Things people do that irritate you when you go to the zoo?

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These people don't care about the law.

Unfortunately that's the case. They never give a second thought.

just recently I found an eastern brown snake basking on the path at school. when I informed one of the teachers he asked me to go to the garden shed and get a shovel. Of course I didn't.

there is almost always a less violent solution to deal with a situation such as this.
 
I'm CGSwans, and I approve this message.

Is your water python really your largest snake though? They don't get that big.

You haven't seen the waters on the Arnhem Highway, then!

Actually, my Diamonds and Inland Carpet are bigger, but the female Water has such a nasty temper ...

:p

Hix
 
the female Water has such a nasty temper ...

:p

Hix

I've found that both female Waters and female Olives really get snakey [sorry!] when they get to about 4 years old.

My pet irrit [apart from the perennial "best snake's a dead snake"] is the almost universal description of a python that was so big that "...... it's head was off the road on one side and it's tail was off the road on the other side".

And then there was the twenty foot black snake that my informant presented to Steve Irwin who later rang him and told him that it had just laid 200 eggs, it was so big.

We might need a seperate thread for reptile tall stories!
 
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just recently I found an eastern brown snake basking on the path at school. when I informed one of the teachers he asked me to go to the garden shed and get a shovel. Of course I didn't.

And so you shouldn't. Did you know that about 80% of the recorded venomous snake bites in this country are to people who were interacting with a snake such as trying to kill it with a shovel.

A .410 is much safer!!
 
We might need a seperate thread for reptile tall stories!

i'm just starting to imagine how long that thread will be. I'm sure we all have a tall tale to tell.

And so you shouldn't. Did you know that about 80% of the recorded venomous snake bites in this country are to people who were interacting with a snake such as trying to kill it with a shovel.

I never inteded to; I know better than to be on the wrong end of an aggravated venomous snake. I can't say the same for the guy trying to kill it. Thankfully for him he didn't become another statistic.
 
These people don't care about the law.

It really pisses me off when someone at work finds out I keep snakes at home - they then seek me out, start off with "I heard you keep snakes - is that true?" and when I confirm it they proudly tell me they kill all snakes. Proudly, like it's some kind of personal acheivement.

And they can't understand why I get upset and call them names ......

One day I'll reply with "Any cat that wanders into my backyard gets fed to my big Water Python".


Nobody who claims to like animals should ever take out a problem with a human on an animal. You can't complain about people's attitudes to snakes and hope to change them if you advocate abusing another animal. Someone who is so hateful towards snakes is quite likely going to be hateful towards any cat that gives them a minor annoyance. Just like you. You are just the same as them.
 
Nobody who claims to like animals should ever take out a problem with a human on an animal. You can't complain about people's attitudes to snakes and hope to change them if you advocate abusing another animal. Someone who is so hateful towards snakes is quite likely going to be hateful towards any cat that gives them a minor annoyance. Just like you. You are just the same as them.

Bear in mind that feral cats are a major pest species in Australia - an adaptable, non-native carnivore and a serious threat to native species. So (to my mind at any rate) killing a cat under those conditions is different to killing a native snake.
 
Even if culling is an answer to the problem of feral cats in Australia (like it's worked so far...), I still don't feel it justifies species hatred. You can't complain about others hating snakes, then turn round and think it's a great idea to get those people back by killing another animal. It doesn't teach the people who hate snakes anything. It's not going to solve the feral cat problem (if snakes eating cats was going to solve it, the snakes would have already taken care of it in the wild), and quite possibly would involve cruelty (Hix didn't say whether he was intending to kill the cats first, or how, but I think we can rule out euthanasia by injection from a vet, since that would poisen the snake. He also said 'any cat', not just ferals. Presumable that includes the elderly, none hunting, neutered cat belonging to the old lady down the road that got out while she was being burgled)

Cats don't deserve that hatred. They didn't actually build their own boats and sail them to Australia. It's humans who did that, hunted many species to death personally, and brought in the cats, rats, mice, rabbits, pigs, goats, dogs, foxes. If you are going to argue that any species that kills natives is fair game then I guess Australia can let all it's murderers out of prison, because there's no destroyer of species like humans.

