European (Tea)Cup - League B - Prague vs Zagreb

Prague vs Zagreb - ISLANDS AND AUSTRALIA

  • Prague 3/2 Zagreb

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Zagreb 3/2 Prague

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Zagreb 4/1 Prague

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Zagreb 5/0 Prague

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    26
  • Poll closed .

TeaLovingDave

Moderator
Staff member
15+ year member
This time round, we will be taking another look at the category of ISLANDS AND AUSTRALIA; Prague has been faring pretty well so far, but is Zagreb the collection which will place a major roadblock in its path?

Time - and the discussion which I hope will take place within this thread - will tell.....
 
I don't think this one is going to be all that close, but there are definitely a handful of category-relevant highlights at Zagreb which should - in my opinion - prevent it from being a complete washout for the collection. Once more people have thrown their hats into the ring, I'll see if I can provide a general breakdown of the exhibits in question.

However, these can only go so far - overall, it's a pretty easy 4:1 vote for Prague!
 
The excellent Darwin Crater and the Indonesian Jungle diversity at Prague are good enough for 4:1, but there's also Lemur Island, Fossa, Javan Green Magpie, Javan Rusa, Moloch Gibbon and many more.

The Madagascar House, the small Australia exhibit and Komodo Dragons at Zagreb are probably their main assets to claim a point, but this is another game dangerously close to 5:0.
 
4:1 for now but will be voting 5:0 if no one can convince me of giving Zagreb 1 point: an indonesian house with the first breeding of critically endangered chinese pangolins (taiwanese subspecies) outside of taiwan, komodo dragons (with excellent breeding results!) Sunda pig tailed macaque, Palawan binturong, new Guinea ground cuscus, southern Luzon giant cloud rat, sunda slow Lori's, treeshrew, Phillipines porcupine, then the parrot trails with lots of rare parrot and lory species (I don't know if all species are eligible for this category though, eastern wallaroo, cassowary, emu and Swamp wallaby, red kangoroo. They also have the rare Cuban hutia in a pretty good enclosure, in the Africa exhibit they keep white fronted lemur ring tailed lemur, lesser hedgehog tenrec, Madagascar giant jumping rat. Then they keep also in the upper part of the zoo Javan rusas. Then in the lower part malagasy sacred Ibis, Sumatran tiger (even though not in the best enclosure), Palawan leopard cat, even more lemurs black and white belted white ruffed lemur, 3 giant tortoise species: 2 galapagos species and aldabra. And then in the Ramos house kea, Black-chinned Fruit-dove, Spotted Imperial Pigeon, Blue-naped Parrot, Pesquet’s Parrot, King Bird-of-Paradise, Raggiana Bird-of-Paradise, Cinnamon Ground Dove, Palm Cockatoo, Helmeted Friarbird, Salvadori’s Fig-parrot, New Guinea Bronzewing, Green-naped Pheasant-pigeon, Pink-necked Green-pigeon
Sunda Teal, Western Crowned-pigeon, Superb Fruit-dove. Then an darwin crater with eastern great kangoroos, Bennett wallabies, Common Bronzewing, Tawny Frogmouth, Budgerigar, Red-tailed Black Cockatoo, Wonga Pigeon, Golden-shouldered Parrot, Australian Shelduck, Hardhead, Little Pied Cormorant, Blue-winged Kookaburra, Straw-necked Ibis, Rufous Night-heron, Tasmanian devil, Tasmanian wombat, long nosed potoroo, new Guinea short beaked echidna, and the pheasantry contains even more island birds some of which prague also had very successfull breeding results. And I didn't even list reptiles
 
Of course, Prague's collection in this category—and really in many other categories as well—is on an absolutely top-tier level. Personally, I consider the Darwin Crater a true highlight. In my opinion, Zagreb has very little to offer at a comparable level.

What still holds me back from giving Prague a full 5-0, however, is that some of its enclosures—particularly in the Indonesian Jungle—are quite weak or subpar, especially those for primates and orangutans. So that does cost Prague a point.
 
Of course, Prague's collection in this category—and really in many other categories as well—is on an absolutely top-tier level. Personally, I consider the Darwin Crater a true highlight. In my opinion, Zagreb has very little to offer at a comparable level.

What still holds me back from giving Prague a full 5-0, however, is that some of its enclosures—particularly in the Indonesian Jungle—are quite weak or subpar, especially those for primates and orangutans. So that does cost Prague a point.

I agree with you. Those Prague weak points are also the reason for me to not vote 5:0. Prague is one of the strongest contenders in this ZooChat Cup format, because they have very diverse and broad collection. But they also been relatively lucky with the draw, facing three East European and one Scandinavian zoo. Belgium duo was one of the most dangerous opponents, but than Prague pick Ungulates against them. It's going to be very intresting to watch, when they face another European Giant :)
 
I'm leaning towards a 5/0 to Prague with this one - the collection is incredibly strong and the breeding of Chinese pangolin is probably worth the win in and of itself.

However, I agree with @Haasje and @twilighter that the orangutan enclosure is weak, which also convinces me give it a slightly qualified victory.
 
Can anyone summarize what Zagreb has to offer?

I intend to come up with a summary once I finish work :) as noted I feel the collection definitely doesn't merit more than one point in this regard, given how strong Prague is here... but equally it definitely does merit that one point.
 
