Worst UK Zoos

[OrangePerson]

Because Monkey World is an ape rescue centre, maybe?

Just because a rescue centre exists does not mean the people who have used an animal should be able to wash their hands of responsibilty for its future. They've used them to make money over the years they should be prepared to contribute to their retirement.

 

[zoogiraffe]

Just because a rescue centre exists does not mean the people who have used an animal should be able to wash their hands of responsibilty for its future. They've used them to make money over the years they should be prepared to contribute to their retirement.

Hang on a minute as somebody that knows Doug and Carol who used to run Southport Zoo if they could have taken the 2 Chimps with them they would have done as it was they offered them to Monkeyworld,and were prepared to cover the cost of building the enclosure to house them but the money that Monkeyworld wanted for doing that was to great for them,so they went to South Wales where an enclosure was built for them for under half the cost of what Monkeyworld wanted.

 

[johnstoni]

I don't think it would have been a very good idea for them to take the chimpanzees with them to the Yorkshire Dales.

I think your post is very revealing. They went with the cheapest bidder in a sense. I don't think the Cefn yr Erw accommodation is of the same quality of the type of housing Monkey World provides its chimpanzees. I'm not knocking it, their chimp houses are perfectly adequate, and Monkey World could possibly have afforded to charge less for a housing these animals.

I don't think the issue with Cefn Yr Erw is actually the chimps, if they'd stuck to chimpanzees then maybe they'd be coming in for less criticism. Even the baboons were a good move. Its the other primates that are housed in some of the worst examples of monkey housing in the UK IMO.

 

[willtheman45]

Hi there,
I just have a few points to make-surprised by the amount of posts in the alst 4 days!

First< i'd like to apologise to anyone who took offence to my subject-I understand it is difficult for zoos speding on money on food, vet bills etc. so not all goes to enclosures. I didn't want this thread to be the anti-zoo arguement it is now.

Secondly, i like Shaldon , it is a lovely little zoo and the only negative list it was ever on was snowleopards.

Thirdly, stop slating the Welsh ape rescue centre. Ok , the enclosures aren't perfect but the people probably don't have masses to spend on them but they are giving them as comfortable life as possible. Some of the surroundings they were in before would have been worst.

Thanks for rading.

 

[adrian1963]

It's about time we all calmed down because lately all the threads on here have turn into arguments about who's right and who's wrong, This is a forum for friendly banter and information to pass on to each other.
As for the worst zoo, it doesn't matter what one person thinks because someone else will more then likley be affended, Everyone as a favourite and worst zoo for different reasons and you'll never get evrerybody to agree because if we did like would be so boring, so lets get back to friendly banter, and I don't think there's a worst zoo because all zoo's try there best with the budgets they have and yes some could do with improving but it's like everything else there'll always be a favourite and a worst
here's to happy banter

 

[gentle lemur]

If I built a shed in my garden for some macaques I had paid to have flown over from terrible old Eastern Europe while hundreds die and are mutilated each year in british labs (not to mention douracoulis, squirrel monkeys, callitrichids, capuchins, spider monkeys and baboons), would I be applauded?

There is no need for melodrama: the facts are easily available. The Home Office figures for 2008 are that there were 368 procedures on 262 individual marmosets and tamarins (93 classified as fundamental biological research and 275 as applied research on human medicine or dentistry) and 4230 procedures on 3092 individual macaques (133 and 3737 in the same categories, plus 360 for research on the protection of man, animals or the environment). Many of these procedures were experiments which had minimal effects on the animals and required no anaesthesia.
No experiments on other primates were carried out in the UK.
The statistics are available from
rds scientific procedures on living animals

Alan

 

[johnstoni]

This really isn't the place to debate whether vivisection is right or wrong, but the language you use suggests you are riled by its mention, so I accept your feeling the need to have corrected me. However, re-read the post, I said 'hundreds' die and are mutilated....so I am well aware that many experiments do not harm the primates they are being carried out on. But thanks for pointing out the species error - I am aware these are possibilities that indeed are included in the lists on the site you mention, perhaps you are aware of some agreement around not using the other species I mentioned?

I would like to reiterate my point that, while we as a country used '3092 macaques' in experiments last year, it really is ridiculous for people to applaud a sanctuary for 'saving' individual macaques from the continent when the accommodation for their current animals badly needs improving.

Those who feel the sanctuary should somehow be exempt from a thread titled 'worst UK zoos', should remember that the spider monkeys (there were two originally), and the ruffed lemurs came from far superior accommodation at Southport zoo. They made receive all the tender loving care in the world at Cefn yr Erw, but their living spaces have got smaller and less stimulating.

 

[gentle lemur]

This really isn't the place to debate whether vivisection is right or wrong, but the language you use suggests you are riled by its mention, so I accept your feeling the need to have corrected me. However, re-read the post, I said 'hundreds' die and are mutilated....so I am well aware that many experiments do not harm the primates they are being carried out on. But thanks for pointing out the species error - I am aware these are possibilities that indeed are included in the lists on the site you mention, perhaps you are aware of some agreement around not using the other species I mentioned?

I quite agree that it would not be appropriate to debate vivisection here. I was disturbed by the tone of the comments in your first post - but I agree that you are correct about the ballpark numbers. I think there is a well accepted policy against the use of great apes and I would not be surprised if this is unofficially extended to most other large species, but I don't think there is anything formal in the Home Office policy.

Alan

 

[John Dineley]

Those who feel the sanctuary should somehow be exempt from a thread titled 'worst UK zoos', should remember that the spider monkeys (there were two originally), and the ruffed lemurs came from far superior accommodation at Southport zoo. They made receive all the tender loving care in the world at Cefn yr Erw, but their living spaces have got smaller and less stimulating.

I always worry about the use of the world 'sanctuary' for animal collections. They tend to be rather pious and look down their noses at other zoos and in some cases keep animals in conditions that many traditional zoos would find wanting. I assume they must have a zoo license and therefore they are a zoo what ever they call themselves and, therefore need to comply with the standard set down by The Standards of Modern Zoo Practice.

I also note they seem to have some animals that may be useful to be included on captive breeding programmes. I wonder if they are involved in any? If not why are they are allowing animals to bred as they have hand-reared at least one abandon gibbon; they seem rather proud of that fact. But what purpose does this serve other than providing yet another mouth to feed when clearly they are strapped for cash and their raison d'etre is rescuing unwanted and abused primates.

No details of their eduction programme which is a shame.

I don't wish to knock Cefn yr Erw out of hand but I just feel a bit uneasy with 'animal sanctuaries' and sometimes wonder if some are operated so the owners get to indulge 'playing with animals'. Don't get me wrong I know a number of privately run zoos who have this ethos. Fortunately they are a dying breed.

 

[johnstoni]

I am not 100% sure but I think the gibbon hand-raised there is 'oliver', who to the best of my knowledge has the open hotwired enclosure, while the other gibbons (including his parents) have the row of cages.

They have also bred from their 'rescued' black and white ruffed lemurs, which came from a number of sources.