Toronto Zoo Toronto Zoo Developments 2021

The zoo has updated the members window to include Jun 12th and 13th for reopening. Maybe some of you can get in on the weekend.

They have also announced that any membership that expired between Nov 23 2020 to Jun 12 will be extended for the length of the closure plus 2 bonus weeks as a thank you for the members support during pandemic. The zoo is asking members to stop by the membership office this time to pick up a new membership card with the new expiry date so everyone can get what they have paid for.
 
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I've managed to get spots booked for Saturday and Tuesday, very much looking forward to it.

As we know the pavilions are closed for Stage One, we only have access to outdoor exhibits - which is fine with me! From the look of the map on the website, all areas are available (Mayan Temple only via the new walk through from Tundra Trek...best thing they ever built last year imo!)
 
Glad to see you guys are able to get in and I can't wait to see what you all discover upon your return even if its just outside observations. Just means we can learn things in stages. First outside observations, then indoor, and not to forget everyone's first zoomo rides on the new zoomo which I'm still hoping isn't still stark white. Oh and hopefully the Wild Encounters can resume even if its still a contactless encounter for the rest of the year. We get to savor the return and all the changes we did and didn't know were coming.

@Judache you are so right about the path through to the temple from Tundra Trek. It is the smartest thing they have done in years! Forget just last year. It was always a poor design from the moment Tundra Trek opened. That long walk around to them for just 5 species was a lot to ask from guests who usually have small kids with them. Now the temple and its animals can get the love and attention they so rightly deserve from guests.

I'm really glad to see the zoo didn't have to do the drive thru first. They will make far more money from regular entrance fees for every guest then a flat fee for a car full. The zoo needs to start making every cent it can to make up for the losses. Phase 1 will be helpful since there will be such little competition for a day out.
 
Here's an article with the first look at one of the new bathrooms at the zoo. Admittedly it feels weird to post about bathrooms but the one in Tundra Trek was just named one of the 5 best in Canada. It is nice looking for sure. I cant tell how much better it is because I never used the one in Tundra Trek. If the others are as nice the zoo has done a good job during their down time. Is it weird I now wonder what the rest look like? I feel like it is.

Toronto Zoo's Restroom Named One Of The Best In Canada & It Looks Anything But Crappy
 
It's been a while, so I'll be visiting this upcoming Monday. I can't wait.

Also, that washroom looks like a big improvement.
 
Am I the only one who thinks Toronto should bring back elephants? Genuinely curious, as I am aware of all the deaths that occured and the controversy of keeping elephants inside during the winter, but... you see the same thing happening with the zoo's great apes, big cats, large reptiles, giraffes (IN the old elephant house!). I am also aware of how the zoo was very upfront about sending Iringa, Toka and Thika to the PAWS sanctuary (from Toronto to Tuberculosis). This is probably my most nuclear take yet, so... be gentle. :p:)
 
I couldn't agree more with you @StoppableSan. But financially the zoo doesn't have the funds to house Asian or Africans. But I do think that with the new management the Toronto zoo should be given a chance at housing them again. The Zoo definitely has the space to house either species. But I think the financial and publicity are the biggest problems. I would love to see them Elephants back again. Thika, Toka and Iringa were really special. I honestly can't believe that Toka is 50 and Thika is 40. Time flies. I would love to see the giraffe herd grow and even naming some of the giraffe calves after the girls would be a beautiful tribute to them.
 
I couldn't agree more with you @StoppableSan. But financially the zoo doesn't have the funds to house Asian or Africans. But I do think that with the new management the Toronto zoo should be given a chance at housing them again. The Zoo definitely has the space to house either species. But I think the financial and publicity are the biggest problems. I would love to see them Elephants back again. Thika, Toka and Iringa were really special. I honestly can't believe that Toka is 50 and Thika is 40. Time flies. I would love to see the giraffe herd grow and even naming some of the giraffe calves after the girls would be a beautiful tribute to them.
The publicity would be an issue, and while finances would be an issue now because of COVID, I'm thinking further down the line when they are more financially stable and are gaining momentum from projects such as the outdoor orangutan habitat and the like. If Toronto is indeed planning on building an African Savanna Pavilion, I would love to see something along the lines of Zurich's Kaeng Krachan Elephant Park but for African elephants and potentially black rhinos as well.
 
