Planet Zoo Planet Zoo!

Fresco3 said:
I think largely because one is a synonymous zoo animal and the other is not, and this is a zoo game. But this paragraph sums it well from the forum:

Breeding programs for some threatened species have been successful. However, three-toed sloths are very difficult to maintain in captivity. They often do not survive, nor reproduce. For years, many have tried to maintain them artificially outside the Tropics, and nearly all have failed. According to Dr. Jutta Heuer, from Halle Zoo, Germany, one of the world experts in sloth husbandry in Europe, there is little to no experience with keeping, breeding and feeding three-toed sloths in captivity.

“A modern and serious zoo should never bring wild animals in without knowing this basic information. As studbook keeper for two-toed sloths in Europe I can say that because of ignorance and lack of experiences from zoos, a lot of sloths paid with their lives in the past,” says Heuer.

Recently, the Dallas World Aquarium has been able to maintain a small population of three brown-throated three-toed sloth (Bradypus variegatus) – another sloth species that is not endangered – by providing fresh Cecropia leaves to them flown in from Hawaii. But these three animals are the only ones which survived out of the nine sloths Dallas Aquarium imported from Venezuela and Costa Rica in the past 15 years. The only baby sloth born in captivity died 7 months later and had been conceived in the wild.'

Comes from this article: https://news.mongabay.com/2013/09/a...hs-sets-off-international-incident-in-panama/

I just think the whole idea is silly when the two-toed is right there. A staple of zoos across the world, extremely common. And they choose the species that’s held in one zoo outside of rescues in South America, and basically just dies in zoos in real life because they aren’t adapted to living in zoos. If anything, it’s just recklessly promoting the demand for three-toed sloths in captivity, which will only lead to more demand for wild individuals to be imported as ‘test beds’ for captive populations…
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There are tons of rescued three-toed sloths in Latin American zoos doing just fine. Planet Zoo is called just that Planet Zoo. It should be representing common zoo animals from around the planet. In a large region of the world, three-toed sloths are a common zoo animal. I see no issue here.

No one outside of North America has been able to keep Pronghorn and I haven't seen anyone complain about their inclusion.
 
Fresco3 said:
I think largely because one is a synonymous zoo animal and the other is not, and this is a zoo game. But this paragraph sums it well from the forum:

Breeding programs for some threatened species have been successful. However, three-toed sloths are very difficult to maintain in captivity. They often do not survive, nor reproduce. For years, many have tried to maintain them artificially outside the Tropics, and nearly all have failed. According to Dr. Jutta Heuer, from Halle Zoo, Germany, one of the world experts in sloth husbandry in Europe, there is little to no experience with keeping, breeding and feeding three-toed sloths in captivity.

“A modern and serious zoo should never bring wild animals in without knowing this basic information. As studbook keeper for two-toed sloths in Europe I can say that because of ignorance and lack of experiences from zoos, a lot of sloths paid with their lives in the past,” says Heuer.

Recently, the Dallas World Aquarium has been able to maintain a small population of three brown-throated three-toed sloth (Bradypus variegatus) – another sloth species that is not endangered – by providing fresh Cecropia leaves to them flown in from Hawaii. But these three animals are the only ones which survived out of the nine sloths Dallas Aquarium imported from Venezuela and Costa Rica in the past 15 years. The only baby sloth born in captivity died 7 months later and had been conceived in the wild.'

Comes from this article: https://news.mongabay.com/2013/09/a...hs-sets-off-international-incident-in-panama/

I just think the whole idea is silly when the two-toed is right there. A staple of zoos across the world, extremely common. And they choose the species that’s held in one zoo outside of rescues in South America, and basically just dies in zoos in real life because they aren’t adapted to living in zoos. If anything, it’s just recklessly promoting the demand for three-toed sloths in captivity, which will only lead to more demand for wild individuals to be imported as ‘test beds’ for captive populations…
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Oh wow, I didn't realize the state in captivity was quite that bad. In that case, yeah, it would have made a lot more sense to go with the two-toed. They probably went with three-toed because it's more well-known, but yeah, it doesn't make a ton of sense.

