No, it was requestioned for plant (as in machinery) storage.
ZSL London Zoo London Zoo discussion thread
- Thread starter Fallax
- Start date
True, although this will now leave the current house, which occupies valuable land, unable to accommodate animals. I don’t want it to be demolished but that’s more space that can’t be used to house animals - it is a zoo after all, not a museum!
Maybe I’m being harsh in the first sense, although there’s little practical value unless they’re able to exhibit animals. Again, it is a zoo! If it’s unsuitable to be used to exhibit animals the zoo MUST be permitted redevelop them to be able to do so, or knock it down to build a new exhibit. If they’re going to keep animals here as is without major structural development, it would be such a shame to not make use of the mountains.
I think we need to be realistic; in 1914 animal welfare standards and the scrutiny this particular zoo was subjected to were very different - we are talking pre both wars and the idea of a human, let alone an animal at the peaks now is pretty much unthinkable.
equidae
Well-Known Member
How poor of a condition is the current reptile house in? I was thinking the other day that, if they joined up some of the exhibits inside, it might make a nice house for more nocturnal species.
Which entrance did you use to enter the Cassons?
Reptile House
Well-Known Member
I thought that zoo members get free parking off peak?
When the Queen died, all these car transporters turned up with brand new Range Rovers on it, theses were parked in the zoo car park. The car park was guarded by police 24/7.
Kalaw
Well-Known Member
Absolutely. I grew up in Scarborough, and the tiny dolphin pool at the now closed Zoo & Marineland was disgraceful. You can see the horrid thing from 13:28 here:
I haven't had time to properly look through the whole conversation from a few days ago, but my two cents boil down to this. London may well have been a tremendous zoo in the past, with past regulations. Now it is relatively speaking not what it once was and we can all agree on that. However I still thing it is a fantastic zoo, and strongly disagree with those saying it is outside the top twenty in the UK. I think, myself included, that some regulars sometimes take London for granted. Some of the enclosures are fantastic, and there are very few black marks.
For the space available, the tiger exhibit is brilliant. Rainforest Life is genuinely one of the most underrated exhibits out there in my opinion. It's a sizeable home for all the species, rises probably about 15 metres off the ground, with in places thick vegetation and the best representation of a cross-section of the Amazonian rainforest I've ever seen. Add to that a pretty giant Narrow-striped mongoose enclosure when all the consecutive cages are added up, a nice lion tamarin setup and viewing from the ground level as well as from above and I've realised it's one of my favourite exhibits I've ever seen yet I've taken it for granted for so long.
Night Life is a place in transition for sure. But change is happening, and the rate at which is doing so appears to be accelerating somewhat. In the last few weeks we've seen a bunch of updates and I hope soon we'll have new inhabitants for the old water rat exhibit. In the meantime though, the place is wonderful for the various lorises and bushbabies in particular. Land of the Lions has grown on me a bit and is great for the species held there, BUGS is one of, if not the, country's premier invert houses and compares favourably with Europe's best too as I understand. And last but by no means least the Blackburn Pavilion is brilliant, with a very choice species list and a couple of really nice walkthroughs.
There's so much good to talk about at this place, but often all one finds on this thread is overwhelming negativity based on a reflection of the past. I agree that the zoo has potential, and that decisions made in the past were possibly not the best, but I see absolutely no reason to be dooming and putting the zoo down, especially in a context where we have arguably more development than we've had for a long time both with regards to the collection and exhibits.
As an aside I visited today and saw all four water deer - very cute but quite flighty. Will post images later. Also saw the Senegal bushbabies which was really nice. But the highlight was seeing an Okapi dancing in the pouring rain - more than worth getting drenched to watch him.
For the space available, the tiger exhibit is brilliant. Rainforest Life is genuinely one of the most underrated exhibits out there in my opinion. It's a sizeable home for all the species, rises probably about 15 metres off the ground, with in places thick vegetation and the best representation of a cross-section of the Amazonian rainforest I've ever seen. Add to that a pretty giant Narrow-striped mongoose enclosure when all the consecutive cages are added up, a nice lion tamarin setup and viewing from the ground level as well as from above and I've realised it's one of my favourite exhibits I've ever seen yet I've taken it for granted for so long.
Night Life is a place in transition for sure. But change is happening, and the rate at which is doing so appears to be accelerating somewhat. In the last few weeks we've seen a bunch of updates and I hope soon we'll have new inhabitants for the old water rat exhibit. In the meantime though, the place is wonderful for the various lorises and bushbabies in particular. Land of the Lions has grown on me a bit and is great for the species held there, BUGS is one of, if not the, country's premier invert houses and compares favourably with Europe's best too as I understand. And last but by no means least the Blackburn Pavilion is brilliant, with a very choice species list and a couple of really nice walkthroughs.
There's so much good to talk about at this place, but often all one finds on this thread is overwhelming negativity based on a reflection of the past. I agree that the zoo has potential, and that decisions made in the past were possibly not the best, but I see absolutely no reason to be dooming and putting the zoo down, especially in a context where we have arguably more development than we've had for a long time both with regards to the collection and exhibits.
As an aside I visited today and saw all four water deer - very cute but quite flighty. Will post images later. Also saw the Senegal bushbabies which was really nice. But the highlight was seeing an Okapi dancing in the pouring rain - more than worth getting drenched to watch him.
Whilst I can't agree with everything ( I will never like BUGS or land of the lions), I think it would make the top 20 but would struggle to be top 10 probably .
Kalaw
Well-Known Member
I agree with your above post almost word for word, @amur leopard ! I think people need to accept that, without massive philanthropic aid (which is possible, but unlikely) or Regent's Park allowing them to expand further (which will almost certainly never happen), London will not be able to reach the immeasurably high standards that it once did. To say that it could be better would be accurate - between the Cassons, the Mappins, the canalside and some of the lawns in the centre, there is ample room to expand which should be taken advantage of. But that is no different to any other zoo that I have visited, yet London always seems to receive harsher criticism for this.
