Parental Control of Child Visitors

[Brum]

I'm a school teacher and I would never let my class behave in this way. Please don't generalise like this, I'm actually offended!! As I'm sure some parents on this thread are too!

As I stated earlier, I'm a father of three and I'm not offended because my kids can (and do) behave.
Mazfc, if you keep control of your class then kudos to you, unfortunately I too have seen teachers turn a blind eye on many, many occasions. On an end of year outing to Twycross about 15 years ago my own teachers were noticeably absent when it came to keeping an eye on their charges. It was so bad that me and a friend were not allowed in the reptile/tropical house because of earlier actions of certain classmates.

 

[gentle lemur]

Speaking as a retired teacher, I tried to avoid 'awaydays' like the plague. Many years ago I took my class of secondary pupils to London, Whipsnade and Longleat. At London I gave them a good warning beforehand and kept them in a group round the zoo. I didn't let off them off the leash until they reached their ultimate goal - the Gift Shop I was proud of them; they moaned about me.
Whipsnade is so big that I could trust them on their own (as they were older) and there were no problems. Longleat was fine on the coach and in the boat - but much harder work as my colleagues handed me the microphone and made me do a running commentary.
I would add one more point in defence of my former colleagues; by July, all the best teachers are exhausted!

Alan

 

[Pertinax]

I'm a school teacher and I would never let my class behave in this way. Please don't generalise like this, I'm actually offended!! As I'm sure some parents on this thread are too!

I am very pleased to hear that. But many of us on here have been regular Zoo goers for many years now, and this business of uncontrolled school visits does seem a perennial problem- particularly the 'end of year' ones. You only have to look at the number of posts on here describing different people's experiences, both past and present.

Obviously not all school groups are badly behaved when they go on zoo outings- yours obviously aren't- but I still think the well-behaved ones are perhaps the minority. Partially I think it is the responsibility of the schools and staff, but also partially the Zoos. The zoos want them to visit, but seem not to care about the discomfort and disruption to other peoples' enjoyment, not to mention disturbance to their animals, so I blame them equally for not taking a firmer stance on behaviour standards on their property.

 

[Pertinax]

i think it is absolutely ludicrous that children should be banned from zoos. Zoos are important to educate children on the world around them, therefore it is down to the teachers, parents and zoo to make sure the make sure that objective is fulfilled.

I think that was said in jest. Obviously Children are vital to zoos, they are their lifeblood really. Having been involved with zoo education in the past, I would obviously support that. Well organised school groups, visiting to study a particular topic or group of animals, or younger children making a more generalised visit are all fine. It is children just running free and out of control I object to- I think better policing by the Zoo is the only real remedy to that problem.

 

[TARZAN]

Bad behaviour in zoos by school trips was dealt with by one zoo director in the following, she would make it her business to go onto the coach when it arrived on the premises and inform the teacher in charge that bad behaviour would not be tolerated on the premises, if they didn't behave then they would be back on their coach, out the gates, and down the road. And woe betide any little brat who she caught teasing the animals or throwing litter on the ground:

 

[canaryboy]

Bad behaviour in zoos by school trips was dealt with by one zoo director in the following, she would make it her business to go onto the coach when it arrived on the premises and inform the teacher in charge that bad behaviour would not be tolerated on the premises, if they didn't behave then they would be back on their coach, out the gates, and down the road. And woe betide any little brat who she caught teasing the animals or throwing litter on the ground:

I guess that was the dictator of twycross herself. Although I went on a school trip 2 years ago there and she never came on our bus! One of my fellow students was teasing a spider monkey and the keeper was very strict. Good on her!

 

[TARZAN]

I guess that was the dictator of twycross herself. Although I went on a school trip 2 years ago there and she never came on our bus! One of my fellow students was teasing a spider monkey and the keeper was very strict. Good on her!