Assuming from the fact that people include the pangolins that all of the islands Indonesia, the Philippines, Taiwan and others count for this category, as opposed to Asia? Running with that assumption, here is a photographic overview of Prague's offerings in this category, having visited myself and being very fond of the place.

full

@MagpieGoose - the first room in the Indonesian Jungle which contains several, very large and nicely designed paludariums. On my visit, 13 species of fish and 7 species of turtle were signed, and although not all are actually island taxa, the bulk are.

full

@Kalaw - half of the Komodo Dragon enclosure, very large but a little sparse. Prague's extensive breeding record with the species has already been discussed upthread. Several more are kept behind-the-scenes and two brothers live in a somewhat undersized display in the Giant Tortoise Pavilion.

full

@Kalaw - all-indoor Sunda Pig-tailed Macaque enclosure. Quite spacious and enriching, with some large fish and turtles inhabiting the moat.

Frustratingly, no photos on the gallery depict what is one of the largest Binturong enclosures I have ever seen, with a wonderful array of climbing structures, shared with Asian Short-clawed Otters.

full

@Kalaw - the Spotted Green Pufferfish pool, Prague's best hidden gem, in my opinion; a large and well-landscaped mangrove pool hidden against the boardwalk with a very interesting small species.

full

@Kalaw - the Sunda Slow Loris enclosure; most likely the only representatives of their species in European zoos. The light is off for most of the day, but this image was taken in the first hour.

Both Northern and Southern Luzon Giant Cloud Rats, the latter a major rarity, share a similar-sized enclosure nearby, but there are no photos of it in diurnal lighting. There are also New Guinea Ground Cuscus and Sugar Glider in similar enclosures. But the highlight of the nocturnal corridor in terms of both species and exhibitry is certainly the Formosan Pangolins! Three, interconnected onshow enclosures, all large and with natural substrate, a series of offshow ones, and seven, glass-fronted dens for sheltering. Of course, with Šiška and Connie, Prague is the only European zoo to have bred pangolins, and has done so twice! Strangely, there are no photos of their enclosure.

full

@vogelcommando - outdoor Sumatran Orangutan enclosure.

full

@Robaque - indoor Sumatran Orangutan enclosure. Overall, a somewhat mediocre enclosure, in all fairness, but I wouldn't call it poor by any stretch of the imagination (although I know some who would).

full

@Eagle - the Parrot Trail, a series of sizable and nicely done aviaries for a really interesting selection of category-relevant small parrots, such as Purple-naped Lory, Large Fig-parrot or Mindanao Lorikeet to name just a few. The finale is a walkthrough with Australian birds, of which Scaly-breasted Lorikeets, held in large numbers, and Bush Thick-knee are probably the most interesting. The whole area is enhanced by the outstanding views of the lower half of the zoo, the River Vltava, and the distant city centre to the left.

Eastern Wallaroo, a major rarity, have an excellent, grassy enclosure nearby which is not depicted in the gallery.

full

@Robaque - one of two Southern Cassowary enclosures, both perhaps just a little undersized, but quite nice and with an onshow indoor area in between.

full

@Robaque - a portion of the nice, but quite average, Swamp Wallaby enclosure. Common Emus and Red Kangaroos have near-identical ones next door. Yet again, as you can just about tell, the cliff has been taken full advantage of and the result is some great views.

Sadly there are no photographs, but one of the strangest-looking birds at the zoo, and a rarity, the Oriental Bay-owl, is kept in a decent aviary within 'Northern Forest.'

full

@Kalaw - the Stork Walkthrough Aviary, another hidden gem in my opinion, that contains several relevant species such as Rufous Night-heron and Spot-billed Pelican. The birds are in large abundance which offers great joy searching for them amongst the trees, but it is big enough so as to never feel overstocked. The mature weeping willows in the centre are a particular highlight.

full

@Maguari - outdoor Sumatran Tiger enclosure, very good in my opinion (often hear it criticised but can't understand why). This is quite an old photo - of course it looks very different when the moat isn't drained. The indoors is very unattractive, but I believe it is just about good enough for the animals.

full

@FunkyGibbon - the Palawan Leopard Cat enclosure in the Feline and Reptile Pavilion. The only enclosure in this category which I would consider genuinely poor, being somewhat on the small side and all-indoors.

full

@Kalaw - the Fishing Cat enclosure, which I think is another hidden gem. Large, well-planted, a fair amount of climbing and a deep pool. The indoors is a little unattractive, but it sufficient.

full

@JigerofLemuria - the centrepiece of the Pavilion. To quote how I described it in the previous thread: "a very interesting hall within the Feline and Reptile Pavilion, which houses breeding groups of Cuban Ground Iguanas and Green Iguanas in different subsections, one of which mixed with North Antillean Sliders, whilst House Finches, Ruddy Doves and Cuban Grassquits free-fly between the lot of them."

Nearby is a very good Black-and-white Ruffed Lemur enclosure that proved particularly lively on my visit, but is sadly not represented by any photographs in the gallery.

full

@vogelcommando - outdoor enclosure for Aldabra Giant Tortoise and two (pure, I believe) subspecies of Galápagos.

full

@vogelcommando - the indoor enclosure for the giant tortoises.

full

@lintworm - showing roughly half of the Kea aviary in the Rakos' Pavilion, probably the largest I have seen for the species.

full

@lintworm - the Philippine aviary in the Rakos' Pavilion, a wire-fronted delight housing Blue-naped Parrot, Spotted Imperial Pigeon and White-naped Fruit-dove.

(to be continued in next post due to 20 image limit)
 
full

@lintworm - the highland New Guinea aviary in Rakos', which houses both Raggiana and King Birds-of-paradise in an eye-catching mix with Pesquet's Parrots.

full

@lintworm - the centrepiece of Rakos' is the highland New Guinea wlkthrough, which offers multi-level viewing for visitors, some very eye-catching foliage and several densely vegetated or raised portions placed at angles that offer the animals many retreats. Rarities include the only Helmeted Friarbird in Europe and Salvadori's Fig-parrot, while visually the biggest spectacle is seeing a huge Palm Cockatoo enabled flight of the entire hall.

