Marwell Wildlife Updates

G

Gary

Well-Known Member
Hopefully after the last thread got locked, this one won't degenerate into silliness.

I would leave it for Zambar to open but I hope he doesn't mind if I just open a new update page.

It has been mentioned that the current management have a closely guarded plan for the animals-does anyone have an inkling what that may be?

As I have said before, it seems to me that Marwell has lost so many species that it once held-Jaguar, Lion, Maned Wolf, most of the Deer, Wisent, and many more, that some of the park's character has been lost.

I know Gorillas have been mentioned, but I am not sure they are really suitable for a parkland setting. The same goes for many of the recent 'houses' that have sprung up round the zoo that hold small cages with reptiles and amphibians.

Surely Marwell would be better sticking to what it does best-hoofstock and carnivores?

I would like to see some deer back in the park, Bison or Buffalo sp, more antelope, more rhino, more tigers and other cats, dhole, hyaena, for example.
 
Re Marwell

Gary being an X- keeper from Marwell in the earley 80,s and then again in the 90,s i agree the park has lost some of its feel. As you say houses popping up here and there and to me certain parts getting compacted, in ways its sort of lossing it,s open feel.
 
i would like to hope that the re-organization into zoo-geographic zones will hopefully bring many of the former species back. As im sure many of you are aware, i am too young to remember many of these species and i am a proud owner of a copy of 'Marwell, the sotry so far' in which many of these animals are highlighted. However, even i recent years many Historic species that i myself remember as a child have disappeared (sp), namely Persian Leopard, Babirusa and Malayan Tapir. I, as am sure many others will be, are looking forward to the future of marwell, and will be keeping a close eye on the updates:)
 
Zoo zones

Going back to zoo zones is how the park was wen it was opened in May 1972, even then certain species were not in the correct area,s. To put a list on here of species which are no longer kept at Marwell from wen i started there back in January 1981, would be interesting, to some extent i can go back that far, and name the species, as you walk around the park, this was in the days before the gardens at the back of the hall were open to the public, back then it contained Mr Knowles collection of rare breeds poultry.
 
The Zoo-geographic zones are not gonna happen at Marwell anymore, it was a concept that they started looking at but has been shelved in favour of a more generalistic plan. Marwell is currently working on a collection review to decide the future direction of species kept, whereby every species will need to meet at least one of their list of criteria (eg- conservation importance, awareness/educational value etc).
The Gemsbok have already departed due to this process, in favour of strengthening the Arabian Oryx group. People will criticise whatever, but it makes sense to have set direction, and species criteria, rather than just filling spaces with whatevers available at the time. Could see lots of changes in next couple of years. Also in this current financial climate (so sick of that phrase!) it's more important than ever to have a good balance of species that will attract more visitors.
On a separate note, new Meerkat enclosure will be built on the strip of land approaching the Cafe between Aridlands & the 'old' Gemsbok house.
 
I don't know how significant the departure of Jonathan Cracknell, formerly the zoological director (although I am not sure of his official title), to Longleat may be.

The potential at Marwell is enormous. There are things about the zoo which are excellent. There are also clearly ways in which it has lost its way over the past decade or so. The next year or two will be interesting.
 
It's odd though that the Gemsbok should go but the Porcupines, Camels and Peccaries remain, none of which are endangered nor particularly charismatic.

The old geographic zone thing was always a bit off, but even more so now-I know it was supposed to be coming back but currently you have Siberian Tigers at the top of the park, surrounded pretty much by African species, and Amur Leopards in the Heart of Africa.

I really miss the Lions-much as they didn't ever get bred, when the male started 'sawing' away, you could hear him clear across the zoo-such a distinct sound has been lost now.

I think given the parlous state of wild populations, even African Lions would be a good addition, and a back up population of Indian Tigers would make sense given their plunging numbers and they seem under-represented in the UK now in favour of Siberian and Sumatrans. You could even make a case for a 'Spot the Difference' exhibit or should that be 'Stripe the Difference'?

I think Himalayan Bears should be added to the Roof of the World exhibit. Given they are extant in Nepal, Indian Rhinos would also be a good addition.
 
I do not think Marwell will go poststamp-collecting! ;)
Favouring Indian tigers over Siberian and Sumatran (both the latter are very much more endangered anyway).

In terms of species set up:
The zoo would i.m.o. benefit from more themed areas (I admit Amur Leopards in the African region with no supporting story on habitat and species is a bit of a limp) grouping species together that actually share a given habitat type. Okapi, bongo and pygmy hippo (and perhaps gorillas and other arboreal primates).