No, it was not the previous director, it was somebody far better than that, give you a clue, she liked chimps

 

[Indlovu]

I recall the Trentham Monkey Forest for being very good in terms of staff managing the behaviour of children (and adults for that matter), everything was very calm and friendly, which helped create a very peaceful atmosphere which obviously led to the Barbary Macaques being much more active and inquisitive.

 

[TARZAN]

I'm a school teacher and I would never let my class behave in this way. Please don't generalise like this, I'm actually offended!! As I'm sure some parents on this thread are too!

How can you be offended by people speaking the truth about their bad experiences at zoos when their visit has been spoilt by bad behaviour of not only the school children but also the teachers who do nothing about it, childish stupidity I can understand, adult stupidity I cannot, School teachers?, I think some of them could do well to enter the real world, they have never been anywhere but a classroom all their lives, in their cosy little classroom world they might think they are the bees knees with their 14 weeks plus paid annual holidays, put them in the real world, they wouldn't last a tomato season, yours is a typical attitude of teachers, how can anybody even dare to criticise us?

 

[FBBird]

Parental control.....

Two things here:
1/ Among a lot of other jobs, I've tried teaching. It's the single most exhausting thing you can do. The hours are a lot longer than they look [what with out of school clubs, setting & marking homework, & lesson planning], and if teachers didn't have long holidays they would not survive. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people who think that, because they've been to school, they know about teaching. However, I would agree that a varied life/work experience is likely to make one a better teacher.
2/ I worked in children's homes for some years, and took many minibus-loads of teenagers to zoos & to Longleat. Many of these kids had suffered various kinds of abuse, had been thrown out of school and/or had criminal records. BUT, all were respectful of the animals and their environment -- I pushed the message that it was the animals' home, we were their guests, and should behave. Worked with my own kids too.

 

[Maguari]

How can you be offended by people speaking the truth about their bad experiences at zoos when their visit has been spoilt by bad behaviour of not only the school children but also the teachers who do nothing about it, childish stupidity I can understand, adult stupidity I cannot, School teachers?, I think some of them could do well to enter the real world, they have never been anywhere but a classroom all their lives, in their cosy little classroom world they might think they are the bees knees with their 14 weeks plus paid annual holidays, put them in the real world, they wouldn't last a tomato season, yours is a typical attitude of teachers, how can anybody even dare to criticise us?

As someone with various friends and relatives who are/were teachers, can I just say... what?!

What definition of 'real world' are you using here?

The potentially offensive bit was, as I see it, the implication that all teachers didn't care, which is plainly untrue. No-one's disputing individual cases.

 

[Maguari]

Two things here:
1/ Among a lot of other jobs, I've tried teaching. It's the single most exhausting thing you can do. The hours are a lot longer than they look [what with out of school clubs, setting & marking homework, & lesson planning], and if teachers didn't have long holidays they would not survive. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people who think that, because they've been to school, they know about teaching. However, I would agree that a varied life/work experience is likely to make one a better teacher.
2/ I worked in children's homes for some years, and took many minibus-loads of teenagers to zoos & to Longleat. Many of these kids had suffered various kinds of abuse, had been thrown out of school and/or had criminal records. BUT, all were respectful of the animals and their environment -- I pushed the message that it was the animals' home, we were their guests, and should behave. Worked with my own kids too.

Wise words on both counts.

 

[Pertinax]

Interesting that this discussion has switched more to the behaviour of schoolgroups, rather than the original title of 'parental control'. It does indicate that the former may be at least as much, if not more, of a problem for regular Zoo-visitors.

 

[TARZAN]

As someone with various friends and relatives who are/were teachers, can I just say... what?!

What definition of 'real world' are you using here?

The potentially offensive bit was, as I see it, the implication that all teachers didn't care, which is plainly untrue. No-one's disputing individual cases.

