I just can’t see them moving a group of chimps out of Chimp Eden back into one of the old enclosures - especially as that space will be needed to aid the Ape musical chairs. Plus the whole point of Eden was to provide all chimps a new, more suitable home?
Twycross Zoo Twycross Zoo News 2021
I know it would be strange but you could sone end up with a dozen or so in one side and a couple or even one in the other side if they can’t be mixed so at what point do they decide it might be better to go down that route, and I get the point of Eden but it was also I would thing to move the second small groups to free up the area for the future development was also a reason. The other option of course for the short term as the next phases are still prob 12 months of at least would be for the leopard in the snow leopards house to go in there allowing them to get another snow leopard in to breed again which I would think would make commercial sense for the to have Cubs again
I am pretty certain too it won't be the Chimpanzees. The indoor areas in Chimp Eden are so big they don't need both areas for the bigger group, so the smaller group could stay in there indefinately seperated if need be. They'd only get the odd outing outside but visitors wouldn't know that. I think more likely the revamped older area might be for Bonobos, young male gorillas or another, non-Ape, species entirely.
cliffxdavis
Well-Known Member
Spent 4 hours at TZ yesterday with @Brum. Had a great time but there were a few things that I was unimpressed by.
The main issue was the introduction of gates and walls between enclosures steering you in one direction. I know where I want to go and resent being sent on a huge loop. This is not a Covid measure, they have been doing this for a while now.
When are they going to put some mesh back on the huge aviary by the entrance so it can actually be used again? Seems such a waste.
The boundary walls to Chimp Eden look so brutal. Can nothing be done to soften the Colditz like starkness? Green paint or murals might help (inner and outer surfaces).
I know it is not possible to force the Apes into their outside space where they can actually been seen but more needs to be done so you can seem them in their indoor quarters, this may have to wait until the new quarters are built. Eden is well lit however.
Disappointed the children's zoo was closed as I like the Gundi, but they are building something enormous out there.
Otter enclosure still empty.
Lemur Walkthrough needs to be renamed Pine Tree Walkthrough. In 5 visits I have once seen 1 Lemur.
The main issue was the introduction of gates and walls between enclosures steering you in one direction. I know where I want to go and resent being sent on a huge loop. This is not a Covid measure, they have been doing this for a while now.
When are they going to put some mesh back on the huge aviary by the entrance so it can actually be used again? Seems such a waste.
The boundary walls to Chimp Eden look so brutal. Can nothing be done to soften the Colditz like starkness? Green paint or murals might help (inner and outer surfaces).
I know it is not possible to force the Apes into their outside space where they can actually been seen but more needs to be done so you can seem them in their indoor quarters, this may have to wait until the new quarters are built. Eden is well lit however.
Disappointed the children's zoo was closed as I like the Gundi, but they are building something enormous out there.
Otter enclosure still empty.
Lemur Walkthrough needs to be renamed Pine Tree Walkthrough. In 5 visits I have once seen 1 Lemur.
I second @cliffxdavis sentiments but would also add that the langurs have done a bit of musical chairs as the Francois are now by the entrance and the dusky are in the former Francois enclosure, also the Variegated Spider Monkey enclosure is undergoing a refurb so they're also down by the duskys.
The leopard enclosures (old green mile) were looking rather well planted and lush yesterday, still not ideal but there are definitely worse enclosures for big cats out there. And on 3 visits I'm yet to see a single tiger in the outdoor enclosures, in fact in my last 3 visits I've only seen a tiger sleeping in the on-show den.
The Children's Zoo area is indeed quite a substantial part of the zoo that is inaccessible, but we did see one young man taking photos over the barrier so if you're reading this and are on ZooChat (I'm assuming he's a zoo enthusiast!) then we saw you, did you get any decent shots?
I do like a visit to Twycross but the barriers are a right pain and there seem to be more of them since my last visit in November. Really does add a lot of time on to your visit which I think may be the general idea. Highlight of the visit was the Yellow-throated Martens as always but seeing three of the four gibbon species utilising their islands was a close second.
The leopard enclosures (old green mile) were looking rather well planted and lush yesterday, still not ideal but there are definitely worse enclosures for big cats out there. And on 3 visits I'm yet to see a single tiger in the outdoor enclosures, in fact in my last 3 visits I've only seen a tiger sleeping in the on-show den.
The Children's Zoo area is indeed quite a substantial part of the zoo that is inaccessible, but we did see one young man taking photos over the barrier so if you're reading this and are on ZooChat (I'm assuming he's a zoo enthusiast!) then we saw you, did you get any decent shots?
I do like a visit to Twycross but the barriers are a right pain and there seem to be more of them since my last visit in November. Really does add a lot of time on to your visit which I think may be the general idea. Highlight of the visit was the Yellow-throated Martens as always but seeing three of the four gibbon species utilising their islands was a close second.
cliffxdavis
Well-Known Member
I totally agree with @Brum about the Yellow Throated Martens and the Gibbons being out. If fact we had a great time sitting at the picnic table on the exit ramp from the Gibbon House that lets you look at the Gibbons while you eat your sandwiches. Makes you wonder why there are not more picnic tables that actually let you look at something interesting while you snack.
