born 1982, (father Anak) sent to Rhenen, Netherlands 1986
male Bako born 1987, (father Anak) sent to BorasPark, in Sweden in 1990.

So Bulu has three more grandchildren through Suka but I don't know which(if any) of these are still alive or breeding.
 
grantsmb said:
Suka was the other offspring of Bulu that survived to maturity and has bred.

She was sent in 1992 from ZSL to St Aignan sur Cher, in France, together with her young daughter 'Janah' born the previous year 1991 at ZSL(father Dodo)

I do not know if either of these two are still living..

Before she left ZSL, Suka had also produced;
male Jago born 1982, (father Anak) sent to Rhenen, Netherlands 1986
male Bako born 1987, (father Anak) sent to BorasPark, in Sweden in 1990.

So Bulu has three more grandchildren through Suka but I don't know which(if any) of these are still alive or breeding.
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This is fascinating - forget 'Who Do You Think You Are'! With your information I've tracked down Suka's family. She has died but I haven't found out when yet.
Boras Zoo: Bako x Sabine have produced Sol (f) 4/6/96 and Benjamin 11/11/98.
Nyiregyhaza Zoo: Jago x Jewel produced Joey 1/12/95
Rhenen Zoo: Jago x Bosja produced Bako (m) (another one!) 21/3/96
St Aignan sur Cher: Janah x Muda produced Bayu (m) 22/6/03

I aslo discovered that Charlie and Toli had a son, Dan, born 11/6/63, died 13/8/64. Bulu truly is a survivor. I was misled briefly by another 'Suka' who's still alive. I realise things used to be more haphazard, but isn't there a case now for babies to be given names not already in use!
 
Gigit said:
I also discovered that Charlie and Toli had a son, Dan, born 11/6/63, died 13/8/64.
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The reason Dan died was accidental. It seems cruel I know but they were worried that the infants weren't thriving if left with the mother so Bulu was removed at about one year old (hence the close birthdates) and when they they tried to remove 'Dan', Toli wouldn't give him up and accidentally asphyxiated him- a very sad tale I know...

Toli then had a 3rd pregnancy- I think she died during the delivery. Charlie lived on at ZSL for some years until he became ill and died. He wasn't partnered with another female after 'Toli'
 
grantsmb said:
The reason Dan died was accidental. It seems cruel I know but they were worried that the infants weren't thriving if left with the mother so Bulu was removed at about one year old (hence the close birthdates) and when they they tried to remove 'Dan', Toli wouldn't give him up and accidentally asphyxiated him- a very sad tale I know...

Toli then had a 3rd pregnancy- I think she died during the delivery. Charlie lived on at ZSL for some years until he became ill and died. He wasn't partnered with another female after 'Toli'
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Heartbreaking. Do you know if Bulu was separated from her babies? Her birth dates are very close too. I only have information on Nakal who appears to have been transferred to B. Hewlett ( Brentwood?) at the age of 10 months. I don't know whether he returned to London before coming to Paignton. Any information you have will be gratefully received :)
 
Gigit said:
Heartbreaking. Do you know if Bulu was separated from her babies? Her birth dates are very close too. I only have information on Nakal who appears to have been transferred to B. Hewlett ( Brentwood?) at the age of 10 months. I don't know whether he returned to London before coming to Paignton.
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The theory at ZSL in the old days was that young chimps and orangs needed to be removed from their mothers at a year old as otherwise they didn't continue to prosper. (There may indeed have been some evidence for this.)
No Orangutans were born at London between Toli's death and Bulu(and Twiggy) starting to breed. By then diets and nutrition had improved considerably(but not housing!) and I think they reared their young with less drastic interference as previously.
However I'm unsure whether any of the young from this era were partially or fully handraised. Bulu's birthdates are close but this is probably because a lot of her babies died young. I can find no reference to the transfer of Nakal to 'B. Hewlett' I rather suspect this may have been a partial handraising in a keeper's home(Mr Hewlett?) before he was returned to the zoo(london)
 
Here's another "wow" from Bulu's family tree:
9/11/97 at Rhenen, Jago x Bosja produced stillborn TWINS, one male and one female.
This was only a year after Bako's birth so presumably he was removed for some reason.
Regarding Nakal, it looks as though he did go back to London before moving to Paignton. The research continues!
 
Gigit- Have you seen the London Zoo (colour) postcard of Toli and Bulu? Its a good photo- if not, and I come across a spare copy anytime, I will let you know.
 
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