There is also a decent Jamaican aviary, not really pictured in the gallery. The Rakos' Pavilion is a major asset for Prague in this category with countless rarities in really well-done aviaries that, other than Wattled Jacanas in the Jamaican, rarely ever waver from their narrow geographical themes.

full

@vogelcommando - a standard-sized, but impressively steep walkthrough for Eastern Grey Kangaroos and Bennett's Wallaby in Darwin Crater.

full

@lintworm - a really attractive aviary for 'bush birds' in Darwin Crater. No major rarities, but the Common Bronzewing are very interesting.

full

@vogelcommando - also in Darwin Crater, this time for 'wetlands birds' and at least partially open-fronted. A huge flock of Little Pied Cormorants, held at just three European collections, steal the show and bring much life to the aviary, but equally delightful are the Rufous Night-herons.

full

@Kalaw - just half of what is surely one of the finest Tasmanian Devil enclosures out there.

full

@lintworm - indoors for the Tasmanian Devils, also very nice.

full

@lintworm - another outstanding enclosure, this time for Tasmania Wombat, one of two outdoor spaces.

full

@HOMIN96 - Common Death Adder vivarium within Darwin Crater. Rough-scaled Python have a similar one nearby.

full

@lintworm - Short-beaked Echidna and Long-nosed Potoroo enclosure, reasonably large and with deep soil substrate which I believe the echidna tends to bury itself among, and is thus quite hard to see.

full

@vogelcommando - an example of aviaries in the very extensive Pheasantry zone of the zoo, which is predominantly Southeast Asian species. While I do find the aviaries a little undersized for the hornbills, for the smaller birds, such as laughingthrushes and pheasants, they are very nice, and maintain the charm and authenticity of old rows of aviaries. Some really rare species are held here, such as Coleto, Javan Green Magpie, Philippine Metallic Pigeon, Salvadori's Pheasant and the only Sunda Laughingthrush in Europe to name just a few.

full

@Robaque - for me, Chambal, or the Gharial Pavilion, is one of Prague's very best offerings. While the Indian Gharials themselves do not count, the Northern Batagurs with whom they share surely do. Huge, Critically Endangered terrapins, only recognised as a species in the past couple of decades, can be witnessed in large numbers swimming amongst the crocodilians in this huge pool.

This is by no means a comprehensive overview! I failed to mention some of the Madagascan species in Africa Up Close, some of the inhabitants of the Indonesian Jungle, and the bulk of the rather extensive relevant reptile collection, along with a myriad of other smaller displays. However, I have shown the majority of the zoo's offerings here, and it is quite impressive how much Prague in this category.

When I reminisce on my visit, my two most treasured memories are my first pangolin and my first bird-of-paradise. Other memories that spring to mind include observing a night-heron 'fishing' in Darwin Crater, watching the batagurs chase the Gharials in Chambal, and the delightful Parrot Trail and nearby Australian paddocks with their cliffside views. I also loved the lively lemur island, the bay-owls, the countless avian rarities in Rakos' and the Pheasantry, and the excellent Tasmanian Devil and wombat enclosures. Prague does have some weaknesses here, but for me only the all-indoor leopard cat enclosure and the hornbill aviaries are truly poor - I never found the orangutan and tiger enclosures to be by any means 'bad' as others seem to find, although of course they are not great either. Then there is the geographically accurate mixes, the breeding success with pangolins, the endless list of rarities and the use of authentic plants rather than native lookalikes to evoke the ecosystem in question far better than some other zoos tend to.

I could revert to 4-1 if a persuasive argument is put forth for Zagreb, but for me, so many of Prague's absolute best offerings lie in this category. So for now, 5-0 Prague.
 
full

@lintworm - the highland New Guinea aviary in Rakos', which houses both Raggiana and King Birds-of-paradise in an eye-catching mix with Pesquet's Parrots.

full

@lintworm - the centrepiece of Rakos' is the highland New Guinea wlkthrough, which offers multi-level viewing for visitors, some very eye-catching foliage and several densely vegetated or raised portions placed at angles that offer the animals many retreats. Rarities include the only Helmeted Friarbird in Europe and Salvadori's Fig-parrot, while visually the biggest spectacle is seeing a huge Palm Cockatoo enabled flight of the entire hall.

There is also a decent Jamaican aviary, not really pictured in the gallery. The Rakos' Pavilion is a major asset for Prague in this category with countless rarities in really well-done aviaries that, other than Wattled Jacanas in the Jamaican, rarely ever waver from their narrow geographical themes.

full

@vogelcommando - a standard-sized, but impressively steep walkthrough for Eastern Grey Kangaroos and Bennett's Wallaby in Darwin Crater.

full

@lintworm - a really attractive aviary for 'bush birds' in Darwin Crater. No major rarities, but the Common Bronzewing are very interesting.

full

@vogelcommando - also in Darwin Crater, this time for 'wetlands birds' and at least partially open-fronted. A huge flock of Little Pied Cormorants, held at just three European collections, steal the show and bring much life to the aviary, but equally delightful are the Rufous Night-herons.

full

@Kalaw - just half of what is surely one of the finest Tasmanian Devil enclosures out there.

full

@lintworm - indoors for the Tasmanian Devils, also very nice.

full

@lintworm - another outstanding enclosure, this time for Tasmania Wombat, one of two outdoor spaces.

full

@HOMIN96 - Common Death Adder vivarium within Darwin Crater. Rough-scaled Python have a similar one nearby.

