Sydney Zoo Sydney Zoo News 2023

[Zoofan15]

I swear I saw more at Melbourne.

To think of it, their enclosure was somewhat larger than I remember (going off of the map in the website)

They definitely only have three and have done since Yuska passed away last year. Prior to that, they held this quartet for several years. Melbourne have a large exhibit (opened 1990) and could easily accomodate more. I hope to see more females imported in the near future, which will hopeful stimulate breeding.

 

[AreOhAreWhy]

That is the plan, but this hadn’t been decided when Sydney Zoo opened in 2019. Since then, Taronga’s elephant calf has died and the herd has been reduced to two cows (one a non viable breeder) and it’s clear building up a herd will be an uphill struggle - a contributing factor to the phase out.

Though a bull elephant needs a larger paddock than a cow, by virtue of being solitary/semi-social, they can be accommodated in smaller exhibits than what a matriarchal herd requires and therefore aren’t unsuitable for city zoos who can provide this.

WP Zoo have had a good elephant program from what I can tell and have seen. I think that Taronga should just keep getting rescues and let WP and Werribee have successful breeding. However, it could be seen as quite cruel for the animals

 

[AreOhAreWhy]

They definitely only have three and have done since Yuska passed away last year. Prior to that, they held this quartet for several years. Melbourne have a large exhibit (opened 1990) and could easily accomodate more. I hope to see more females imported in the near future, which will hopeful stimulate breeding.

I went in this past december. Maybe because they were all running around I thought there was more than 3

 

[Zoofan15]

WP Zoo have had a good elephant program from what I can tell and have seen. I think that Taronga should just keep getting rescues and let WP and Werribee have successful breeding. However, it could be seen as quite cruel for the animals

Dubbo and Werribee are indeed the best place for breeding and the establishment of matriarchal herds. The perceptions towards elephants in captivity has changed hugely over the past two decades and city zoos have long been viewed as unsuitable for meeting their needs.

New Zealand and Australian circuses both phased out elephants over a decade ago. There are no more rescues available, so Taronga will surely commit to a total phase out.

 

[AreOhAreWhy]

Dubbo and Werribee are indeed the best place for breeding and the establishment of matriarchal herds. The perceptions towards elephants in captivity has changed hugely over the past two decades and city zoos have long been viewed as unsuitable for meeting their needs.

New Zealand and Australian circuses both phased out elephants over a decade ago. There are no more rescues available, so Taronga will surely commit to a total phase out.

Sucks that my favourite animal is going to be away from the dream zoo but its for the best

 

[The Sleepy Hippo]

Dubbo and Werribee are indeed the best place for breeding and the establishment of matriarchal herds. The perceptions towards elephants in captivity has changed hugely over the past two decades and city zoos have long been viewed as unsuitable for meeting their needs.

New Zealand and Australian circuses both phased out elephants over a decade ago. There are no more rescues available, so Taronga will surely commit to a total phase out.

It indeed has changed.
Melbourne Zoo's former strategic planning director David Hancocks, who helped design TOTE in the early 2000s in order to improve elephant welfare at MZ. In an article in 2008 it highlights his change in stance in a matter of a couple of years.

Animal rights and wrongs

"Hancocks helped design the enclosure, which he now says was a mistake. While he believes it to be better than any such exhibit in Australia, he says his study of elephants since has convinced him that no urban enclosure is adequate for them. He likens the enclosure to "being locked in a hotel room with four other people, not of your choosing, for the rest of your life"."

I remember reading another article on the topic where he was quoted as saying by the time it had actually opened (or not long after - couldn't refind the article so going off of memory) he was sad as he realised it was no where near enough to be acceptable and regretted not pushing more to have them transferred to Werribee in the early 2000s.

The 2008 article the quote is from does highlights that the main reason why the imported Thai elephants was they would have more exposure for education purposes at Melbourne and Taronga rather than their respective open-range zoos.

 

[Abbey]

Some updates from my visit to Sydney Zoo yesterday (19/04/2023):

• The orangutans have been introduced to a short network of aerial pathways which extended across the visitor pathway and along the boundary of the elephant exhibit opposite. It's not as long as that at Auckland Zoo (probably only about 100-200m), but a keeper said they have been tried to get the orangs to use it for about 6 months, but only recently have they taken to the O-Line.

Aerial pathways in use

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023
• 6

Female orangutan on aerial pathway

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023

Santan (male Sumatran Orangutan)

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023
• 1

• There are plans to use Kavi and Ashoka (the bull elephants) for breeding at some stage in the future, but not for at least five years. This was part of the keeper talk, so may have been a more general statement, but the keeper did specifically refer to the bulls being much more valuable genetically within the Australian population than they were in Europe.
• The Capybaras have been introduced into a new exhibit, which was in construction during my last visit in January. It is located next to the camels, opposite the tigers. The new exhibit is a bit smaller than the previous one I'd say, but the moat is pebbled, not water, so the animals are closer.