My definition of the "real world", I reiterate many school teachers have never been in it, they were at school themselves as pupils, then college, then back to school as teachers, they have never known anything else, unlike, say the work of a police officer or a nurse, who at times, really do a stressful job, but do not get three months off on full pay annually. I have always found in adult life during my years in business that most teachers have a rather superior attitude towards people, some try to talk to you as if you are one of their pupils, which I hasten to add they do not get away with me, I have never come across this attitude with members of the medical or vetenary profession, so why do teachers have this attitude?. I cannot understand how you can find what I said to be "potentially offensive" nor can I understand how you think I am suggesting that teachers do not care, rather confused there, sorry.

 

[Maguari]

My definition of the "real world", I reiterate many school teachers have never been in it, they were at school themselves as pupils, then college, then back to school as teachers, they have never known anything else, unlike, say the work of a police officer or a nurse, who at times, really do a stressful job, but do not get three months off on full pay annually. I have always found in adult life during my years in business that most teachers have a rather superior attitude towards people, some try to talk to you as if you are one of their pupils, which I hasten to add they do not get away with me, I have never come across this attitude with members of the medical or vetenary profession, so why do teachers have this attitude?. I cannot understand how you can find what I said to be "potentially offensive" nor can I understand how you think I am suggesting that teachers do not care, rather confused there, sorry.

My point is that you are using an arbitrary definition of 'real world' to suit your argument and enable you to unfairly belittle a whole profession, based on little more than the fact that schools have holidays.

And while I'd be a fool to suggest that teachers spend all summer working, if you really think their work is limited to 8.30-3.30 Monday to Friday in term time then you have no understanding of the job.

Anyway, I won't debate further as we're in danger of overtoppling an already slightly off-topic thread.

 

[Gigit]

Children in European zoos seem far, far, better behaved than here in the UK. I noticed it some years ago visiting a few Dutch zoos. What do we do wrong that they can get right?

You haven't come across unsupervised European students from English language schools 'enjoying' a day at the zoo then? Maybe they're only well behaved at home.

 

[mazfc]

My point is that you are using an arbitrary definition of 'real world' to suit your argument and enable you to unfairly belittle a whole profession, based on little more than the fact that schools have holidays.

And while I'd be a fool to suggest that teachers spend all summer working, if you really think their work is limited to 8.30-3.30 Monday to Friday in term time then you have no understanding of the job.

Anyway, I won't debate further as we're in danger of overtoppling an already slightly off-topic thread.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Tarzan: I could launch into a run down of my career before teaching. I became a teacher at 31 and took a £10,000 pay cut to do so. Not easy for a single working class woman, but I won't as you know so much more about all teachers than me, and this argument will just go round and round in circles. You've obviously had bad experiences that have clouded your judgement and this can only let you talk about education professionals in generalised terms, which was the point of my first post.

I don't dispute that some school parties behave inappropriately and should be spoken to, whether by teachers or zoo staff. I'd certainly be mortified if someone else felt that they had to chastise my groups, I don't take my eyes off them for a minute.

My advice to anyone having issues would be complain to the school in question (its not hard to find out who the school is), my head would not be happy with staff or teachers that generated a complaint!

 

[KEEPER]

I saw a lot of children (Spaniards and tourist from various countries) with a very wrong attitude in zoos and aquariums and his parents do nothing for to correct the inadequate attitude of his/her childs.
Irresponsible teachers too but not in a very biggest amount.

 

[crust2007]

I visit monkey world. And i am appalled at the behaviour of children,there are signs up asking visitors to not bang on the glass or throw food in. Numerous occasions i have seen children doing this and the parents are watching and do nothing. The problem is lack of discipline. If your kids cant behave don't take them to these places. I have always shown respect to the animals why cant others?

 

[Pertinax]

You haven't come across unsupervised European students from English language schools 'enjoying' a day at the zoo then? Maybe they're only well behaved at home.

I was actually referring to younger children in 'family group' settings in the above. I know what Foreign Language students can be like in this country but wonder if groups of English teenagers would be even worse in the same situation abroad!