Tiger King

littleRedPanda

littleRedPanda

Well-Known Member
Just started watching this series on Netflix

"People who own big cats are unusual, we're told near the outset of "Tiger King: Murder, Mayhem and Madness," which proceeds to prove that -- and then some -- over seven jaw-dropping episodes. Netflix has made a lot of noise with unscripted programming, but it's going to roar with this beyond-bizarre docu-series distraction, which demonstrates that outlandish people who love filming themselves are a formula for TV that's grrrr-reat."

A thread relating to the first featured subject

GW Animal Park Discussion [GW Exotic Animal Park]
 
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I haven't watched it yet, but from what I've heard, it does a surprisingly decent job of covering everything and doesn't treat any of the main characters like they're without problems, not something I was expecting from a netflix doc.
 
I'm two episodes in so far and I'm amazed. Whilst from the UK at least we are reasonably aware of this sort of thing going on in the States, it is still incredibly shocking to see it happening in front of me. So many hybrids, so many obese cats, so much FC that makes your jaw drop, so little knowledge of husbandry and reading the cats body language. Maybe as the series continues things might change, but after these first two episodes, the female owner of the rescue centre is in no way better than anyone else despite being fully PC.

Just a shame that these sorts of places undo all the hard word we strive to put in with our breeding programmes in accredited zoos
 
I just finished binge watching the show, biggest takeaway was that none of the major players were good people. While the majority of animal lovers are good well meaning people, the lure of big cats in particular sure does seem to attract some destructive egomaniacs.

My thoughts remain torn as to whether I think people should be able to keep big cats and other large exotics. On one hand I think that if the animals are well cared for and managed it shouldn't be the business of the government, but on the other the mass breeding for the purpose of cub photos seems to be an inevitable byproduct. I suppose the compromise would be more stringent oversight and the banning of commercial hands on experiences with wildcats. After all a domestic animal can be mistreated just as much as a wild one.

I also found the comparisons drawn between big cat rescue down in florida and the other roadside zoos to be an interesting one. To a certain degree I think they have a point, these people need to get off their damn high horses criticizing everyone who properly cares for and keeps exotics while they themselves maintain a huge collection. I hear big cats MO on captive breeding, but I think its mainly an excuse to feel self superior and justified in getting to interact with captive wildcats while scorning anyone else that does it. If they really were solely focused on the plight of wildcats in the wild, they would spend their millions on field conservation instead. Oh yeah and that lady totally killed her husband :D:rolleyes:
 
I started to see the doc yesterday. It was very good because they talk about how can be big cats at an unaccredited facility with no husbandry,no real care to the animals. For example: Joe Exotic used roadside killed animals to feed their big cats and tried to use the cheapest meat he could find. Myrtle Beach Safari, also showcased, feeds their animals with quality food but that doesn't mean they are very good with them.
At first, I didn't wanted to see Tiger King, but with only seeing the first episode,I want to continue seeing it,they talk about a crude reality that people should know about.
 
DelacoursLangur said:
I also found the comparisons drawn between big cat rescue down in florida and the other roadside zoos to be an interesting one. To a certain degree I think they have a point, these people need to get off their damn high horses criticizing everyone who properly cares for and keeps exotics while they themselves maintain a huge collection. I hear big cats MO on captive breeding, but I think its mainly an excuse to feel self superior and justified in getting to interact with captive wildcats while scorning anyone else that does it. If they really were solely focused on the plight of wildcats in the wild, they would spend their millions on field conservation instead. Oh yeah and that lady totally killed her husband :D:rolleyes:
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I wouldn't say I'm a fan of Carol's, but all of her cats were either brought to her by law enforcement or through the former owners. Owners have to sign a contract saying they will never own another exotic cat, that they won't even have a photo taken with them touching one. They also turn away a lot of cats because they don't have room. Volunteers and employees are never allowed to touch the animals and get fired if they do. She also has done a lot for legislation in the US. BCR is the one who pushed for the Captive Wildlife Safety Act of 2003 (which some places get around by being "sanctuaries", unfortunately, but really helped reduce the sale of cubs in the US). BCR may not donate tons of money to conservation, but they do spend a bunch lobbying and trying to reduce the number of cats in need of homes here.
 