New Capybara exhibit

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023

New Capybara exhibit

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023

• The previous Capybara exhibit - the first on the right as you approach the Primate Boulevard from the entrance - is now signed for Ring-Tailed Lemur, which would be a new species for the zoo, but I didn't see any lemurs in the exhibit, so I suspect they are not on display yet.
• Not sure of spellings, but three of the zoo's pack of seven female African Painted Dogs are named Gadina, Fanta and Emi, in case that information is useful for anyone compiling a population list.

 

[Zoofan15]

Some updates from my visit to Sydney Zoo yesterday (19/04/2023):

• The orangutans have been introduced to a short network of aerial pathways which extended across the visitor pathway and along the boundary of the elephant exhibit opposite. It's not as long as that at Auckland Zoo (probably only about 100-200m), but a keeper said they have been tried to get the orangs to use it for about 6 months, but only recently have they taken to the O-Line.

Aerial pathways in use

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023
• 6

Female orangutan on aerial pathway

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023

Santan (male Sumatran Orangutan)

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023
• 1

• There are plans to use Kavi and Ashoka (the bull elephants) for breeding at some stage in the future, but not for at least five years. This was part of the keeper talk, so may have been a more general statement, but the keeper did specifically refer to the bulls being much more valuable genetically within the Australian population than they were in Europe.
• The Capybaras have been introduced into a new exhibit, which was in construction during my last visit in January. It is located next to the camels, opposite the tigers. The new exhibit is a bit smaller than the previous one I'd say, but the moat is pebbled, not water, so the animals are closer.

New Capybara exhibit

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023

New Capybara exhibit

• Abbey
• 20 Apr 2023

• The previous Capybara exhibit - the first on the right as you approach the Primate Boulevard from the entrance - is now signed for Ring-Tailed Lemur, which would be a new species for the zoo, but I didn't see any lemurs in the exhibit, so I suspect they are not on display yet.
• Not sure of spellings, but three of the zoo's pack of seven female African Painted Dogs are named Gadina, Fanta and Emi, in case that information is useful for anyone compiling a population list.

Thanks for the update @Abbey.

It’s nice to see the aerial lines at Sydney Zoo, which I think will become widespread across our region’s orangutan holding zoos (next up Adelaide and Perth).

Gadina, Fanta and Emi were mentioned transferring out of Altina in a pack of seven. The other four females in this pack were Hasina, Imani, Jaffa & Kamili.

Sydney’s bull elephants are from a very well represented line in Europe but they will eventually prove valuable to our breeding programme. Personally I think we’re looking at more like 15-20 years down the line as there’s still founder bull options to exhaust. Putra Mas is 34 years old (i.e. not gonna be around forever) and only has one surviving calf within the entire captive population so is our most valuable asset.

 

[Abbey]

Gorillas were on the cards initially, but not sure Taronga would be willing to give up some surplus males for a rival zoo.

Lemurs are more of a realistic option, especially for the soon to be vacant Capybara enclosure.

And unfortunate as it is, the male lions will probably be there until they pass. That could still be another decade away, so Sydney have plenty of time to consider whether they want to hold a breeding pride afterwards. The exhibits of suitable size for a breeding pair, plus cubs.

Congratulations @Jambo, you called it with lemurs for the capybara enclosure

 

[Zoofan15]

Congratulations @Jambo, you called it with lemurs for the capybara enclosure

They’re a good fit for Sydney Zoo. It’s nice to see their primate collection expanding. We never got the gorillas, but they still have two species of great apes in addition to the smaller primate species.

 

[PaddyRickMFZ]

They’re a good fit for Sydney Zoo. It’s nice to see their primate collection expanding. We never got the gorillas, but they still have two species of great apes in addition to the smaller primate species.

Are gorillas still a maybe or have they been entirely ruled out? I know very little about the facility but I heard there was some space near a cafe or smn

 

[Abbey]

Are gorillas still a maybe or have they been entirely ruled out? I know very little about the facility but I heard there was some space near a cafe or smn

I'm not personally sure how much land the zoo owns beyond its existing footprint - the zoo grounds are located within Western Sydney Parklands, which is a much larger area of recreational parkland space. Other members may know more about the capacity to expand, whether based on land the zoo currently has, or into the park more broadly. Whilst we're all zoo nerds, Western Sydney Parklands does have other purposes, so I doubt too much more of it would be given over to the zoo, as I believe the zoo is not operated by the same organisation as the parklands.

From what I know, I'd say that there isn't room at Sydney Zoo to house gorillas in an exhibit which will stand the test of time in terms of space, although bachelor males may be a possibility if it turns out that the zoo does have more room than would appear presently.

 

[PaddyRickMFZ]

I'm not personally sure how much land the zoo owns beyond its existing footprint - the zoo grounds are located within Western Sydney Parklands, which is a much larger area of recreational parkland space. Other members may know more about the capacity to expand, whether based on land the zoo currently has, or into the park more broadly. Whilst we're all zoo nerds, Western Sydney Parklands does have other purposes, so I doubt too much more of it would be given over to the zoo, as I believe the zoo is not operated by the same organisation as the parklands.

From what I know, I'd say that there isn't room at Sydney Zoo to house gorillas in an exhibit which will stand the test of time in terms of space, although bachelor males may be a possibility if it turns out that the zoo does have more room than would appear presently.