Am I the only one who thinks Toronto should bring back elephants? Genuinely curious, as I am aware of all the deaths that occured and the controversy of keeping elephants inside during the winter, but... you see the same thing happening with the zoo's great apes, big cats, large reptiles, giraffes (IN the old elephant house!). I am also aware of how the zoo was very upfront about sending Iringa, Toka and Thika to the PAWS sanctuary (from Toronto to Tuberculosis). This is probably my most nuclear take yet, so... be gentle. :p:)
If they do it, they must go BIG! Like Copenhagen or ZooZurich. Past controversies get wiped away by ambitious exhibits (See Dallas Zoo, "Giants Of The Savanna")
 
@StoppableSan, please take no offense to this but I am dead set against the return of elephants. It would be a total disaster.

1) The zoo took a horrible beating in the press and court of public opinion over the elephants. They were made out to be the villains in the whole PAWS debacle. The press was against them. The activists were against them. City council was against them. All of which really helped to turn the average public against them. Not for a second do I think the keepers were wrong to fight. They new the girls. They loved the girls. They honestly had their best interests at heart and were willing to stand up and fight to the bitter end for them. Just a hard battle when the zoo's side of the story is muted and played off as self serving by the media and all against them. In the end the uninformed average person tended to side with council and the loud annoying self service activists who still kicked the zoo when they had already won. It has taken years of careful work and good PR to get the public back on side and believing the zoo honestly wants whats best for their animals. To bring elephants bad will only reopen old wounds and welcome back the activists who have all the money and time in the world to rail against the zoo. All their hard work would be undone. For get the firestorm that will happen if the zoo tried to import a herd from the wild which would probably be the zoo's only realistic shot at housing a breeding herd. That just wont end well.

2) The zoo did decide of its own free will to send the elephants away in the first place because they believed that was what was best for them. Winter is a concern but definitely not an insurmountable concern (see my 3rd point in a minute). The girls were older and the AZA requirements are a herd of 3 bare minimum. Lets assume Iringa still would have died at the same point, the zoo would have been frantically looking for another elephant and we all know how easy it would have been to get another one. If they couldn't get one then there are the concerns about the social well being of Thika or Toka should the other die. Add to that in order to keep a larger herd or just to not fall below recommendations the zoo would have needed a much bigger complex that the zoo wouldn't have been able to build fast enough to meet requirements.

3) That all brings me to my next point the exhibit. There was a study done by the zoo to see what would be required to make a suitable new home for them.

https://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2011/zb/bgrd/backgroundfile-37875.pdf

The new exhibit would take up a massive part of the back of the savanna, hindering possible future development (which I dream of but dont think is realistic). It's cost would also be massive estimated in 2010 at $18 million dollars. That is a ton of money to invest in a single species for the zoo which rarely finds it easy to raise funds. And we all know the zoo tends to vastly underestimate costs. Costs certainly would have ballooned well beyond that. Yes today the zoo is spending $12 million on the orangs but thats today's dollars and I don't know how the elephants wouldnt cost a whole lot more. Just look at the massive amount of new fencing that would be needed, constructing a new pool (plus filtration), converting the old barn, the massive new barn, possibly having to reinforce the cliff face to hold the ground under the elephants and new exhibit, and all things to care for them year round. With winter the barn would really need to be huge to provide them with sufficient exercise in the coldest depths of the winter. The old barn hardly seems like enough space for two elephants much less a family herd. It would be the biggest most complex undertaking the zoo had ever done just to build the barn. I can only assume the budget necessary to build a worthy modern, Northern elephant complex capable of raising generations of elephants would be extremely expensive. Other than the barn conversion and upper paddock, they would basically be starting from scratch. It would probably be a cost thats high enough that you could totally redevelop a pavilion for the same cost. I really think that same cost anaylsis has come into play with the decision to phase out hippos. The zoo could spend $20-30 million building a state of the art hippo complex or they could use that same money to build a savanna pavilion (or at least make a big dent in the budget) and benefit at least the kudu, rhino, zebra, eland, marabou, ground hornbills and vulture and possibly relocated ostriches (to avoid the back and forth moves every fall and spring). Even if the zoo was magically given $100 million to do whatever they want with it I would much prefer the focus be on keeping what we have with a new state of the art hippo exhibit and doing whatever I have to do to keep the Indian Rhinos.