full

@lintworm - Short-beaked Echidna and Long-nosed Potoroo enclosure, reasonably large and with deep soil substrate which I believe the echidna tends to bury itself among, and is thus quite hard to see.

full

@vogelcommando - an example of aviaries in the very extensive Pheasantry zone of the zoo, which is predominantly Southeast Asian species. While I do find the aviaries a little undersized for the hornbills, for the smaller birds, such as laughingthrushes and pheasants, they are very nice, and maintain the charm and authenticity of old rows of aviaries. Some really rare species are held here, such as Coleto, Javan Green Magpie, Philippine Metallic Pigeon, Salvadori's Pheasant and the only Sunda Laughingthrush in Europe to name just a few.

full

@Robaque - for me, Chambal, or the Gharial Pavilion, is one of Prague's very best offerings. While the Indian Gharials themselves do not count, the Northern Batagurs with whom they share surely do. Huge, Critically Endangered terrapins, only recognised as a species in the past couple of decades, can be witnessed in large numbers swimming amongst the crocodilians in this huge pool.

This is by no means a comprehensive overview! I failed to mention some of the Madagascan species in Africa Up Close, some of the inhabitants of the Indonesian Jungle, and the bulk of the rather extensive relevant reptile collection, along with a myriad of other smaller displays. However, I have shown the majority of the zoo's offerings here, and it is quite impressive how much Prague in this category.

When I reminisce on my visit, my two most treasured memories are my first pangolin and my first bird-of-paradise. Other memories that spring to mind include observing a night-heron 'fishing' in Darwin Crater, watching the batagurs chase the Gharials in Chambal, and the delightful Parrot Trail and nearby Australian paddocks with their cliffside views. I also loved the lively lemur island, the bay-owls, the countless avian rarities in Rakos' and the Pheasantry, and the excellent Tasmanian Devil and wombat enclosures. Prague does have some weaknesses here, but for me only the all-indoor leopard cat enclosure and the hornbill aviaries are truly poor - I never found the orangutan and tiger enclosures to be by any means 'bad' as others seem to find, although of course they are not great either. Then there is the geographically accurate mixes, the breeding success with pangolins, the endless list of rarities and the use of authentic plants rather than native lookalikes to evoke the ecosystem in question far better than some other zoos tend to.

I could revert to 4-1 if a persuasive argument is put forth for Zagreb, but for me, so many of Prague's absolute best offerings lie in this category. So for now, 5-0 Prague.
A good argument for 5-0 , I think someone needs to make an argument for Zagreb to be justified a point!!
 
the Palawan Leopard Cat enclosure in the Feline and Reptile Pavilion. The only enclosure in this category which I would consider genuinely poor, being somewhat on the small side and all-indoors.

How big of an enclosure would you consider enough for one single Leopard cat? Because Prague's is single handedly the biggest they got anywhere...

the Fishing Cat enclosure, which I think is another hidden gem. Large, well-planted, a fair amount of climbing and a deep pool. The indoors is a little unattractive, but it sufficient.

Also, I am sorry but you just can't call Fishing cat's indoors sufficent while simultaneously calling Palawan's poor...
 
full

@lintworm - the highland New Guinea aviary in Rakos', which houses both Raggiana and King Birds-of-paradise in an eye-catching mix with Pesquet's Parrots.

full

@lintworm - the centrepiece of Rakos' is the highland New Guinea wlkthrough, which offers multi-level viewing for visitors, some very eye-catching foliage and several densely vegetated or raised portions placed at angles that offer the animals many retreats. Rarities include the only Helmeted Friarbird in Europe and Salvadori's Fig-parrot, while visually the biggest spectacle is seeing a huge Palm Cockatoo enabled flight of the entire hall.

There is also a decent Jamaican aviary, not really pictured in the gallery. The Rakos' Pavilion is a major asset for Prague in this category with countless rarities in really well-done aviaries that, other than Wattled Jacanas in the Jamaican, rarely ever waver from their narrow geographical themes.

full

@vogelcommando - a standard-sized, but impressively steep walkthrough for Eastern Grey Kangaroos and Bennett's Wallaby in Darwin Crater.

full

@lintworm - a really attractive aviary for 'bush birds' in Darwin Crater. No major rarities, but the Common Bronzewing are very interesting.

full

@vogelcommando - also in Darwin Crater, this time for 'wetlands birds' and at least partially open-fronted. A huge flock of Little Pied Cormorants, held at just three European collections, steal the show and bring much life to the aviary, but equally delightful are the Rufous Night-herons.

full

@Kalaw - just half of what is surely one of the finest Tasmanian Devil enclosures out there.

full

@lintworm - indoors for the Tasmanian Devils, also very nice.

full

@lintworm - another outstanding enclosure, this time for Tasmania Wombat, one of two outdoor spaces.

full

@HOMIN96 - Common Death Adder vivarium within Darwin Crater. Rough-scaled Python have a similar one nearby.

full

@lintworm - Short-beaked Echidna and Long-nosed Potoroo enclosure, reasonably large and with deep soil substrate which I believe the echidna tends to bury itself among, and is thus quite hard to see.

full

@vogelcommando - an example of aviaries in the very extensive Pheasantry zone of the zoo, which is predominantly Southeast Asian species. While I do find the aviaries a little undersized for the hornbills, for the smaller birds, such as laughingthrushes and pheasants, they are very nice, and maintain the charm and authenticity of old rows of aviaries. Some really rare species are held here, such as Coleto, Javan Green Magpie, Philippine Metallic Pigeon, Salvadori's Pheasant and the only Sunda Laughingthrush in Europe to name just a few.

full

@Robaque - for me, Chambal, or the Gharial Pavilion, is one of Prague's very best offerings. While the Indian Gharials themselves do not count, the Northern Batagurs with whom they share surely do. Huge, Critically Endangered terrapins, only recognised as a species in the past couple of decades, can be witnessed in large numbers swimming amongst the crocodilians in this huge pool.

