ZooChat Cup Group A2: Berlin Tierpark vs Wroclaw

[CGSwans]

And so it begins. The topic? Africa. Remember that this category is shared with the other match currently underway. Continental Africa counts, but Madagascar doesn’t.

A quick word on theming. Given the prevalence of geographic theming in zoos it *is* within scope to consider how ‘Africa’ is represented thematically, but it’s up to you: you’re not obliged to do so.

 

[TeaLovingDave]

Perhaps a trickier one for me than it seems, given I thought the Afrycarium at Wroclaw (although nice enough) was very much over-hyped also, their best exhibit doesn't count for this challenge.

I'll have to mull over this.

 

[ThylacineAlive]

The Afrykarium in addition to their Savanna/Sahara regions and their superior Barbary Macaque enclosure make this a pretty easy win for Wroclaw for me.

~Thylo

 

[TeaLovingDave]

and their superior Barbary Macaque enclosure make this a pretty easy win for Wroclaw for me.

It's certainly bigger, but *is* it superior? I'd personally give the Tierpark Berlin exhibits for this species the edge in terms of suitability for the inhabitants, given the significantly-better climbing opportunities

Compare and contrast:

and....

 

[Coelacanth18]

Which ones of those is which?

 

[TeaLovingDave]

Which ones of those is which?

First one is Wroclaw, the second two are both at Tierpark Berlin.

 

[lintworm]

Can't the Macaque in Wroclaw access the trees, the climbing opportunities in Berlin aren't that great either..

 

[ThylacineAlive]

Can't the Macaque in Wroclaw access the trees, the climbing opportunities in Berlin aren't that great either..

This is why I said superior. I don't think every tree can be climbed but most of them can be.

I did forget about that second enclosure at TP tbh but I still stand by my point, not that I think Berlin's enclosures are bad per say.

~Thylo

 

[Chlidonias]

I thought the Afrycarium at Wroclaw (although nice enough) was very much over-hyped also, their best exhibit doesn't count for this challenge.

I think of Wroclaw and I think Afrycarium, so it should be the winner. What is "their best exhibit" which doesn't count?

As for the Barbary Macaque enclosures I agree with @ThylacineAlive that Wroclaw's is much better.

 

[Brum]

I think of Wroclaw and I think Afrycarium, so it should be the winner. What is "their best exhibit" which doesn't count?

I haven't been but I assume it's the manatee exhibit, which contains geographically incorrect manatees.

 

[TeaLovingDave]

I haven't been but I assume it's the manatee exhibit, which contains geographically incorrect manatees.

Yep, that's the one.

 

[Chlidonias]

I haven't been but I assume it's the manatee exhibit, which contains geographically incorrect manatees.

Oh yeah, I remember that from when it was being built and people had their hearts all swelling with hope over African Manatees coming to Europe.

 

[Mr. Zootycoon]

I haven't been but I assume it's the manatee exhibit, which contains geographically incorrect manatees.

Are we sure that this exhibit doesn't count at all? The manatees don't count obviously, but it also has fish in it, so if they are African fish Wroclaw has got itself another huge fish tank.

That raises the question on where the limits of the category are. Is an African themed exhibit with some non-African species still countable? Or if it has no African species but clearly has African theming?

 

[TheGerenuk]

2-1 Wroclaw. The Afrykarium from what I heard is amazing and they also have quite a few other African exhibits. Still giving a point to the Tierpark for a good species lineup.

 

[Coelacanth18]

Are we sure that this exhibit doesn't count at all? The manatees don't count obviously, but it also has fish in it, so if they are African fish Wroclaw has got itself another huge fish tank.

That raises the question on where the limits of the category are. Is an African themed exhibit with some non-African species still countable? Or if it has no African species but clearly has African theming?

I would agree with the statement in bold, and I would also say that I think an African-themed complex with mostly African species could be counted as a whole, as long as the reasoning doesn't rest on the non-African species or their housing.

Why would an African-themed exhibit not have any African species? What would that even look like?

 

[Mr. Zootycoon]

Why would an African-themed exhibit not have any African species? What would that even look like?

It could be stand-in species for example. I recall that several zoos have/had some Asian Leopard subspecies in their African-themed areas. I've also read something about Dwarf Mongooses in an Asian themed area (London, if I'm not mistaken, but I'm not sure if they're mixed with something else). I wouldn't be surprised if it happens more often with cold-blooded creatures.

 

[twilighter]

I have instatly vote for Wroclaw, cos also associated it with Africarium, but than was thinking, if for a second we put the building on a side, seems like that Wroclaw is not so clear winner.

The TP totaly dominate in African ungulates , matching the Wroclaw's biggest trump ( The Red Hartebeest) with Gerenuk and Mountain reedbuck. The African Elephants are in notourios house, but in a way better condition, then Pigmy hippo is in Pachidermy house in Wroclaw and living better life than Hippos in Africarium's indoor pool.

The Carnivores are not the strongest side for both, but the Lion+Painted Dog+Fennec enclousures in Wroclaw can not match The 2 Hyenas/Banded mongoose/Bat-eared fox area in Berlin.The Cape fur seal pool in Africarium is actually the best carnivore enclosure Wroclaw has.

The African penguin pool is strong card, but the with total 25 species in the Africarium and closed bird house, I am not sure that Wroclaw can beat the TP in African Birds either. Only the Birds of Prey in the last's colection are more than ten. Besides the native African spieces, a huge part of the Migratory birds, spends the winter in Africa, which can make the Berlin's position even stronger.

Exhibits of the Gealadas and Barbary macaque in Germany are clearly better than the 70's Chimp house in Poland.It is interesting question, if the Barbary macaque enclousure in Wroclaw should be counted in African competition, since they are in European zone, mixed with mouflons and probably reffer to Gibraltar popultaion?

Miscellaneous mammals count is perhaps on par,and if the Wroclaw have advantage here, with the Aardvark, is good to mention, that his exhibit in the Africarium is not the best one.

I think, that the only area, where Wroclaw unquestionaly beats the TP is African ecotherms.

I am going to change my vote and put the TP ahead, but can be convinced to swap back. 2:1 for TP Berlin.