Now I know I only considered African elephants but the question of Asians seems like a moot one to me. Where could you put Asians? The drive through is the only large space in the Asian section of the zoo and then that means either phasing out the yaks and Przewalski's horse or adding to your budget and relocating them. The Schofield Gardens would be the only option for enough space to relocate the horses and then you get into a whole problem with offending the Korean community group (I cant remember what group was building the gardens specifically), by ripping down their gardens, not that they finished the project. There were supposed to be more gardens and several Asian bird aviaries, maybe some small mammals. The only other option for Asians if you leave Eurasia alone is to use the parking lot after building a parking structure and moving the front gate. Far too complex. I just think if you were to add elephants back you need to go for African based on the space available.

I do miss the elephants and in an ideal world I would love to have them back, especially to rub it in the activists faces, but I think the zoo is better off without them now that they are gone. I wouldn't be against the zoo getting them back if that's what they want to do. I just think the cost of doing it would realistically be too high to take that risk. I prefer just leaving things as they are and focus on the current stock. But we all have our own dreams for the zoo and they wont always match and that's totally fine.
 
@StoppableSan, please take no offense to this but I am dead set against the return of elephants. It would be a total disaster.

1) The zoo took a horrible beating in the press and court of public opinion over the elephants. They were made out to be the villains in the whole PAWS debacle. The press was against them. The activists were against them. City council was against them. All of which really helped to turn the average public against them. Not for a second do I think the keepers were wrong to fight. They new the girls. They loved the girls. They honestly had their best interests at heart and were willing to stand up and fight to the bitter end for them. Just a hard battle when the zoo's side of the story is muted and played off as self serving by the media and all against them. In the end the uninformed average person tended to side with council and the loud annoying self service activists who still kicked the zoo when they had already won. It has taken years of careful work and good PR to get the public back on side and believing the zoo honestly wants whats best for their animals. To bring elephants bad will only reopen old wounds and welcome back the activists who have all the money and time in the world to rail against the zoo. All their hard work would be undone. For get the firestorm that will happen if the zoo tried to import a herd from the wild which would probably be the zoo's only realistic shot at housing a breeding herd. That just wont end well.

2) The zoo did decide of its own free will to send the elephants away in the first place because they believed that was what was best for them. Winter is a concern but definitely not an insurmountable concern (see my 3rd point in a minute). The girls were older and the AZA requirements are a herd of 3 bare minimum. Lets assume Iringa still would have died at the same point, the zoo would have been frantically looking for another elephant and we all know how easy it would have been to get another one. If they couldn't get one then there are the concerns about the social well being of Thika or Toka should the other die. Add to that in order to keep a larger herd or just to not fall below recommendations the zoo would have needed a much bigger complex that the zoo wouldn't have been able to build fast enough to meet requirements.

3) That all brings me to my next point the exhibit. There was a study done by the zoo to see what would be required to make a suitable new home for them.

https://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2011/zb/bgrd/backgroundfile-37875.pdf