This is by no means a comprehensive overview! I failed to mention some of the Madagascan species in Africa Up Close, some of the inhabitants of the Indonesian Jungle, and the bulk of the rather extensive relevant reptile collection, along with a myriad of other smaller displays. However, I have shown the majority of the zoo's offerings here, and it is quite impressive how much Prague in this category.

When I reminisce on my visit, my two most treasured memories are my first pangolin and my first bird-of-paradise. Other memories that spring to mind include observing a night-heron 'fishing' in Darwin Crater, watching the batagurs chase the Gharials in Chambal, and the delightful Parrot Trail and nearby Australian paddocks with their cliffside views. I also loved the lively lemur island, the bay-owls, the countless avian rarities in Rakos' and the Pheasantry, and the excellent Tasmanian Devil and wombat enclosures. Prague does have some weaknesses here, but for me only the all-indoor leopard cat enclosure and the hornbill aviaries are truly poor - I never found the orangutan and tiger enclosures to be by any means 'bad' as others seem to find, although of course they are not great either. Then there is the geographically accurate mixes, the breeding success with pangolins, the endless list of rarities and the use of authentic plants rather than native lookalikes to evoke the ecosystem in question far better than some other zoos tend to.

I could revert to 4-1 if a persuasive argument is put forth for Zagreb, but for me, so many of Prague's absolute best offerings lie in this category. So for now, 5-0 Prague.

I think you are a bit too generous on Prague's behalf. While many enclosures are nicely designed, even the newest ones tend to be on the smaller side. This is especially true for the Rakos pavillion, which in terms of looks and education is fantastic, but all aviaries could (or should) have been bigger. But a similar argument could be made for many of the Australian enclosures.

I am also not a fan of the Indonesian Jungle house, apart from the pangolins it is probably the area in Prague I dislike most together with the polar bear enclosure. The orangutan enclosure really is pretty bad in my opinion and the macaque one is too, full of concrete and devoid of any natural substrate. If it weren't modelled like trees, but just grey bare concrete, people would think it is awful...

The hornbill aviaries in the pheasantry are also weak, there are surprisingly few photographs, the best one I could find is this one and I am quite sure the rufous hornbill are currently in a smaller aviary than this.:
full

@LaughingDove

Prague has quite an amazing collection for this category with their strong specialization on SE Asian animals in particular. But unless Zagreb is really poor, I don't think the average enclosure standards in Prague warrant a 5-0.
 
How big of an enclosure would you consider enough for one single Leopard cat? Because Prague's is single handedly the biggest they got anywhere...

Also, I am sorry but you just can't call Fishing cat's indoors sufficent while simultaneously calling Palawan's poor...
Biggest they have anywhere? It isn’t even the biggest at Prague zoo as the Amurs have a larger one than the Palawan (same sized indoor space but no outdoor access, if memory serves). Not sure what you meant by this. Don’t really get your other comment either, perhaps you misinterpreted what I was saying? I get that the Fishing Cats and Palawan Leopard Cat indoor spaces are roughly the same size, but the difference is that for the latter that encompasses all the space they have, whereas the former have a large outdoor cage as well. There is a big difference. If the Palawan had outdoor space then, as you say, the enclosures would be on par as they are near identical indoors but they don’t, and therefore as it stands I find the whole space for the cats to be a little restricted. Am I missing something (an offshow outdoor area, for instance), because I don’t think criticising the Palawan enclosure and praising the Fishing Cats enclosure is inconsistent with itself whatsoever?
I think you are a bit too generous on Prague's behalf. While many enclosures are nicely designed, even the newest ones tend to be on the smaller side. This is especially true for the Rakos pavillion, which in terms of looks and education is fantastic, but all aviaries could (or should) have been bigger. But a similar argument could be made for many of the Australian enclosures.

I am also not a fan of the Indonesian Jungle house, apart from the pangolins it is probably the area in Prague I dislike most together with the polar bear enclosure. The orangutan enclosure really is pretty bad in my opinion and the macaque one is too, full of concrete and devoid of any natural substrate. If it weren't modelled like trees, but just grey bare concrete, people would think it is awful...

The hornbill aviaries in the pheasantry are also weak, there are surprisingly few photographs, the best one I could find is this one and I am quite sure the rufous hornbill are currently in a smaller aviary than this.:
full

@LaughingDove

Prague has quite an amazing collection for this category with their strong specialization on SE Asian animals in particular. But unless Zagreb is really poor, I don't think the average enclosure standards in Prague warrant a 5-0.
I mentioned the hornbill aviaries as a weakness in my overview (and attached the same photo as you did, incidentally). Fully agree with you that they are weak - in the past I have said that they are probably the worst enclosures at the zoo asides from the Polar Bears, and I stand by that statement, although I did find the Pheasantry aviaries were big enough for some of the smaller birds.

Although I admit it is fairly mediocre, I have always struggled to see how the orangutan enclosure is truly bad. Not disputing that it is, as I don’t know much about the notoriously complex husbandry of orangutans, but am genuinely curious to hear from you, or anyone else, about why it is supposedly so poor? Separation options a bit limited, but there seems to be a decent amount of space and climbing opportunity both indoors and outdoors.

Personally, none of the Rakos’ aviaries struck me as particularly undersized, but perhaps I am enlarging them in my memory. They of course could be bigger, but it never struck me as urgent by any means.
 