If culling is to be done, it should be done with respect, regret and it should be humane. Not as a part of a war between snake lovers and snake haters.
 
Cats don't deserve that hatred.

Blimey. I think you're sounding a bit sanctimonious here, Rowan. Hix's comment was light-hearted, and satirical. He made the point, well, that cats are more damaging than snakes in Australia. And yes, feral populations of cats certainly should be culled - shot - in order to preserve native species. That's not 'hatred', but rather inalienable fact.
 
Sooty mangabey answered far more elegantly and concisely than I could.

Just one further point (well, two):

If culling is to be done, it should be done with respect, regret and it should be humane. Not as a part of a war between snake lovers and snake haters.

a) I don't think Hix was genuinely suggesting cat culling as a method of vengeance against herpetophobes

b) More seriously, I don't see why the removal of introduced/invasive species (by any method) should necessarily be done with 'regret'. Many people would view it as a positive step. And I don't think anyone on here would propose a culling method they did not consider humane.
 
they proudly tell me they kill all snakes. Proudly, like it's some kind of personal acheivement.

One day I'll reply with "Any cat that wanders into my backyard gets fed to my big Water Python".

The Antipodean sense of humour obviously doesn't travel north very well.

Chlidonias and I welcome you to our select brotherhood, Hix!!
 
The Antipodean sense of humour obviously doesn't travel north very well.

Chlidonias and I welcome you to our select brotherhood, Hix!!
I think it depends on what your sense of humour is,I for one do understand and get it and in fact enjoy the Antipodean sense of humour!So keep of the good Humour!!
 
OK, I can see my comment has been misinterpreted so let me clear the air.

Hix said:
One day I'll reply with "Any cat that wanders into my backyard gets fed to my big Water Python".

What I meant was, when someone says "I kill all snakes I see" I will reply (verbally) with the above comment. I was not suggesting i would reply by actually catching and feeding cats to my snakes because this guy pissed me off.

If I ever said this, it would be to shock them and probably anger them. I could then direct the conversation along the lines of "Why do people keep cats? because they like them. Why do I keep snakes? because I like them. How do you think i feel when you come up and tell me you kill every snake you see, like it's something to be proud of? It doesn't impress me."

And so every one is crystal clear, I agree with humane euthanasia of feral cats (or any animal for that matter) and I would NEVER take out my frustrations (by a human) on an animal of any kind, especially in a vengeance scenario as outlined above.

But Rowan Green doesn't know me, so I'm not offended that he misinterpreted my comments.

:p

Hix
 
Well sorry, but plain and simple I don't think joking about killing an animal is something an animal lover does.

I also still don't think you are going to encourage anyone to like snakes by threatening to feed cats to them (which is what he said he wanted to say to people who killed snakes). Either they are the sort of toerag who'll enjoy killing any animal, snake or cat, or they are not going to be any more impressed than me. Either way you aren't helping snakes.

This is suposed to be a thread about people things do at zoos that are annoying. The original point was about people being predjudiced against certain species. I agree with that. I find it disapointing that people who are up in arms about casual killing of one type of animal then turn round and make jokes about killing another.

I do think the Australian attitude to cats is often narrow minded and predjudiced. As I said before, the cats didn't get themselves to Australia. If there's a problem it's the fault of humans who brought them in, not the cats. And culling may well not be the answer. To restore the Australian ecosystem you'd need to remove every mouse, rat, rabbit, goat, pig and dog (including dingoes), and bring back the animals that have gone since man and dingo first arrived, including Tasmanian devil and thylocine. Few problems with that... Humans have cocked up royaly in Australia, and it doesn't matter how many cats you kill, the ecosystem is not going to be fully restored. It may well be that instead folks should be looking at creating the best possible balance. Even if you managed to remove all the cats, it's not impossible that doing that would cause an increase in mice, rats and rabbits in many places. It may well be that the best case scenario now will include cats.