On individual species choices: perhaps Marwell has quite lost some of its former appeal and flagship species (babirusa, Malayan tapir, black rhino). I would like to see more focus on its conservation activities across the park highlighting species that MW is working with in situ. Also, advocating bringing back some of the former "lost" and endangered taxa back into the park.

Some exhibits like the Grevy zebra grassland are so wide in area and rectular in shape as to be a non-challenging one from an average visitor perspective. There are similar examples there.

A sphere MW is certainly lacking is bird and amphibian/reptile exhibits. I would advocate an approach recently practised - at least with birds - at Safari Beekse Bergen. Intersperse the mammal collection with bird aviaries relevant to a themed area. F.i. African waders, vulture savannah ... African grassland songbirds (rollers, hornbills ...) in the African themed areas.

And again, tell a good engaging story ... billboards re. the wonders of nature and the great outdoors.
 
To Sooty Mangabey- yes Jon Cracknell was Zoological Director (now Head of 'Animal Operations' at Longleat) and his departure from MW is only significant in that he is a good man well respected in the Zoo world for implementation of health care programmes, but not significant in the species collection planning as he wasn't there long enough to to have much input to this. To Gary- as I said the Gemsbok going is the start of the collection review, maybe the likes of the Peccaries etc will go in time, it can't happen all at once with a mass exodus of species- I would argue that the Camels are charismatic, certainly for the average visitor anyway! For your second point, if the geographic zones were to come into fruition then the Amur Tigers & Amur Leopards would have moved into a Boreal Forest Zone anyway, they wouldn't leave the Tigers in the middle of the Congo! The Big Cats would always be a problem with the Zones as they are spaced around the park for a reason- it would be bad behavioural welfare to house them all too closely together, much like the old victorian Zoo Cat houses. Can't see MW getting Bears, but agree about going back into African Lions, and I believe its potentially in the plans, but only when they can afford to do an enclosure worthy of the species- which could be 5 years or so down the line. Kifaru Bwana- your point about conservation activities- yes this will clearly be the new direction now that Dr Tim Woodfine is in charge, and they have already started this with the Savannah Tracks exhibit interpretation. Grevy's are now out in valley & old Gemsbok field, with Hartmanns in the central paddock. Reptiles have improved with the new Cold Blooded Corner, & Bird-wise they have strengthened in the last year or so with the Weavers in Giraffe house, walk through Hornbill/Turaco aviary at Encounter Village, & there are big plans for Wetlands exhibit in the current Flamingo/ Rhea/ Capybara area. Could see the departure of Emu's & Owls after the review though?!
 
WookieDog said:
Could see the departure of Emu's & Owls after the review though?!
Click to expand...

Much as I love owls, those owl aviaries are just awful in terms of how they look - the sort of thing you might expect to find at a garden centre. Cheap and nasty, and as far from good zoo design as you can get. No tears would be shed for their going, I'm sure.
 
Yes I agree, not a good representation of Zoo Owl aviaries at all, I had a similar aviary in my back garden for Australian Finches a few years ago..say no more!
To lose the Owls however would mean that Marwells Bird of Prey collection would be even more non-existent than it is now, maybe they could replace all the Owls with one larger more endangered species... Lappet Faced Vultures or Andean Condors!!??
I don't mean necessarily in the same place as the Owls though, might be better housing Birds like Monal Pheasants or Grouse or something like that to fit in with the Himalayan theme between the Snow Leopards and Takin. Actually they could make a better Red Panda exhibit there instead of right up behind the Snow Leopards.
 
"i would like to hope that the re-organization into zoo-geographic zones will hopefully bring many of the former species back"

Cannot understand why Cat-Man keeps refering to re-introduction of zoo-geographic zones at Marwell. That was an idea that was considered, it was accepted that it was not practical to achieve parkwide, so will not happen. Also I fail to see the link between creation of zoo-geographic zones and the return of species kept formerly. Of course it is nice to be nostalgic and have wish-lists of animals we may like to see, but the reality is that this is a living collection with responsibilities, so needs to move on. Thank to WookieDog, who seems to have his finger on Marwell's pulse and a much better understanding on how and why Marwell will be developing.
 
I remember speaking to the cheif exec a few months ago, and the clear problem with everything was money. There have been real plans to move forward; the £6 million 'Adaptations' project been a key example of this, but funds and planning issues had always been there to raise their ugly heads. If they've sorted something out now for the collection plan in the relatively near future, then at least it brings some clearer vision for the Park's direction. (And I hope it finally includes building the much delayed emu and kangaroo house if they're not to be sent off!)