Assuming from the fact that people include the pangolins that all of the islands Indonesia, the Philippines, Taiwan and others count for this category, as opposed to Asia? Running with that assumption, here is a photographic overview of Prague's offerings in this category, having visited myself and being very fond of the place.

full

@MagpieGoose - the first room in the Indonesian Jungle which contains several, very large and nicely designed paludariums. On my visit, 13 species of fish and 7 species of turtle were signed, and although not all are actually island taxa, the bulk are.

full

@Kalaw - half of the Komodo Dragon enclosure, very large but a little sparse. Prague's extensive breeding record with the species has already been discussed upthread. Several more are kept behind-the-scenes and two brothers live in a somewhat undersized display in the Giant Tortoise Pavilion.

full

@Kalaw - all-indoor Sunda Pig-tailed Macaque enclosure. Quite spacious and enriching, with some large fish and turtles inhabiting the moat.

Frustratingly, no photos on the gallery depict what is one of the largest Binturong enclosures I have ever seen, with a wonderful array of climbing structures, shared with Asian Short-clawed Otters.

full

@Kalaw - the Spotted Green Pufferfish pool, Prague's best hidden gem, in my opinion; a large and well-landscaped mangrove pool hidden against the boardwalk with a very interesting small species.

full

@Kalaw - the Sunda Slow Loris enclosure; most likely the only representatives of their species in European zoos. The light is off for most of the day, but this image was taken in the first hour.

Both Northern and Southern Luzon Giant Cloud Rats, the latter a major rarity, share a similar-sized enclosure nearby, but there are no photos of it in diurnal lighting. There are also New Guinea Ground Cuscus and Sugar Glider in similar enclosures. But the highlight of the nocturnal corridor in terms of both species and exhibitry is certainly the Formosan Pangolins! Three, interconnected onshow enclosures, all large and with natural substrate, a series of offshow ones, and seven, glass-fronted dens for sheltering. Of course, with Šiška and Connie, Prague is the only European zoo to have bred pangolins, and has done so twice! Strangely, there are no photos of their enclosure.

full

@vogelcommando - outdoor Sumatran Orangutan enclosure.

full

@Robaque - indoor Sumatran Orangutan enclosure. Overall, a somewhat mediocre enclosure, in all fairness, but I wouldn't call it poor by any stretch of the imagination (although I know some who would).

full

@Eagle - the Parrot Trail, a series of sizable and nicely done aviaries for a really interesting selection of category-relevant small parrots, such as Purple-naped Lory, Large Fig-parrot or Mindanao Lorikeet to name just a few. The finale is a walkthrough with Australian birds, of which Scaly-breasted Lorikeets, held in large numbers, and Bush Thick-knee are probably the most interesting. The whole area is enhanced by the outstanding views of the lower half of the zoo, the River Vltava, and the distant city centre to the left.

Eastern Wallaroo, a major rarity, have an excellent, grassy enclosure nearby which is not depicted in the gallery.

full

@Robaque - one of two Southern Cassowary enclosures, both perhaps just a little undersized, but quite nice and with an onshow indoor area in between.

full

@Robaque - a portion of the nice, but quite average, Swamp Wallaby enclosure. Common Emus and Red Kangaroos have near-identical ones next door. Yet again, as you can just about tell, the cliff has been taken full advantage of and the result is some great views.

Sadly there are no photographs, but one of the strangest-looking birds at the zoo, and a rarity, the Oriental Bay-owl, is kept in a decent aviary within 'Northern Forest.'

full

@Kalaw - the Stork Walkthrough Aviary, another hidden gem in my opinion, that contains several relevant species such as Rufous Night-heron and Spot-billed Pelican. The birds are in large abundance which offers great joy searching for them amongst the trees, but it is big enough so as to never feel overstocked. The mature weeping willows in the centre are a particular highlight.

full

@Maguari - outdoor Sumatran Tiger enclosure, very good in my opinion (often hear it criticised but can't understand why). This is quite an old photo - of course it looks very different when the moat isn't drained. The indoors is very unattractive, but I believe it is just about good enough for the animals.

full

@FunkyGibbon - the Palawan Leopard Cat enclosure in the Feline and Reptile Pavilion. The only enclosure in this category which I would consider genuinely poor, being somewhat on the small side and all-indoors.

full

@Kalaw - the Fishing Cat enclosure, which I think is another hidden gem. Large, well-planted, a fair amount of climbing and a deep pool. The indoors is a little unattractive, but it sufficient.

full

@JigerofLemuria - the centrepiece of the Pavilion. To quote how I described it in the previous thread: "a very interesting hall within the Feline and Reptile Pavilion, which houses breeding groups of Cuban Ground Iguanas and Green Iguanas in different subsections, one of which mixed with North Antillean Sliders, whilst House Finches, Ruddy Doves and Cuban Grassquits free-fly between the lot of them."

Nearby is a very good Black-and-white Ruffed Lemur enclosure that proved particularly lively on my visit, but is sadly not represented by any photographs in the gallery.

full

@vogelcommando - outdoor enclosure for Aldabra Giant Tortoise and two (pure, I believe) subspecies of Galápagos.

full

@vogelcommando - the indoor enclosure for the giant tortoises.

full

@lintworm - showing roughly half of the Kea aviary in the Rakos' Pavilion, probably the largest I have seen for the species.

full

@lintworm - the Philippine aviary in the Rakos' Pavilion, a wire-fronted delight housing Blue-naped Parrot, Spotted Imperial Pigeon and White-naped Fruit-dove.