Cats have been living feral in Tasmania for around 200 years. Yet Tasmania has had many more species survive than on the mainland. One factor seems to be that Tasmanian devils keep cat numbers in check. Unfortunately theoretically you don't get devils on the mainland because you have dingoes...

Also going further afield, in many places neutering has been found to better control cats than culling. It's also quite common for cats to be blamed for killing large numbers of small animals, when in fact loss of habitat to increasing human numbers and deaths on roads are much larger factor. In any just about any ecosystem (an exception being small islands, where cats can indeed be devastating...) you'll find that small critters get killed in large numbers by something. It may be cats, it may be something else, it may be that cats take over the role when something else gets pushed out due to human activity. Here in the UK small criters probably used to get killed in huge numbers by stoats, pine martens, birds of prey and wildcats. Human activty has reduced all of those. Domestic cats are not killing anything that wasn't always killed in huge numbers. The difference is loss of habitats. (I do support cat owners taking action to minimise cat's hunting: the point is, as often is the case, the problem is really humans not cats)

I am prepared to accept that culling may sometimes be an answer. However there doesn't seem to be any sign that it's working in Australia. I think it is narrow minded not to consider that other strategies need to be tried. If you ask me it's human activity that should be focused on: maybe working towards reduced population, certainly stopping land being turned over to building etc. But it's always easier to blame a cat, rather than tell your neighbour that they shouldn't be building that new housing estate in the middle of a forest. And if killing cats doesn't work, politicians can always say they'll kill more next year.
 
Hix: spent ages writing that, and meanwhile you posted. Thanks for the reply, and glad to see that you can see where I'm coming from! I can now appreciate your intent more, and it sounds quite reasonable.
 
Well sorry, but plain and simple I don't think joking about killing an animal is something an animal lover does.

I also still don't think you are going to encourage anyone to like snakes by threatening to feed cats to them (which is what he said he wanted to say to people who killed snakes). Either they are the sort of toerag who'll enjoy killing any animal, snake or cat, or they are not going to be any more impressed than me. Either way you aren't helping snakes.

This is suposed to be a thread about people things do at zoos that are annoying. The original point was about people being predjudiced against certain species. I agree with that. I find it disapointing that people who are up in arms about casual killing of one type of animal then turn round and make jokes about killing another.

I do think the Australian attitude to cats is often narrow minded and predjudiced. As I said before, the cats didn't get themselves to Australia. If there's a problem it's the fault of humans who brought them in, not the cats. And culling may well not be the answer. To restore the Australian ecosystem you'd need to remove every mouse, rat, rabbit, goat, pig and dog (including dingoes), and bring back the animals that have gone since man and dingo first arrived, including Tasmanian devil and thylocine. Few problems with that... Humans have cocked up royaly in Australia, and it doesn't matter how many cats you kill, the ecosystem is not going to be fully restored. It may well be that instead folks should be looking at creating the best possible balance. Even if you managed to remove all the cats, it's not impossible that doing that would cause an increase in mice, rats and rabbits in many places. It may well be that the best case scenario now will include cats.

Cats have been living feral in Tasmania for around 200 years. Yet Tasmania has had many more species survive than on the mainland. One factor seems to be that Tasmanian devils keep cat numbers in check. Unfortunately theoretically you don't get devils on the mainland because you have dingoes...

