Question about "wild cattle" in Australia

Daktari JG

Daktari JG

Well-Known Member
10+ year member
What are they exactly? I have read that they are banteng. And I have read they are Bali cattle, which are the domestic form of banteng.

So are they generally considered banteng or Bali cattle?

It would make more sense that they were originally Bali cattle, but since they are now feral are they considered banteng?
 
Many domestic cattle have gone wild in Australia. Never heard of wild Banteng, and never seen anything that looked like one in the bush, although I have had several encounters, some quite scary!
 
Daktari JG said:
What are they exactly? I have read that they are banteng. And I have read they are Bali cattle, which are the domestic form of banteng.

So are they generally considered banteng or Bali cattle?

It would make more sense that they were originally Bali cattle, but since they are now feral are they considered banteng?
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They are descendants of domestic Banteng from Bali.
 
They are indeed believed to be originally descended from domesticated banteng aka "bali cattle". However genetic analysis of the Australian banteng confirmed that they are purebred, having never crossbred with other cattle species either in Bali or in the wilds of northern Australia and that also, they are indistinguishable from wild banteng genetically and physically. So to that extent they represent an interesting conundrum: This is an introduced so-called "pest" population of an endangered species and Australia now holds the biggest Banteng population in the world.
 
toothlessjaws said:
They are indeed believed to be originally descended from domesticated banteng aka "bali cattle". However genetic analysis of the Australian banteng confirmed that they are purebred, having never crossbred with other cattle species either in Bali or in the wilds of northern Australia and that also, they are indistinguishable from wild banteng genetically and physically. So to that extent they represent an interesting conundrum: This is an introduced so-called "pest" population of an endangered species and Australia now holds the biggest Banteng population in the world.
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Does anybody know what the difference is between Bali cattle and banteng? Is there some suggestion that some domestic cattle genes are mixed with banteng to form Bali cattle? Apparently some zebu breeds are result of mix with banteng and some other Asian species.

Is the assumption that the Northern Territory animals are the same as Javan banteng?

Indian hog deer would be another example of an endangered species feral in Australia...
 
tetrapod said:
Does anybody know what the difference is between Bali cattle and banteng? Is there some suggestion that some domestic cattle genes are mixed with banteng to form Bali cattle? Apparently some zebu breeds are result of mix with banteng and some other Asian species.

Is the assumption that the Northern Territory animals are the same as Javan banteng?

Indian hog deer would be another example of an endangered species feral in Australia...
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Bali cattle are domesticated Banteng, which makes the Australian population feral Bali cattle, which might be pure Banteng, but still descend from domesticated animals. Which makes the situation somewhat similar to the Cretan wild goat or the Cyprus mouflon, which closely resemble their wild ancestors, but are descended from domesticated animals.
 
The Australian situation is a bit complicated. The animals there were introduced in the 1840s and since then the Bali Cattle in Indonesia (originally derived solely from Banteng) have been hybridised with other domestic cattle species (zebu and western cattle). So the feral Australian animals are pure domestic Banteng while the domestic Bali Cattle in Indonesia are not.
 
Thanks Lintworm and Chli. Do domesticated banteng aka. Bali cattle (not those that have been hybridised) show any discernable features different from wild banteng? If not is there any reason not to look at the NT population as just a transplanted population of banteng (I realise that's a highly simplified argument)?
 
tetrapod said:
Do domesticated banteng aka. Bali cattle (not those that have been hybridised) show any discernable features different from wild banteng? If not is there any reason not to look at the NT population as just a transplanted population of banteng (I realise that's a highly simplified argument)?
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Banteng have been domesticated for around 5000 years (as an estimate). Compared to wild animals (i.e. in Java) the Bali Cattle are smaller and more gracile, have a smaller and narrower skull, smaller horns, less pronounced dimorphism between sexes, younger age of maturity, and shorter gestation. Basically, all the usual aspects one would expect from a domesticated ungulate where the effect is generally to make the animal more "juvenile" to enhance docility and ease of keeping. I have no idea if any of these traits have been "reversed" in the wild Australian population after 170 years.

A few years ago I used to be of the opinion that the Australian population was of similar use to the Australian Water Buffalo or Red Foxes - they don't belong there and would be best wiped out. I still don't think the Banteng belong in Australia of course, but they are a lot more "valuable" than I had given them credit for (before I learned that the domestic populations in Asia were no longer pure).
 
Chlidonias said:
Banteng have been domesticated for around 5000 years (as an estimate). Compared to wild animals (i.e. in Java) the Bali Cattle are smaller and more gracile, have a smaller and narrower skull, smaller horns, less pronounced dimorphism between sexes, younger age of maturity, and shorter gestation. Basically, all the usual aspects one would expect from a domesticated ungulate where the effect is generally to make the animal more "juvenile" to enhance docility and ease of keeping. I have no idea if any of these traits have been "reversed" in the wild Australian population after 170 years.

A few years ago I used to be of the opinion that the Australian population was of similar use to the Australian Water Buffalo or Red Foxes - they don't belong there and would be best wiped out. I still don't think the Banteng belong in Australia of course, but they are a lot more "valuable" than I had given them credit for (before I learned that the domestic populations in Asia were no longer pure).
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Interesting that they do show the same differences as other domesticates vs wild origin. I am guessing that feral domesticates normally revert back to a 'wild' type, so one would have to assume that the NT banteng would compare quite well with wild Asian banteng. Pity they don't seem to have been well studied.
I agree that ferals should be managed or eliminated in Australia (as for any other country). However from what little I had previously read, the banteng seemed to have minmal impact on the environment - probably because they never extended beyond the Coburg Peninsula. There is possibly an argument that some introduced species fall into a category of management rather than elimination. Both mandarin ducks and chinese water deer have substantial feral populations in the UK, while being alot rarer/endangered in their native range.
 
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