The new exhibit would take up a massive part of the back of the savanna, hindering possible future development (which I dream of but dont think is realistic). It's cost would also be massive estimated in 2010 at $18 million dollars. That is a ton of money to invest in a single species for the zoo which rarely finds it easy to raise funds. And we all know the zoo tends to vastly underestimate costs. Costs certainly would have ballooned well beyond that. Yes today the zoo is spending $12 million on the orangs but thats today's dollars and I don't know how the elephants wouldnt cost a whole lot more. Just look at the massive amount of new fencing that would be needed, constructing a new pool (plus filtration), converting the old barn, the massive new barn, possibly having to reinforce the cliff face to hold the ground under the elephants and new exhibit, and all things to care for them year round. With winter the barn would really need to be huge to provide them with sufficient exercise in the coldest depths of the winter. The old barn hardly seems like enough space for two elephants much less a family herd. It would be the biggest most complex undertaking the zoo had ever done just to build the barn. I can only assume the budget necessary to build a worthy modern, Northern elephant complex capable of raising generations of elephants would be extremely expensive. Other than the barn conversion and upper paddock, they would basically be starting from scratch. It would probably be a cost thats high enough that you could totally redevelop a pavilion for the same cost. I really think that same cost anaylsis has come into play with the decision to phase out hippos. The zoo could spend $20-30 million building a state of the art hippo complex or they could use that same money to build a savanna pavilion (or at least make a big dent in the budget) and benefit at least the kudu, rhino, zebra, eland, marabou, ground hornbills and vulture and possibly relocated ostriches (to avoid the back and forth moves every fall and spring). Even if the zoo was magically given $100 million to do whatever they want with it I would much prefer the focus be on keeping what we have with a new state of the art hippo exhibit and doing whatever I have to do to keep the Indian Rhinos.

Now I know I only considered African elephants but the question of Asians seems like a moot one to me. Where could you put Asians? The drive through is the only large space in the Asian section of the zoo and then that means either phasing out the yaks and Przewalski's horse or adding to your budget and relocating them. The Schofield Gardens would be the only option for enough space to relocate the horses and then you get into a whole problem with offending the Korean community group (I cant remember what group was building the gardens specifically), by ripping down their gardens, not that they finished the project. There were supposed to be more gardens and several Asian bird aviaries, maybe some small mammals. The only other option for Asians if you leave Eurasia alone is to use the parking lot after building a parking structure and moving the front gate. Far too complex. I just think if you were to add elephants back you need to go for African based on the space available.

I do miss the elephants and in an ideal world I would love to have them back, especially to rub it in the activists faces, but I think the zoo is better off without them now that they are gone. I wouldn't be against the zoo getting them back if that's what they want to do. I just think the cost of doing it would realistically be too high to take that risk. I prefer just leaving things as they are and focus on the current stock. But we all have our own dreams for the zoo and they wont always match and that's totally fine.
I do agree 100% with the points brought up. Indeed while it would be an expensive undertaking, and the Zoo did indeed take a beating from corporate media/astroturfed animal rights activists, there is a way of doing so through raising a good sum of money. @Zooplantman mentioned how Dallas Zoo had its fair share of controversy with their lone elephant Jenny, before building Giants of the Savanna. If they did something along the lines of Kaeng Krachan Elephant Park meets Giants of the Savanna, where elephants wouldn't be the only ones benefiting from a new pavilion (kudu, rhino, zebra, eland, marabou, ground hornbill and vulture would also benefit from an African Savanna Pavilion, maybe giraffes could also work...?), that might work. While Toronto does have trouble fundraising, one thing is for certain: "Sometimes it's easier to raise more money for a big dream than for a mediocre dream." (Donna Fernandes, former director of the Buffalo Zoo)

https://www.zoophoria.net/single-po...with-dr-donna-fernandes-retired-director-of-t
 
@StoppableSan, thats the great thing about zoos we can share such different visions for its future and all of them are totally valid. You make excellent points and if you could snap your fingers and make the elephant exhibit you envision for the zoo I would be all for it.

In an ideal world I would love to have elephants back. Your vision of a great savanna pavilion is amazing and I would absolutely love to see it one day. Nothing would please me more. However what you are proposing the zoo do will take a lot of money, vision, creativity, innovation, and drive. History has taught me that Toronto lacks all of those things. Most of the work they have done since they began their major redevelopment plans in 1998 with the Savanna can be described as just good enough. The rainforest pavilion is the one exception where most of it is exceptional. In the end they always run out of money and the projects always suffer for it. I await the new orang exhibit to see if the new management team was able to knock it out of the park or they give up and just do something good enough. To be fair the zoo could be entering a new era where they are more capable of delivering world class exhibits if they tackle them in smaller portions. I'm all for it but the zoo has taught me to not expect much which is why I based my argument on the plan they were developing in 2010 and not considering any other options. Toronto rarely does mixed exhibits so an incredible one like Giants of the Savanna seems like a pipe dream until the zoo is willing to change its long held belief mixed exhibits are unsafe. I would say forget the activist and import a wild born herd if the zoo could deliver on an exhibit that was truly world class and give the activist little to complain about like Giants of the Savanna.