(to be continued in next post due to 20 image limit)


I will try to help with some of the missing views that you described:

I believe the Palawan Binturong share exhibit with Smooth-coated Otter, not with ASCO

20220703_124912.jpg

Black and White Rufus Lemur
20220913_103904.jpg

Pangolin exhibit

20220703_095339.jpg

20220703_095419.jpg 20220703_095847.jpg 20220703_164412.jpg

Ring-tailed Lemur Walkthrough exhibit
20220703_125533.jpg


Australian Birds Walkthrough Aviary with the View
20220909_175339.jpg 20220909_180040.jpg

Wooly-necked Stork
20220703_114342.jpg
 

Attachments

  • 20220703_124912.jpg
    20220703_124912.jpg
    324.5 KB · Views: 41
  • 20220913_103904.jpg
    20220913_103904.jpg
    265 KB · Views: 39
  • 20220703_095339.jpg
    20220703_095339.jpg
    156.5 KB · Views: 102
  • 20220703_095419.jpg
    20220703_095419.jpg
    155.6 KB · Views: 70
  • 20220703_095847.jpg
    20220703_095847.jpg
    194.9 KB · Views: 68
  • 20220703_164412.jpg
    20220703_164412.jpg
    182.9 KB · Views: 40
  • 20220703_125533.jpg
    20220703_125533.jpg
    372.4 KB · Views: 39
  • 20220909_175339.jpg
    20220909_175339.jpg
    204.7 KB · Views: 41
  • 20220909_180040.jpg
    20220909_180040.jpg
    180.6 KB · Views: 41
  • 20220703_114342.jpg
    20220703_114342.jpg
    273.2 KB · Views: 41
Biggest they have anywhere? It isn’t even the biggest at Prague zoo as the Amurs have a larger one than the Palawan (same sized indoor space but no outdoor access, if memory serves). Not sure what you meant by this.

I suspect that he means that the Prague exhibit is the largest for the species in question; it's worth recalling that the Amur Leopard Cat is a) twice the size of the Palawan and b) a completely different species, being P. bengalensis rather than P. javanicus.

I get that the Fishing Cats and Palawan Leopard Cat indoor spaces are roughly the same size, but the difference is that for the latter that encompasses all the space they have, whereas the former have a large outdoor cage as well. There is a big difference. If the Palawan had outdoor space then, as you say, the enclosures would be on par as they are near identical indoors but they don’t, and therefore as it stands I find the whole space for the cats to be a little restricted. Am I missing something (an offshow outdoor area, for instance), because I don’t think criticising the Palawan enclosure and praising the Fishing Cats enclosure is inconsistent with itself whatsoever?

The other key factor you are missing is (again) that the two species you are comparing are completely different sizes :rolleyes::p if an indoor exhibit is "unattractive but sufficent" for the species which reaches weights of up to 17kg it is hardly fair to say that a similar exhibit is "genuinely poor" for the species which doesn't even hit 4kg.... especially when you consider the fact that (from memory) the Palawan exhibit contains rather more height and climbing opportunities than does the Fishing.

As a side-note, the corollary to this point is that if the Palawan had outdoor space the enclosures still wouldn't be comparable, as they would then undeniably have far more relative space than would the Fishing Cats.

@Robaque - for me, Chambal, or the Gharial Pavilion, is one of Prague's very best offerings. While the Indian Gharials themselves do not count, the Northern Batagurs with whom they share surely do. Huge, Critically Endangered terrapins, only recognised as a species in the past couple of decades, can be witnessed in large numbers swimming amongst the crocodilians in this huge pool.

The Northern Batagur (and hence the Chambal) does not count for the challenge, as it does not extend beyond Peninsular Malaysia and is believed extinct even from there.

upload_2025-2-7_22-51-10.png
 

Attachments

  • upload_2025-2-7_22-51-10.png
    upload_2025-2-7_22-51-10.png
    426.6 KB · Views: 39
Don't have many photographs from Zagreb available, as I don't have my external hard drive containing photos from my 2022 and 2024 visits to hand, but here goes with my summary of a few aspects which help to earn the collection a single point due to exhibit quality and species displayed:

Madagascar House

Per my notes, the category species displayed in and around this area are as follows:

  • Madagascar turtle-dove (Nesoenas picturatus picturatus)
  • Madagascar lovebird (Agapornis canus)
  • Radiated tortoise (Astrochelys radiata)
  • Greater Vasa (Coracopsis vasa)
  • Madagascar Partridge (Margaroperdix madagarensis)
  • Madagascar Fody (Foudia madagascariensis)
  • Ring-tailed Lemur (Lemur catta)
  • Black-and-White Ruffed Lemur (Varecia variegata)
@twilighter provided decent images of this area in the quoted post below:

Madagascar House with indoor and outdoor exhibits of Lemurs and indoor exhibits of Birds, like Vasa Parrot

20221217_105355-jpg.768068


20221217_105419-jpg.768069


20221217_105439-jpg.768070


Lemur Island
20221217_093809-jpg.768071

Tropical House

A fairly substantial number of the species held within this large and (as previously discussed in an earlier match) rather good exhibit complex are category-relevant; using ZTL and my own notes, the following are currently on-display:

  • Bavay's Giant Gecko (Mniarogekko chahoua)
  • Blue Tree Monitor (Varanus macraei)
  • Borneo Earless Monitor (Lanthanotus borneensis)
  • Gold-dust Day Gecko (Phelsuma laticauda)
  • Sri Lankan Pitviper (Craspedocephalus trigonocephalus)
  • Cuban Crocodile (Crocodylus rhombifer)
  • Cuban Iguana (Cyclura nubila nubila)
  • Fiji Short-crested Iguana (Brachylophus bulabula)
  • Gray's Monitor (Varanus olivaceus)
  • Green Tree Monitor (Varanus prasinus)
  • Green Tree Python (Morelia viridis)
  • Komodo Dragon (Varanus komodoensis)
  • Macklot's Python (Liasis mackloti)
  • Mindanao Water Monitor (Varanus cumingi)
  • Negros Water Monitor (Varanus nuchalis)
  • New Caledonia Bumpy Gecko (Rhacodactylus auriculatus)
  • Philippine Crocodile (Crocodylus mindorensis)
  • Philippine Sailfin Lizard (Hydrosaurus pustulatus)
  • Prehensile-tailed Skink (Corucia zebrata)
  • Sunda King Cobra (Ophiophagus bungarus)
  • Sumatran Python (Python curtus)
  • Wetar Island Tree Viper (Trimeresurus insularis)
Not as extensive or flashy as the Prague collection, but certainly pretty choice I reckon. The following are example photographs of exhibits and a general view of the house:

King Cobra

P1140253.JPG

Gray's Monitor

P1140307.JPG


General view

full



---

Australia Exhibit

I can't find any recent photographs of this exhibit in the gallery, or on the laptop I'm currently posting from - but from memory it is a decent-sized mixed exhibit for wallabies, emu and black swan. Any assistance here would be appreciated!
 

Attachments

  • P1140253.JPG
    P1140253.JPG
    230.7 KB · Views: 40
  • P1140307.JPG
    P1140307.JPG
    215.4 KB · Views: 40
Don't have many photographs from Zagreb available, as I don't have my external hard drive containing photos from my 2022 and 2024 visits to hand, but here goes with my summary of a few aspects which help to earn the collection a single point due to exhibit quality and species displayed:

Madagascar House

Per my notes, the category species displayed in and around this area are as follows:

  • Madagascar turtle-dove (Nesoenas picturatus picturatus)
  • Madagascar lovebird (Agapornis canus)
  • Radiated tortoise (Astrochelys radiata)
  • Greater Vasa (Coracopsis vasa)
  • Madagascar Partridge (Margaroperdix madagarensis)
  • Madagascar Fody (Foudia madagascariensis)
  • Ring-tailed Lemur (Lemur catta)
  • Black-and-White Ruffed Lemur (Varecia variegata)
@twilighter provided decent images of this area in the quoted post below:



Tropical House

A fairly substantial number of the species held within this large and (as previously discussed in an earlier match) rather good exhibit complex are category-relevant; using ZTL and my own notes, the following are currently on-display:

  • Bavay's Giant Gecko (Mniarogekko chahoua)
  • Blue Tree Monitor (Varanus macraei)
  • Borneo Earless Monitor (Lanthanotus borneensis)
  • Gold-dust Day Gecko (Phelsuma laticauda)
  • Sri Lankan Pitviper (Craspedocephalus trigonocephalus)
  • Cuban Crocodile (Crocodylus rhombifer)
  • Cuban Iguana (Cyclura nubila nubila)
  • Fiji Short-crested Iguana (Brachylophus bulabula)
  • Gray's Monitor (Varanus olivaceus)
  • Green Tree Monitor (Varanus prasinus)
  • Green Tree Python (Morelia viridis)
  • Komodo Dragon (Varanus komodoensis)
  • Macklot's Python (Liasis mackloti)
  • Mindanao Water Monitor (Varanus cumingi)
  • Negros Water Monitor (Varanus nuchalis)
  • New Caledonia Bumpy Gecko (Rhacodactylus auriculatus)
  • Philippine Crocodile (Crocodylus mindorensis)
  • Philippine Sailfin Lizard (Hydrosaurus pustulatus)
  • Prehensile-tailed Skink (Corucia zebrata)
  • Sunda King Cobra (Ophiophagus bungarus)
  • Sumatran Python (Python curtus)
  • Wetar Island Tree Viper (Trimeresurus insularis)
Not as extensive or flashy as the Prague collection, but certainly pretty choice I reckon. The following are example photographs of exhibits and a general view of the house:

King Cobra

View attachment 769943

Gray's Monitor

View attachment 769944


General view

full



---

Australia Exhibit

I can't find any recent photographs of this exhibit in the gallery, or on the laptop I'm currently posting from - but from memory it is a decent-sized mixed exhibit for wallabies, emu and black swan. Any assistance here would be appreciated!

I will try to assist:

Australian exhibit
20221217_095929.jpg


Asian Small Clawed Otter / Lar Gibbon exhibit

20221217_092618.jpg

Cuban Crocodile / Nile Crocodile exhibit

20221217_093034.jpg

Komodo Dragon
20221217_130151.jpg

Island Birds exhibit - Bali Myna/Javan Sparrow/ Victoria Pigeon / Pied Imperial Pigeon

20221217_101753.jpg

Malagasy Giant Rat / Moholi Galago exhibit
20221217_101909.jpg

Brush-tailed Bettong / Night Monkey exhibit
20221217_102124.jpg

Northern Luzon Giant Cloud Rat
20221217_102746.jpg
 

Attachments

  • 20221217_095929.jpg
    20221217_095929.jpg
    316.2 KB · Views: 38
  • 20221217_092618.jpg
    20221217_092618.jpg
    300.2 KB · Views: 39
  • 20221217_093034.jpg
    20221217_093034.jpg
    206.6 KB · Views: 41
  • 20221217_130151.jpg
    20221217_130151.jpg
    258.5 KB · Views: 38
  • 20221217_101753.jpg
    20221217_101753.jpg
    239.4 KB · Views: 40
  • 20221217_101909.jpg
    20221217_101909.jpg
    134.2 KB · Views: 38
  • 20221217_102124.jpg
    20221217_102124.jpg
    278.2 KB · Views: 40
  • 20221217_102746.jpg
    20221217_102746.jpg
    146.2 KB · Views: 41
Back
Top