Also going further afield, in many places neutering has been found to better control cats than culling. It's also quite common for cats to be blamed for killing large numbers of small animals, when in fact loss of habitat to increasing human numbers and deaths on roads are much larger factor. In any just about any ecosystem (an exception being small islands, where cats can indeed be devastating...) you'll find that small critters get killed in large numbers by something. It may be cats, it may be something else, it may be that cats take over the role when something else gets pushed out due to human activity. Here in the UK small criters probably used to get killed in huge numbers by stoats, pine martens, birds of prey and wildcats. Human activty has reduced all of those. Domestic cats are not killing anything that wasn't always killed in huge numbers. The difference is loss of habitats. (I do support cat owners taking action to minimise cat's hunting: the point is, as often is the case, the problem is really humans not cats)

I am prepared to accept that culling may sometimes be an answer. However there doesn't seem to be any sign that it's working in Australia. I think it is narrow minded not to consider that other strategies need to be tried. If you ask me it's human activity that should be focused on: maybe working towards reduced population, certainly stopping land being turned over to building etc. But it's always easier to blame a cat, rather than tell your neighbour that they shouldn't be building that new housing estate in the middle of a forest. And if killing cats doesn't work, politicians can always say they'll kill more next year.
Animal lovers? I don't think so, there are some individuals on here who fully agreed with Edinburgh killing perfectly healthy young animals for no reason and then try to get snooty with people who disagree with it, they think its marvellous to see a much loved elephant being cut up in full view of a national television audience giving no thought whatsoever for the feelings of the people who were fond of the beast or indeed to the memory of the animal herself, why are they never away from zoos when they clearly have no respect or compassion for the animals housed in them?
 
Animal lovers? I don't think so, there are some individuals on here who fully agreed with Edinburgh killing perfectly healthy young animals for no reason and then try to get snooty with people who disagree with it, they think its marvellous to see a much loved elephant being cut up in full view of a national television audience giving no thought whatsoever for the feelings of the people who were fond of the beast or indeed to the memory of the animal herself, why are they never away from zoos when they clearly have no respect or compassion for the animals housed in them?

Oh, get over yourself! I do get snooty with this sort of holier-than-thou claptrap. You may not have agreed with the reason for the r r hog cull, but there was a reason. Likewise with cats in Australia. And in the immortal words of early 80s synth-pop maestro Howard Jones (Or was it Nik Kershaw?), "What is love anyway?". I'm not sure I love animals. Not as individuals, certainly. But I respect them, and am fascinated by them.

Please, don't try to adopt the moral high ground here! It belittles an otherwise interesting debate, reducing it to the level of the playground.
 
Animal lovers? I don't think so, there are some individuals on here who fully agreed with Edinburgh killing perfectly healthy young animals for no reason and then try to get snooty with people who disagree with it,

For 'fully agreed', that should read: 'were prepared to accept that the zoo did it for what they considered to be good reasons and not just out of insane or callous bloodlust, as some seemed to think'.


they think its marvellous to see a much loved elephant being cut up in full view of a national television audience giving no thought whatsoever for the feelings of the people who were fond of the beast or indeed to the memory of the animal herself, why are they never away from zoos when they clearly have no respect or compassion for the animals housed in them?

Do you think the TV producers stole the elephant's body without asking? Of course they didn't. So the zoo staff would certainly have had the chance to object. 'No thought to the memory of the animal'? I just don't get this. Why does the animal being used as an educational tool after death, to share the wonderful anatomy produced by the simple process of gradual evolution over millions of years, detract from the animal's memory?


It just seems that your emotional attachment to animals in general blinds you to anyone else's viewpoint.
 
It really annoys me when people just look at the body of an animal and take no notice of the face. One day in 2006 i went to colchester zoo and a man told his daughter that the animals were leopards and they were in fact cheetahs.

this is the conversation we had:
Man (takling to daughter): look over there, theres a leopard.
Me: no it's not it's a cheetah
Man: no it ain't, it's a leopard, look at it's body pattern
Me: that is where you are wrong look at it's face. it has tear drop markings. Running from it's eye to the corner of it's mouth.
Keeper: Shes right, you know.
Man's daughter: Daddy, you got it wrong.

I was 8 years old
 
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