I see. I’m a bit confused, did Sydney initially confirm interest then retract it, or did they confirm interest and just haven’t gotten around to covering itself

 

[Abbey]

I see. I’m a bit confused, did Sydney initially confirm interest then retract it, or did they confirm interest and just haven’t gotten around to covering itself

The original maps for the zoo involved an exhibit for gorilla. That exhibit did get built, but now houses capuchin (you might already know this, but pretty much the whole layout of the zoo as it currently stands - except a new, smallish exhibit for capybara - was built in one go prior to opening in 2019).

Whether Sydney Zoo couldn't source gorillas at the time but still wants to hold them in the future, is a possibility, I honestly can't recall if the zoo has publicly said that it's no longer on the cards, other than the implicit evidence of the planned exhibit being filled by a different, smaller species with slightly different husbandry needs.

 

[PaddyRickMFZ]

The original maps for the zoo involved an exhibit for gorilla. That exhibit did get built, but now houses capuchin (you might already know this, but pretty much the whole layout of the zoo as it currently stands - except a new, smallish exhibit for capybara - was built in one go prior to opening in 2019).

Whether Sydney Zoo couldn't source gorillas at the time but still wants to hold them in the future, is a possibility, I honestly can't recall if the zoo has publicly said that it's no longer on the cards, other than the implicit evidence of the planned exhibit being filled by a different, smaller species with slightly different husbandry needs.

Apologies for bringing speculation into a news thread. Is the capuchin exhibit big enough for gorilla? I’d imagine they did have difficulty sourcing them, because an exhibit wouldn’t have to be too large to hold capuchin, therefore could be easily relocated.

 

[Zoofan15]

I see. I’m a bit confused, did Sydney initially confirm interest then retract it, or did they confirm interest and just haven’t gotten around to covering itself

Whether Sydney Zoo couldn't source gorillas at the time but still wants to hold them in the future, is a possibility, I honestly can't recall if the zoo has publicly said that it's no longer on the cards, other than the implicit evidence of the planned exhibit being filled by a different, smaller species with slightly different husbandry needs.

Sydney Zoo were widely speculated to receive the three young male gorillas (one now deceased) from Orana Wildlife Park, who in turn were planning to import gorillas from Europe to form a breeding troop.

Due to financial difficulties, Orana canned the Europe import and so wanted to retain the bachelor males they had.

It would be easy for Sydney Zoo to acquire bachelor males from within the reason. I’m sure Taronga for example would happily hand over their three young males, which they’ll have to otherwise accomodate in the Congo precinct. With this in mind, I’d assume Sydney Zoo are happy to continue without them.

 

[Zoofan15]

Apologies for bringing speculation into a news thread. Is the capuchin exhibit big enough for gorilla? I’d imagine they did have difficulty sourcing them, because an exhibit wouldn’t have to be too large to hold capuchin, therefore could be easily relocated.

No, I wouldn’t rate it as a gorilla exhibit in terms of size. Sydney Zoo had plans to acquire hippopotamus and years later (as exhibit standards have further progressed), we were all quite amazed they intended to cram them into the meagre space available.

Similarly, what is a decent sized capuchin exhibit would make for a small gorilla exhibit by current/future standards. Melbourne have a large complex and Taronga’s Congo precinct will surely be built to a similar quality - providing examples of what a city zoo should aspire too.

Sydney Zoo have chimpanzees and orangutans and accomodate them well. I believe this is where their investment in great apes will start and finish.

 

[The Sleepy Hippo]

Sydney Zoo were widely speculated to receive the three young male gorillas (one now deceased) from Orana Wildlife Park, who in turn were planning to import gorillas from Europe to form a breeding troop.

Due to financial difficulties, Orana canned the Europe import and so wanted to retain the bachelor males they had.

It would be easy for Sydney Zoo to acquire bachelor males from within the reason. I’m sure Taronga for example would happily hand over their three young males, which they’ll have to otherwise accomodate in the Congo precinct. With this in mind, I’d assume Sydney Zoo are happy to continue without them.

The Congo precinct involves both a breeding enclosure and a bachelor male enclosure.

 

[Zoofan15]

The Congo precinct involves both a breeding enclosure and a bachelor male enclosure.

That’s correct and my assumption is the three young males - Mjukuu (2014), Fabumi (2015) and Mwamba (2017) will occupy the bachelor exhibit. The point I was trying to make though is I’m sure Taronga Zoo would be delighted to offload these males elsewhere.

Having to accommodate them immediately fills the Congo precinct exhibits to capacity (bearing in mind they already have a breeding troop). Sending these males elsewhere means they can breed another 3-4 infants with total confidence they can accomodate them if they’re males. There isn’t otherwise be a lot of demand for them, which has previously restricted breeding in the region (as evidenced by artificial birth intervals at Taronga).

 

[Yassa]

Taronga might consider castrating young male gorillas so that they can stay in the family troop indefinately. Thats currently done in Europe with many young males - only those who are genetically underrepresented are left intact.