I think the main thing I want sorted at Marwell is much of the interpretation which could be more engaging and detailed, which is thankfully beginning to improve in Savannah Tracks. I really found the replacement of fun but still educational graphics in the reptile barn with children's 'spot the difference' games etc in Cold Blooded Corner a bit tragic...
 
I'd be interested to know how much is in the kitty so to speak as far as future developments go-one thing I did like about the old school of thought was the more basic barn structured houses for animals rather than the more modern ones that seem to house wildly disparate animals, as I feel these are more a sop to humans than the animals.

I'm sure ergo that simpler housing must therefore be cheaper? Personally I'm there for the animals not for the cages!

I suppose some of it is down to the 'bunny hugger' brigade that think just because something looks pretty to them, it must contribute to the animal's welfare, rather than taking into account the animal's own needs.

(Maybe I'm just a old reactionary but I was brought up in the days of Knowles, Aspinall and Durrell, so still believe in a lot of their ideas, dated as they may be).

I think a good case could be made for Indian Tigers given the spiralling downward population in recent years and they do seem to be under represented in the UK nowadays. Especially as the two Tigers left now are retired non-breeders.

I think bears would be a good charismatic species as a draw and would fit in well in the Roof of the World exhibit-Himalayan Blacks are not a common species in the UK either.
 
Marwell makes no attempt IMO to 'screen' new buildings with vegetation/earth. As new houses or indoor holdings were built, the park began to have what look like modern agricultural outhouses dotted about the landscape. Most of them are aesthetically harsh IMO.

I feel that Marwell could make better use of its two large areas of woodland. When so many other collections have free-roaming callitrichids, Marwell keep them in a row of aviaries. I don't think a nature reserve is a good use of the woods at Marwell, I'd rather see the woodland used in the way Port Lympne or Africa Alive use theirs.

It makes economic sense to move on species that are similar to others in the park. Most visitors would be satisfied seeing sable antelope without seeing roan, arabian oryx without seeing gemsbok. It seems pointless keeping chapman's zebra when visitors have already seen two other species by the time they reach them. The park will lose its character if the 'gems' we consider to be the heart of the collection, which to me will always be the diversity of antelope species, begin to leave, but then I don't think a commercially-succesful Marwell in 5 years time would look anything like the Marwell of the 70s and 80s.

In recent years, the park acquired Dorcas gazelle, takin, and white-tailed gnu, so I'm not sure its in danger of becoming too bland overnight.
 
One small thing-why don't the Tapirs and Hippo's have an outdoor pool?

They also don't seem to have a lot of shade-perhaps a few trees or a lean-to would make the rather bare enclosures a bit better?

I do like the idea of Lemur Wood-the Lemurs place in the walled garden could be given over the the Marmosets so they'd have a lot more space to bounce about, and the Lemurs a more appropriate habitat.

Ideally though I'd like to see the Tigers in a wooded enclosure and maybe put Lions in the existing Tiger enclosure.
 
Actually, as not all lemurs live in dense forest, in fact a naturalistic habitat could be achieved for most of the species in the current lemur garden. My point was that it is possible to keep most marmoset and tamarin species in free-ranging situations, I'm surprised Marwell doesn't.

The hippo exhibit is not the most attractive IMO, but Marwell are the most successful in the UK with this species. It goes to show that you can put as many cheese plants in as you want in wooden boxes around a shady enclosure covered in bark chip, but what pygmy hippos are built to do is submerge in water and graze. More shade would mean less grazing for the hippos at Marwell, and lack of it doesn't appear to affect them adversely. I'm not sure why they don't have outdoor pools.
 
I imagine Marwell Pygmy Hippos and Tapirs are the only ones in the UK (and elsewhere too?) that don't have outdoor pools. I've suggested before it would be an improvement, though they do seem fine with just the tiny indoor 'baths'.
 
Hippo and Tapir pool,s

The presant day house was built some 26 yrs ago, wen the buget was very tight,and plans were changing over night as to speak. The original tapir house which is to the left of the Semi Aquactic House, and now used for various activities for visitors, in fact did have an out door pool but no indoor pool. Totally agree that some shade in the paddocks would be ideal for the animals and more pleasing from visitors point of veiw.
 
For years, Howletts and Port Lympne didn't have outdoor pools for the tapirs, and were very successful with both species.
 
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