I also think it's a bit of an overestimation of the impact of Planet Zoo to think that it will do anything substantial to demand for captive wildlife. Unless (as is apparently a theme of mine in this thread :p) there's a precedent I'm unaware of.
 
birdsandbats said:
There are tons of rescued three-toed sloths in Latin American zoos doing just fine. Planet Zoo is called just that Planet Zoo. It should be representing common zoo animals from around the planet. In a large region of the world, three-toed sloths are a common zoo animal. I see no issue here.
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While I can’t confirm or debunk this for sloths that explanation still isn’t applicable to all animals. Dall sheep are one of the most snubbed animals out there and their captive population in the US is minuscule compared to bison and elk.

birdsandbats said:
No one outside of North America has been able to keep Pronghorn and I haven't seen anyone complain about their inclusion.
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The last pronghorn outside the North America died at the age of 15, which is close to the longest lifespan (17) I have seen when looking for pronghorn lifespans. Had the zoo in question (Kanazawa Zoo in Japan) was able to breed their animals beforehand or was not stumped by bio security laws, I believe that the zoo’s experience with Butch (the pronghorn in question) probably could have helped them and other zoos outside North America keep pronghorns. My point is pronghorns can be kept outside the US for a substantial time.
 
PossumRoach said:
The last pronghorn outside the North America died at the age of 15, which is close to the longest lifespan (17) I have seen when looking for pronghorn lifespans. Had the zoo in question (Kanazawa Zoo in Japan) was able to breed their animals beforehand or was not stumped by bio security laws, I believe that the zoo’s experience with Butch (the pronghorn in question) probably could have helped them and other zoos outside North America keep pronghorns. My point is pronghorns can be kept outside the US for a substantial time.
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The same of true for three-toed sloths - look at Dallas World Aquarium.
 
birdsandbats said:
The same of true for three-toed sloths - look at Dallas World Aquarium.
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Do you have a source that three-toeds are being kept ‘captive’ in dozens of rescues/zoos in South America?

I was under the impression that there’s the odd handful but most aren’t really captive per say in a zoo environment, but rather in simply meshed-off rehab/rewilding enclosures attached to the forests they live in - akin to somewhere like Dao Tien in Vietnam and their Lorises…

Are they actually abundantly held in captive enclosures in South American zoos? I know one zoo in Guyana did have some, and potentially the sloth sanctuary in Costa Rica (but that more falls into what i discussed above, not really ‘captivity’). Because, I imagine, if that is the case, so are Two-toed sloths, and then your argument falls completely apart, because the two-toed sloth has a more global captive distribution (including South America) whereas the three-toed cannot really be held outside its native range?

so by your own logic, the two-toed sloth was the better pick for Planet zoo…
 
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Fresco3 said:
Do you have a source that three-toeds are being kept ‘captive’ in dozens of rescues/zoos in South America?

I was under the impression that there’s the odd handful but most aren’t really captive per say in a zoo environment, but rather in simply meshed-off rehab/rewilding enclosures attached to the forests they live in - akin to somewhere like Dao Tien in Vietnam and their Lorises…

Are they actually abundantly held in captive enclosures in South American zoos? Because, I imagine, if that is the case, so are Two-toed sloths, and then your argument falls completely apart, because the two-toed sloth has a more global captive distribution (including South America) whereas the three-toed cannot really be held outside its native range?

so by your own logic, the two-toed sloth was the better pick for Planet zoo…
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I agree two-toed would have been better. But three-toed are not a bad pick and I think it's silly to complain about them.

Last I checked there were few to no Goliath Frogs in captivity, but no onw got mad about that.
 
birdsandbats said:
I agree two-toed would have been better. But three-toed are not a bad pick and I think it's silly to complain about them.

