Taronga Zoo The next elephant birth
- Thread starter jay
- Start date
torie
Well-Known Member
Still ealrly days guys but it's looking hopeful!
Full-Time Care For Taronga's New Elephant Calf - Taronga Conservation Society Australia
Full-Time Care For Taronga's New Elephant Calf - Taronga Conservation Society Australia
I am at my happiest when picking up elephant ****!
While you two are sorting out the waste disposal details, can any serious elephant student tell me if there are any documented cases where bachelor groups of elephants of either species have been maintained for many, many years?
dragon(ele)nerd
Well-Known Member
well the most popular one that comes to mind is sevilla in spain's bachelor group of currently 6 young bulls. The first 4, Timber ( now at rotterdam) Though Maxim, Tjse Pyan and Maung Htoo have been there for around 7 and 8 years respectively.
Thanks Master Nerd. But tell me, are there any longstanding bachelor groups of mature bulls of either species?
dragon(ele)nerd
Well-Known Member
I can't think of any in zoos, though I know of Guruvayoor Desam Temple in Kerala. Holds 60 prime bull elephants for poorams.
Steve,
Asians don't do bachelor groups as well as Africans. I have no real captive examples but we had three Very large Bulls and when we walked them past eachother they would often strike out at each other and show serious aggression. We could never have more than one off the tether at a time. It seems in the wild African elephant bachelor herds are alot more common than Asian.
If you are wondering what will eventually house these two boys (and any future boys then I would be confident in saying that given the closeness in age and the relationship the will no doubt develop they will be fine together for many years, maybe only needing to be separated during musth. The other option would be to house them in two separate enclosures with fence contact. In my opinion there is no real reason to not have a mix of free and restricted contact when working with Bulls but our government zoos would never do this.
No matter where they end up they will have to go to another zoo that has elephants or be housed at a new facility together - given the illegality in most states of housing solitary elephants.
That's my two cents worth anyway! Sorry if this isn't what you were looking for.
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I am unsure of the sition here but temple elephants (especially Bulls) are often tethered for 90% of the day and their mahouts are often required to use force (sharp pointed ankus') when dealing with these animals. It may be different at the above mentioned temple but I think for this purpose it is best to compare with a zoo as the management style is completely different.
dragon(ele)nerd
Well-Known Member
I wasn't intentionally comparing really, I was just mentioning outside the box if Steve wanted to know.
sorry I'm going to go off topic here but In my opinion would be that Guruvayoor is the best temple in Kerala in terms of care. Three baths a day and a constant array of treats food and Nilavu training which is great for streching out muscles ( which is like enrichment)
It also causes tensions to run high though, a large mature bull being surronded by others of his age causes him to become more aggressive than usual. Even though there is a constant human interaction.
Though yes I would agree with you that basically all temple elephants are chained for an extended period of time being surronded by so many bulls in a close area causes musth to go on for months. The average I think being 2 months amongst temple elephants.
An elephant with the longest musth period I know of was an elephant called prahasanker and his musth period went for over 5 months each year.
sorry I'm going to go off topic here but In my opinion would be that Guruvayoor is the best temple in Kerala in terms of care. Three baths a day and a constant array of treats food and Nilavu training which is great for streching out muscles ( which is like enrichment)
It also causes tensions to run high though, a large mature bull being surronded by others of his age causes him to become more aggressive than usual. Even though there is a constant human interaction.
Though yes I would agree with you that basically all temple elephants are chained for an extended period of time being surronded by so many bulls in a close area causes musth to go on for months. The average I think being 2 months amongst temple elephants.
An elephant with the longest musth period I know of was an elephant called prahasanker and his musth period went for over 5 months each year.
I would hope that both bulls would end up as breeding bulls, as they epresent two seperate male lines. I could imagine this new calf eventually taking Gungs place at Taronga while Luk Chai would go to Melbourne taking over from Bong Su. This way both zoos would be able to breed their herds into the second generation.
I don't think there are. Elephants haven't been bred in sufficient numbers in zoos until recently for the need for 'bachelor' groups' to arise-so the ones that have been set up are young bulls mostly still in the immature phase.
Fully mature bulls in the wild sometimes form 'pairs' rather than larger groups. Even when they associate/move around together in the wild, they can choose their own 'space' from each other, when to be together and when to go their seperate ways.
BTW. I hope this 'miracle calf' survives, it certainly deserves to.
my vision of a bachelor group wouldn't consist of males in the same herd. it would be a scenario not unlike melbournes where the animals can have protected or unprotected contact on a case by case basis, but generally rotating between various paddocks during the day. they need not have separate barns either - i imagine separate stalls would suffice.
of course i too hope this guy makes it.
and thai for miracle is....?
of course i too hope this guy makes it.
and thai for miracle is....?
BTW. I hope this 'miracle calf' survives, it certainly deserves to.
It has already been unofficially christened Lazarus!
How do we know this? Are there any mature groups of African bulls anywhere?
BTW this is exactly the sort of info that I'm looking for - providing it can be verified. Thanks.