Until recently, one small point of disagreement between us would be Rainforest Life, which I was never that fond of. The fact that the visitor walkways have a lower roof and darker lighting than the main mixed-species habitat means that, although it is technically a walkthrough, it is hard to truly immerse yourself. But the sakis, who don't seem afraid of visitors, and are confident enough to run along the floor, leap straight past you, and perch on branches right beside visitors, single-handedly counter this issue. And, having been hypnotised watching them, I found that with a bit of patience, the titis, tamarins and flying foxes are also likely to be active. Not sure I would say it is one of my favourite exhibits, but it's pretty damn good.
Despite only six months separating my visit last weekend and my second most recent visit in February, I counted 11 new species, which I don't think has ever happened before barring when a major new exhibit opened (which is about to happen again very soon), with several signs of further development in the future, new areas open to the public and several species having moved about, in most cases to their benefit. Compare it to 2013, when I first became a regular visitor, and perhaps there has been a slight decline. But compare it to, say, 2019, when the Aquarium had just closed and the future was looking bleak, and I think the improvement has been immense, and the future looks brighter than ever in my lifetime.
I'm not sure whether people's needless hostility towards London is because it possibly has more people local to it than any other on this forum (meaning that they take its strengths for granted and are more observant of its flaws) or because they insist on comparing it to its past. But the truth is that if Blackburn Pavilion, Tiny Giants, Land of the Lions, Penguin Beach, Tiger Territory, Night Life, Rainforest Life, the Reptile House, the Komodo Dragon House, Giants of the Galapagos and Bird Safari were at any other British zoo, that zoo would regularly be cited as one of the country's greatest.
Until recently, one small point of disagreement between us would be Rainforest Life, which I was never that fond of. The fact that the visitor walkways have a lower roof and darker lighting than the main mixed-species habitat means that, although it is technically a walkthrough, it is hard to truly immerse yourself. But the sakis, who don't seem afraid of visitors, and are confident enough to run along the floor, leap straight past you, and perch on branches right beside visitors, single-handedly counter this issue. And, having been hypnotised watching them, I found that with a bit of patience, the titis, tamarins and flying foxes are also likely to be active. Not sure I would say it is one of my favourite exhibits, but it's pretty damn good.
Despite only six months separating my visit last weekend and my second most recent visit in February, I counted 11 new species, which I don't think has ever happened before barring when a major new exhibit opened (which is about to happen again very soon), with several signs of further development in the future, new areas open to the public and several species having moved about, in most cases to their benefit. Compare it to 2013, when I first became a regular visitor, and perhaps there has been a slight decline. But compare it to, say, 2019, when the Aquarium had just closed and the future was looking bleak, and I think the improvement has been immense, and the future looks brighter than ever in my lifetime.
I'm not sure whether people's needless hostility towards London is because it possibly has more people local to it than any other on this forum (meaning that they take its strengths for granted and are more observant of its flaws) or because they insist on comparing it to its past. But the truth is that if Blackburn Pavilion, Tiny Giants, Land of the Lions, Penguin Beach, Tiger Territory, Night Life, Rainforest Life, the Reptile House, the Komodo Dragon House, Giants of the Galapagos and Bird Safari were at any other British zoo, that zoo would regularly be cited as one of the country's greatest.
Don’t forget the sloths, which are always in the public area.
Kalaw
Well-Known Member
True, although given how rarely they move, how slow they are on the few occasions that they do so, and how much of a crowd seems to gather around them every single time, the sakis are still far more entertaining in my opinion.
This discussion about Rainforest Life has made me realise that, with the sakis, London now has four primate walkthroughs, with 7 species between them. In terms of walkthrough primate spaces, does any British zoo have as much on offer?
While we're talking about primates, London now has the joint second largest primate collection in the country if I'm not mistaken with the addition of the sakis and the bushbabies.
How many does London have now? I am surprised it has more than monkeyworld, Twycross, Dudley? there are a few others I would have thought may be close, the Aspinalls ....
Kalaw
Well-Known Member
- Hanuman Langur
- Bolivian Squirrel Monkey
- White-cheeked Gibbon
- Western Gorilla
- Diana Monkey
- Sulawesi Crested Macaque
- White-naped Mangabey
- Kikuyu Colobus
- Lac Alaotra Gentle Lemur
- Aye-Aye
- Senegal Galago
- Golden-headed Lion Tamarin
- Goeldi's Monkey
- Coppery Titi
- White-faced Saki
- Golden Lion Tamarin
- Red-faced Spider Monkey
- Moholi Galago
- Grey Slender Loris
- Pygmy Slow Loris
- Potto
Which would make it 21 species. A very impressive collection, but not sure how that compares to other British zoos. Monkey World has 24, and Chester also has more if memory serves, but I could be mistaken.
Chester is top with 25 species, London, Twycross and Monkey World are all at 22, Paignton at 21.
You forgot the Ring tailed lemurs in the above count, and the 24 listed at Monkey World are taxa not species - they have three chimpanzee subspecies
.Primates are a strong suit for UK zoos, so it's not a bad thing to be so highly placed, especially being comparable with a number of primate specialist facilities both here and on the continent.
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ZTL lists 24 primate taxa at Monkey World, 23 at Twycross, 22 at London and 18 at Dudley and Port Lympne
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See above, you're counting taxa not species.
Carnivores
Tiger
Lion
African Wild Dog
Meerkat *
ASCO *
Narrow striped mongoose
Dwarf mongoose
Ring tailed coati *
Anything else? * indicates hardly worth counting realistically!