Last I checked there were few to no Goliath Frogs in captivity, but no onw got mad about that.
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presumably because that was base game and a regular exhibit. But plenty of people have been annoyed by the inclusion of the Himalayan Brown Bear, Proboscis Monkey, Platypus, Chinese Pangolin etc. for the same reasons and those are all held in significantly greater numbers in captivity than the three-toed sloth…

In fact, excluding glass exhibits like Goliath Frog and Titan Beetle, this may be the species with the lowest number of holdings in the game…
 
Fresco3 said:
presumably because that was base game and a regular exhibit. But plenty of people have been annoyed by the inclusion of the Himalayan Brown Bear, Proboscis Monkey, Platypus, Chinese Pangolin etc. for the same reasons and those are all held in significantly greater numbers in captivity than the three-toed sloth…

In fact, excluding glass exhibits like Goliath Frog and Titan Beetle, this may be the species with the lowest number of holdings in the game…
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I am willing to bet there are more three-toed sloth in captivity than Proboscis Monkey. They aren't uncommon in Latin American zoos, from what I've heard.
 
birdsandbats said:
I am willing to bet there are more three-toed sloth in captivity than Proboscis Monkey. They aren't uncommon in Latin American zoos, from what I've heard.
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Again, would love a source. At least Proboscis are held in a handful of Chinese Zoos, at least one in Japan, and Singapore.
 
Fresco3 said:
Again, would love a source. At least Proboscis are held in a handful of Chinese Zoos, at least one in Japan, and Singapore.
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Just looking through the gallery, I found three different zoos, all in Peru, keeping this species. Adding on DWA, that's at least four collections. I have seen photos from friends of several zoos keeping them Costa Rica and Panama as well.

Considering how little-covered Latin America is on this site there's likely many holders not documented here.
 
There are only two Peruvian Zoos in the gallery showing captive Three-Toed’s - Parque Zoologico Huachipa and Parque de Las Leyendas. Those alongside DWA in the US are the only three total in the gallery. Las Leyendas no longer holds the species and the latest photo of them there is 12 years ago.

So that’s, one confirmed zoo in Latin America that holds them…
 
Fresco3 said:
There are only two Peruvian Zoos in the gallery showing captive Three-Toed’s - Parque Zoologico Huachipa and Parque de Las Leyendas. Those alongside DWA in the US are the only three total in the gallery. Las Leyendas no longer holds the species and the latest photo of them there is 12 years ago.

So that’s, one confirmed zoo in Latin America that holds them…
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Two. And as I said, I've seen photos from friends of several zoos keeping them in Costa Rica and Panama.
 
birdsandbats said:
How is Parque de Las Leyendas not a zoo?

I have a non-ZooChat friend how did a zoo tour of Costa Rica and Panama several years ago. He saw Brown-throated Sloth at several different facilities.
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It is a zoo, so is London Zoo. But as I said, neither hold Three-Toed Sloths…
 
birdsandbats said:
And Amazonas Sueños del Momón Rescue Centre isn't, either?
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It sounds like exactly what I described previously, a semi-wild rescue with sloths in forested rehab enclosures attached to the forests. Not a zoo.

An Amazonian Dao Tien, Dao Tien is not a zoo. And seeing as it is a rescue, not dedicated to sloths. It’s hard to see that they actually have any permanent captive sloths. A single image of a sloths face 6 years ago (in what looks to be free-roaming) isn’t really evidence of captive sloths being kept.

so we are still at one…
 
birdsandbats said:
Brown-throated three-toed sloth, May 2016 - ZooChat

I do not understand why you would not consider that type of facility a zoo. It's not a traditional zoo, sure, but it is undeniably a zoo.
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because it doesn’t have any social media, no pictures online and appears to simply be an animal rehab and rescue with no permanent captive sloths?

So it’s not a permanent display of animals in a publicly accessible establishment..

so after all this we are still at one Latin American holder - Huachipa…
 
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