The biggest problem though is the money. You can hire visionaries. You can get a masterful construction team in place. You can find people who can fabricate amazing tools no one has ever thought of before. Problem is that you need the fund to do it. The zoo is virtually being strangled to death by the city. I know other city zoos can do incredible things but in Toronto the rules the zoo is forced to live by have definitely had a very negative impact on the zoo. The new fundraising organization is starting to do good work. Hopefully in time it can really develop into a powerhouse that can raise the money the zoo needs to do the incredible. Its still in its infancy though so we need to see how it plays out. If the zoo could raise the money it needed and support a massive project like Giants of the Savanna I am all on board. Any time the zoo has brought up separating itself from the city they get smacked down and told they could never cover the costs and haven't been allowed to develop a team to even try to set something up that could free them financially from the city. Ideally this new fund raising organization can show the city that they can raise money themselves and that it is possible for it to be independent and self sufficient. If they can do that then the sky really is the limit in terms of fund raising because the rules will be gone.

You are right with a world class exhibit most of the activist controversy would probably evaporate or at least be dulled. I just wouldn't want to go back to a time when any article about the zoo was negative when I know how much good the zoo and its incredible staff do. Really was disheartening to see article after article bashing the keepers and vets who wanted to fight for their friends. If it could be done without much risk of the zoo being dragged back through the mud that would be perfect. I know all bashing can be stopped but you can really hammer back and prove why its better then anything else out there when you do go world class.

For now though I would prefer the zoo focus on the species it currently exhibits. There are so many areas in desperate need of every penny the zoo can spare.

This is a fun conversation you have started @StoppableSan. We need more of these discussions we can all weigh in on and have such different opinions. Really makes one think in different ways and see different points of view. Thanks for starting this one.
 
The zoo now has a liquor license so you can enjoy a brew at the zoo. There appears to be a cart selling it at the entrance courtyard but there could be more locations throughout the zoo.

There is also a new wooden arch over the path leading to the Indo outdoor exhibits from the entrance.
 
Some work is being done in domain in the small enclosure next to the bison paddock. There were some stairs, a tunnel and a large shade structure. Is this likely to be for a new animal or would they be relocating a species already in the collection?
 
Welcome to ZooChat Kalvin, always great to have another fellow Zoo goer here. It is always hard to predict what is going on with any construction. But we usually on this chat do think of why there is construction, so be sure to stick around and let us know if you have any more info or even just to ask some of the other knowledgeable members.
 
Welcome Kalvin! Interesting that there is work going on in the domain. There aren't any contracts that have been up for work in the domain in the last year according to the Business Opportunities section of the website. So any work being done feels like it would be more like an in house repair job rather then a larger project but the addition of shade sails definitely makes it seem like the zoo is looking to add something. Thinking about what we have I doubt it would be for a second lynx as they are trying to phase them out or a new group of cougars since we are down to one older male. Maybe they want to get a new group of elk but they wouldnt use stairs and a tunnel. Did you by chance take some pictures you could post? This is definitely intriguing if indeed a new species is being added to the domain. It would be the first in forever. If none of use know whats happening now I bet you just sent a bunch of the other chatters down to the domain to scope out whats happening.
 
Welcome Kalvin!! And what a great way to debut. As far as the Toronto Zoo goes, that’s a pretty significant development in an area I think we all thought would never be touched again. Looks like a climbing structure for some form of predator. @TZFan any chance this is for those tigers were holding? Maybe give them some more space? Is the fence tall enough though? Definitely an exciting little surprise!
 
Now that I see the photos, that tunnel definitely wouldn’t work for a Tiger lol I am even more curious now! Hopefully someone can fill in the blank :)
 
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