TinoPup said:
I wouldn't say I'm a fan of Carol's, but all of her cats were either brought to her by law enforcement or through the former owners. Owners have to sign a contract saying they will never own another exotic cat, that they won't even have a photo taken with them touching one. They also turn away a lot of cats because they don't have room. Volunteers and employees are never allowed to touch the animals and get fired if they do. She also has done a lot for legislation in the US. BCR is the one who pushed for the Captive Wildlife Safety Act of 2003 (which some places get around by being "sanctuaries", unfortunately, but really helped reduce the sale of cubs in the US). BCR may not donate tons of money to conservation, but they do spend a bunch lobbying and trying to reduce the number of cats in need of homes here.
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There's an interesting post by @Arizona Docent here: Big Cat Rescue
 
TinoPup said:
I wouldn't say I'm a fan of Carol's, but all of her cats were either brought to her by law enforcement or through the former owners. Owners have to sign a contract saying they will never own another exotic cat, that they won't even have a photo taken with them touching one. They also turn away a lot of cats because they don't have room. Volunteers and employees are never allowed to touch the animals and get fired if they do. She also has done a lot for legislation in the US. BCR is the one who pushed for the Captive Wildlife Safety Act of 2003 (which some places get around by being "sanctuaries", unfortunately, but really helped reduce the sale of cubs in the US). BCR may not donate tons of money to conservation, but they do spend a bunch lobbying and trying to reduce the number of cats in need of homes here.
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I agree that the facility is run much more professionally than Joe's "zoo", something that the show doesnt cover. But I think that if they really cared about the wildlife and it being wild so much they would put all their efforts into field conservation and reintroduction efforts rather than naming and throwing birthday parties for their favorite cats. I think that the people who run BCR would go right back to breeding if their were no more cats to rescue because they and their followers arnt really interested in what no tigers in captivity really means. That they would have to trek halfway across the world to wait for weeks in the field with binoculars or checking camera traps on the off chance that they will one day see a tiger if they are lucky. The rescue component is just an excuse to feel justified in doing the same thing they claim to despise.

The brutal truth is that the worlds tigers would be far better off if BCR's budget of nearly 4 million dollars went to field conservation rather than some ladies private collection (rescue or not). Their efforts seem to be solely focused on eliminating privately held wildcats with no regard to the far more significant plight of the wild populations.
 
DelacoursLangur said:
The brutal truth is that the worlds tigers would be far better off if BCR's budget of nearly 4 million dollars went to field conservation rather than some ladies private collection (rescue or not). Their efforts seem to be solely focused on eliminating privately held wildcats with no regard to the far more significant plight of the wild populations.
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So what would happen to all of the cats in rescue, then? There are plenty of people concerned with conservation in the wild, tigers are one of the most popular animals that people donate money to, up there with pandas.

Arizona Docent said:
@TinoPup You do realize that Carol Baskin does not believe zoos should exist and is trying to legislate them out of existence?
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Yes, which is why my post started with saying I'm not a fan of hers.
 
The number of unwanted cats in need of homes has dropped to a trickle. Twenty years ago it was a genuine problem, but not so much today. Animal rights extremists like BCR would have you believe otherwise, and it seems they have convinced someone on this thread, but if you speak to people who work with cats they will tell you that is no longer the case. There is also a consortium (that people like BCR are against) called Feline Conservation Federation that has a network set up to take in unwanted cats. I see the need for exotic cat sanctuaries diminishing.
 
Arizona Docent said:
The number of unwanted cats in need of homes has dropped to a trickle. Twenty years ago it was a genuine problem, but not so much today. Animal rights extremists like BCR would have you believe otherwise, and it seems they have convinced someone on this thread, but if you speak to people who work with cats they will tell you that is no longer the case. There is also a consortium (that people like BCR are against) called Feline Conservation Federation that has a network set up to take in unwanted cats. I see the need for exotic cat sanctuaries diminishing.
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If you watch their "rescue" videos it becomes pretty apparent quickly that they are not overflowing with rescue requests. They often have to drive halfway across the country in a donation funded vehicle just to find replacement cats, often from the breeders themselves... Heck they have room for excess AZA animals, usually unusual species they wouldnt have otherwise. IMO this fact along with her history as an exotics breeder/dealer strongly suggests it is a form of glorified menagerie for her, even if it did serve a purpose in the past.
 
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Arizona Docent said:
The number of unwanted cats in need of homes has dropped to a trickle. Twenty years ago it was a genuine problem, but not so much today. Animal rights extremists like BCR would have you believe otherwise, and it seems they have convinced someone on this thread, but if you speak to people who work with cats they will tell you that is no longer the case. There is also a consortium (that people like BCR are against) called Feline Conservation Federation that has a network set up to take in unwanted cats. I see the need for exotic cat sanctuaries diminishing.
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My reply was specifically to DelacoursLangur, who stated all of their money should go to conservation instead of the cats she currently has. Yes I'm aware, which is awesome, but that number isn't 0 and law enforcement, from all over the country, is still sending cats to her (and a few other places). There's been multiple places shut down in just the last few months.
FCF isn't that great, either - look at where they chose to have their conference.
 
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