ZooChat Cup Group A2: Omaha vs Wroclaw

[ThylacineAlive]

No, I knew it won on species all along, didn't even realise by how much! Species matter more to me than a couple of better enclosures! It is an absolute hammering on species, more than double, so if anyone wants to vote Wroclaw it is justified! Someone else voted Wroclaw before me then changed!

Wroclaw has a good list of Asian mammals, not bad on birds either. I doubt Reptiles, amphibians or fish will be beaten either. Is anyone able to supply a mammal and bird list for Omaha please?

Thanks for posting the lists and photos. Not too much in it really on species, Wroclaw probably shades it, but obviously that isn't the only thing to consider.

Interesting that you state Omaha has the larger collection, if the mammals and birds you listed earlier are the only ones I think it has less mammals and birds and definitely considerably less herps!

Also:

I'm afraid I don't have a species list written, I just went through and counted on Zootierliste. If I have time I will post lists later

You're allowed to vote whichever way you want and that's fine, if you think Wroclaw deserves to win on species alone then that's your choice. I can't say the species list isn't a great one and Wroclaw doesn't have all horrible enclosures so I can't really blame you. I do feel you're being a bit overly aggressive and disingenuous in your posts here, though. You've never visited either zoo and according to your own posts you didn't know what animals either zoo held, you just voted for Wroclaw because you figured it might have more species (see above quotes) and then seemingly got angry when people didn't vote your way based on those (admittedly correct) assumptions along without any arguments or data to back it up. Additionally Omaha does not have "a couple better enclosures", it has A LOT of better enclosures. Not to mention many enclosures that knock the socks off of pretty much any zoo.

I'm not going to continue debating this with you here, but in the future if you want a certain zoo to win it might be more beneficial to your cause to actually make arguments and provide evidence as opposed to making blanket statement you clearly don't know are true and then being passive aggressive with people who aren't seeing what you're seeing.

~Thylo

 

[pipaluk]

Also:


You're allowed to vote whichever way you want and that's fine, if you think Wroclaw deserves to win on species alone then that's your choice. I can't say the species list isn't a great one and Wroclaw doesn't have all horrible enclosures so I can't really blame you. I do feel you're being a bit overly aggressive and disingenuous in your posts here, though. You've never visited either zoo and according to your own posts you didn't know what animals either zoo held, you just voted for Wroclaw because you figured it might have more species (see above quotes) and then seemingly got angry when people didn't vote your way based on those (admittedly correct) assumptions along without any arguments or data to back it up. Additionally Omaha does not have "a couple better enclosures", it has A LOT of better enclosures. Not to mention many enclosures that knock the socks off of pretty much any zoo.

I'm not going to continue debating this with you here, but in the future if you want a certain zoo to win it might be more beneficial to your cause to actually make arguments and provide evidence as opposed to making blanket statement you clearly don't know are true and then being passive aggressive with people who aren't seeing what you're seeing.

~Thylo

What is your problem mate? Get over it! Now who is being aggressive?
How many of the 24 people voting for Omaha have been there either?! I'm not angry who anyone votes for, I will leave the cup to those it matters to in future, but 115 to 50 species is a hammering in my book. I don't think I should be criticised because I have a different opinion!

 

[amur leopard]

For those who haven't been to either collection, or just one, here are a few photos to give you a general idea.
Thanks to @Echobeast and a few others
Starting with Omaha:


(Gaur)


(Sloth bear)


(Snow leopard)



(Takin and goral)


(Amur tiger)

Wroclaw up next

 

[pipaluk]

While the above makes a strong case for Wroclaw and the species list is mouthwatering, I still believe Omaha's larger collection and much stronger exhibits earn them the win.

~Thylo

Since I have been accused of making assumptions, I feel it necessary to refer you to this statement. Any assumptions I may or may not have made after consulting Zootierliste were at least proved to be correct. The bold statement made in the quote (based on assumption clearly) has been shown to be totally incorrect as Omaha does not have a larger collection at all, far from it!

 

[amur leopard]

Wroclaw:
Thanks to @Neva and @Arek



(Clouded leopard)


(Eurasian otter)


(Snow leopard - exhibit larger but not in rest of photo)


(Indian rhino and what I think is a Pileated gibbon?)

Thanks,

AL

 

[Brum]

Don't think Omaha have gaur any more...

 

[ThylacineAlive]

Don't think Omaha have gaur any more...