A bit unfair, we had some lovely views of the "Pine Tree Walkthrough" later in the day...
I also think that the chimp enclosure could look so much better lol been to a few zoos where they painted trees etc
Considering the lengths they’ve gone to theme and landscape the interiors of Chimp Eden - for both animals and visitors - the prison camp wall exterior really does make no sense. Just a relatively simple paint job on the interior sides and some decorative cladding on the visitor sides would make it look a thousand times better.
I agree the outside walls of 'Chimp Eden' are hideous. Sometimes zoos seem to run out of steam when it comes to completely finishing exhibits aethsetically. I remember in Bristol Zoo's old 1985-built Apehouse the steel sliding doors still bore the manufacturer's large printed numbers, they stayed throughout the life of the house.
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Did you happen to see the Diana Monkey group in the oldest gorilla house? Unfortunately you can only do so if they are outdoors.
I find these very off-putting, enough to think twice about another visit currently. I can't see exactly what purpose they achieve either.
I do think it's an okay/good zoo but I've thought for a few years that Twycross feels like it's run by the marketing department (multiple large garish signs in the middle of numerous enclosures, new exhibits designed to prioritise marketing potential over quality for the animal e.g. 'Gibbon Islands') and business execs sat around a boardroom table who've never known the experience of visiting a zoo for themselves (prioritising driving visitors around the zoo with barriers over addressing forgotten/poor/empty exhibits, visitor experience, basic maintenance, poor horticulture etc.).
To be fair possibly because I go often I don’t notice the barriers that much it’s not the biggest zoo and there are three ways through to the other side four if you include chimp Eden, granted I don’t see what they achieve but is this any different to most zoos in the sense when you enter do you go left or right or is the problem that this changed the zoo from a more open plan zoo to the more common left or right zoo
When you look at the current CEO’s history and experience, I think you’d realise this isn’t true at all. She has a history of conservation in the wild and actually spent many of her early years being anti-zoo! She just realises though, that for Twycross to really offer great animal welfare it needs to be financially successful too. They’re in the midst of a huge and very expensive redevelopment which takes time and has to be paid for, so marketing the hell out of itself at every opportunity is essential to the zoo’s long term success.
Fair point!
I don't think this matters (although I don't think a person who spent many of their early years being anti-zoo will have spent much time experiencing visiting zoos with their friends/family or as a zoo-enthusiast to know what visiting a zoo should feel like). What matters is the end result of what the zoo is like to visit in the here and now.
I've nothing against marketing or financial success, however I believe it should be done in a way so that visitor experience and the 'feel' of the zoo is not impacted.
I am sceptical about the development plans at the moment as they appear to have come out of nowhere, don't make much sense to me, and will be an enormous undertaking.
To conclude, I think the management do have the zoo's best interests at heart and are steering the zoo in the overall right direction (overall I'm very pleased to see some of the big improvements and changes they've made in recent years). I just think that visitor experience and some smaller priorities/details/decisions (which do add up) have been lacking over the past few years which @Pertinax, @gentle lemur, @Brum, @cliffxdavis and myself have all noticed.
Some big improvements have certainly been made- Gibbon Islands (though I think its in the wrong location...!), the removal of the female-only elephant group, the completion of Chimp Eden, and the return of both tigers an giraffes are the obvious ones. Against that we have numerous enclosures that are empty or virtually so-the three older Apehouses, the areas around the Mary Branker/Borneo house and behind the Lemur walkthrough all come to mind.(otters too?) Then there are ugly fenced off 'service' areas and a one-way(?) system restricting free access, while the orangutan enclosure and old chimp/leopard enclosures are so outdated they are now becoming leftovers from the past, while closure of some of the indoor primate houses means some primates can't be seen easily anymore either. I think the pluses and minuses are pretty equal at present.
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With the exception of 2020, and most likely this year too for obvious reasons, the zoo has enjoyed year on year growth in terms of visitor numbers and financials. That suggests what they're doing is resonating well with the every day visitor. Of course, I'm in agreement it could be so much better, but improvements take time and money.
I'm not sure which part of current plans have come out of nowhere? The major redevelopment of all the ape houses, the research/university campus both featured in the original masterplan and the childrens area was called out as the next major development a couple of years ago (pre-pandemic).
I think this is fair, if you look at the zoo today, in isolation of its history. But the criticism was of current management and their approach today. When you consider what they've achieved in the last 10 years compared to what previous management teams achieved (or didn't!) in the last 30 - there is literally no comparrison. Animal welfare for a number of species is significantly improved and the visitor experience is too significantly better.
Yes, there's a couple of questionable things right now. Chimp Eden feeling somewhat unfinished, the one way system, etc are all valid complaints. But I think its unfair to call them out over empty or older housing stock when its clear they have a plan to refurbish and replace most or if not all of it. My guess is that in another 15-20 years, most of the buildings and enclosures that existed pre 2010 will no longer be there or will be recognisable as they are today.
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