They do not. Additionally, he posted mainly photos already included in this thread However the Snow Leopard photos are good additions, I forgot to include those ones

Additionally here is the entire elephant yard at Wroclaw:

Unfortunately there are no photos of the indoors on ZooChat.

~Thylo

 

[ThylacineAlive]

Since I have been accused of making assumptions, I feel it necessary to refer you to this statement. Any assumptions I may or may not have made after consulting Zootierliste were at least proved to be correct. The bold statement made in the quote (based on assumption clearly) has been shown to be totally incorrect as Omaha does not have a larger collection at all, far from it!

It wasn't an assumption, I based my species list for Wroclaw the same way I did for Omaha: species I'd noted as having seen on-exhibit + any additional species I knew they kept that I hadn't seen. This method gave me a higher total of species for Omaha than Wroclaw, however I had forgotten about a good few mammals such as the chevrotain and I believe there have been further arrivals since my 2018 visit which makes up for the discrepancy. I try to be as accurate as possible when compiling my posts but sometimes I miss things. Either way, thanks to @ShonenJake13 for giving an accurate species list and, yes, proving me wrong

~Thylo

 

[TeaLovingDave]

It wasn't an assumption, I based my species list for Wroclaw the same way I did for Omaha: species I'd noted as having seen on-exhibit + any additional species I knew they kept that I hadn't seen. This method gave me a higher total of species for Omaha than Wroclaw, however I had forgotten about a good few mammals such as the chevrotain and I believe there have been further arrivals since my 2018 visit which makes up for the discrepancy. I try to be as accurate as possible when compiling my posts but sometimes I miss things. Either way, thanks to @ShonenJake13 for giving an accurate species list and, yes, proving me wrong

~Thylo

That said, if one counts off-display species - which @pipaluk is presumably doing given his remarks that the Bear Cuscus at Wroclaw earns it one point single-handedly - then the odds are pretty good that Omaha will end up with a lot more reptiles on their docket, swinging the "total species" pendulum the other way once again

 

[pipaluk]

That said, if one counts off-display species - which @pipaluk is presumably doing given his remarks that the Bear Cuscus at Wroclaw earns it one point single-handedly - then the odds are pretty good that Omaha will end up with a lot more reptiles on their docket, swinging the "total species" pendulum the other way once again

I didn't actually give Wroclaw a point for Bear Cuscus though, otherwise I would have scored it 3-0

 

[TeaLovingDave]

I didn't actually give Wroclaw a point for Bear Cuscus though, otherwise I would have scored it 3-0

Your own words beg to differ

I actually think Wroclaw is worth a point for the Bear Cuscus alone!

 

[pipaluk]

Your own words beg to differ

OK, I'd better change my vote to 3-0 then!!

 

[TeaLovingDave]

OK, I'd better change my vote to 3-0 then!!

Fair enough although this means you now have to admit that Omaha possibly does have the larger overall collection if one includes offshow species, and thus given the fact that:

Species matter more to me than a couple of better enclosures!

...you should theoretically now vote in favour of Omaha

 

[pipaluk]

Fair enough although this means you now have to admit that Omaha possibly does have the larger overall collection if one includes offshow species, and thus given the fact that:



...you should theoretically now vote in favour of Omaha

Can you explain why you originally voted for Wroclaw?

 

[TeaLovingDave]

Can you explain why you originally voted for Wroclaw?

Certainly I was heading for a train and (having recently visited Wroclaw) was familiar enough with it that I knew it merited *some* points, but didn't have time to read up on Omaha, so voted 2-1 Wroclaw as a placeholder. Once I had a chance to read more (and compare photos from Omaha with the exhibitry I'd seen at Wroclaw) I made a more informed judgement. Wroclaw is a very nice collection with some very good exhibits, but it really is a zoo of two halves; the newer areas are as noted very good, but many of the older areas are very bad.

 

[pipaluk]

Certainly I was heading for a train and (having recently visited Wroclaw) was familiar enough with it that I knew it merited *some* points, but didn't have time to read up on Omaha, so voted 2-1 Wroclaw as a placeholder. Once I had a chance to read more (and compare photos from Omaha with the exhibitry I'd seen at Wroclaw) I made a more informed judgement. Wroclaw is a very nice collection with some very good exhibits, but it really is a zoo of two halves; the newer areas are as noted very good, but many of the older areas are very bad.

So you based your vote on assumption then! Thank you for your honesty.
I didn't vote until Thylo posted his list for Omaha.

 

[CGSwans]

For what it’s worth I thought you *all* voted in accordance with the rules. Made a vote, explained the reasoning when asked = no problems that I can see.