ZSL Whipsnade Zoo Indian Rhinos at Whipsnade.

it is good news, given the relatively low number of sires in north american zoos due to some males being extra aggressive...
on other rhino news WPZ in Dubbo is preserving the eggs of two non-reproductive black rhino females who were wild caught in Zimbabwe but still havent reproduced, following unsuccesful AI attempts.
Dora the indian rhino has had a few other problems. whilst at Taronga he developed dermatitis AND his horn got infected because he rubbed it all away, which meant that zoo vets had to put a metal plate in it.
since his transfer to WPZ his skin condition has improved because of the depth of the moat, but it was obviously his feet problems which caused the zoo to re-upgrade the substrate in his enclosure in 2006.
apparently the reason why Kua wasnt transported to WPZ sooner is because the zoo was really trying to get the off-exhibit holding areas established with nice, think turf. then she died.
the whole 'Wild Asian Wetlands' thingy has been an expensive undertaking and one which im sure the zoo wished it never started. if this was a regionally based program the death of Kua would not have been nearly has much of a setback. Secondly, I disagree anyway with Dora originally coming to Australia given that of 110+ animals worldwide there does seem to be a chronic shortage of males. Im unaware of his ancestry but im sure he could have been placed either in Europe or the North American programs and used way more effectively.
And then to bring a female into the region. it would have been wonderful if the outcome had been succesful-Kua transferred to Dubbo before delivering a surprise baby, but at the moment the whole thing seems an expensive waste, and a shining example of why zoos should stick to regional planning principles, if only for fiscal reasons.
anyway, as it is, WPZ has a now pretty exceptional indian rhino exhibit, only that he' never in it....
 
glyn said:
it is good news, given the relatively low number of sires in north american zoos due to some males being extra aggressive...
.
anyway, as it is, WPZ has a now pretty exceptional indian rhino exhibit, only that he' never in it....
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1. cincinnati zoo recently announced they've successfully A.I.'d a female Indian rhino- she is about 10 months into the 16 months pregnancy. Maybe this is already old news? The idea is that AI will in future overcome the problem of 'skewed' representation due to some bulls being extra aggressive(as above)

2. I think the idea of bringing a pair of Indian rhinos to Australia was not fundamentally wrong- it does seem to have been very problematic though.

The majority of problems with this species do seem to be skin related(includes feet and horns too...) IF WPZ can overcome these and acquire another female, I don't see why they can't be as successful with them as USA or Europe. After all, Australia really has a more suitable climate for this species than Europe or Canada does...
 
Indian rhino at WPZ and agressive males

glyn,

I do agree with you that it is rather unfortunate that WPZ does not follow the regional collection policy on rhinos and acquired the Indian rhino in the first place. It is also partially true that perhaps the male Dora would have been of more genetic value in the context of the EEP or SSP Indian rhino programmes. The sire at Nagoya is a Guwahati Zoo bred male from 1971, however the female is from the overrepresented early Basel blood line.

But I am not as black on the sit as you are. I agree with grantsmb that the death of pregnant Kua was rather unfortunate and should not stall the WPZ breeding plans. Now that Dora is at WPZ, I do not see why he should not be allowed to remain here and breed with a suitably sourced female from San Diego WAP before not too long.

San Diego WAP is the obvious choice for a new young female as they hold their breeding bull with quite a number of breeding age females. For example in 2005 3.3 (1.1 died) were born. I am quite sure that San Diego WAP management will view favorably on another female loan out to WPZ.

Thus like the southern black rhino programme at WPZ which is part of the US SSP for the subspecies, could become a regional outpost of the SSP Indian rhino programme.
 
grantsmb said:
1. cincinnati zoo recently announced they've successfully A.I.'d a female Indian rhino- she is about 10 months into the 16 months pregnancy. The idea is that AI will in future overcome the problem of 'skewed' representation due to some bulls being extra aggressive(as above)...
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Whereas I support the idea of AI as a management tool for rhino breeding, I do not wish for it to substitute for natural breeding. I personally suspect the "aggressive" male syndrome is more a behavioral husbandry issue than anything else. All rhino taxa are known for their intraspecific aggression. Their's is a natural dominance-supplantive relationship of species specific territoriality.

I am convinced we have as yet a lot to learn from wild rhino ecology and apply it to the captive environment. Both inapprotiate timing of introduction to the female and insufficient space inside the breeding pen - leaving the female no chance to evade unnecessary harassment - may play a part in terming a bull "overtly aggressive".
 
jelle said:
Whereas I support the idea of AI as a management tool for rhino breeding, I do not wish for it to substitute for natural breeding. I personally suspect the "aggressive" male syndrome is more a behavioral husbandry issue than anything else. All rhino taxa are known for their intraspecific aggression. Their's is a natural dominance-supplantive relationship of species specific territoriality.

I am convinced we have as yet a lot to learn from wild rhino ecology and apply it to the captive environment. Both inapprotiate timing of introduction to the female and insufficient space inside the breeding pen - leaving the female no chance to evade unnecessary harassment - may play a part in terming a bull "overtly aggressive".
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I must say I wholeheartedly agree with this. Having seen this species in the wild and watched film of wild courtship and mating(including long phases of chasing) I've always believed the 'overly aggressive' bulls are a product of the captive environment. Not enough space, lack of rivals etc may lead to more stereotyped(even unnnatural) forms of aggression such as biting females before or during mating.

AI does undoubtedlty have an important function to play, in allowing such 'incompatable' pairings to reproduce, or in avoiding possible stressful translocations of animals from one facility to another. But on the downside, if perfected, natural matings could be in danger of being by-passed altogther.
 
jelle said:
The sire at Nagoya is a Guwahati Zoo bred male from 1971, however the female is from the overrepresented early Basel blood line.

I went to Guwahati Zoo some years ago. They had about nine Indian rhinos that time, not surprising as its the 'State Zoo' of Assam and only about 5hrs drive from Kaziranga Sanctuary. As such, any rhinos from Guwahati are likely to be either sourced from the wild population, or if bred there, only one generation removed. So they would be pretty important to the captive population.
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Guwahati rhino

I do not know the current situation with Indian rhino at Guwahati Zoo, but my data go back to 2005. Guwahati Zoo housed 3 wild born males, all having arrived between 1980-1982 comprising 2 proven breeders plus 2 captive-born males (1987, 1989).

The new breeding group seems to have started up with introduction of a wild born female in 1991 and a captive-born male (b. 1987). Their first calf, a female, was born in 2002.

In the past Guwahati Zoo served as a rescue center for wild rhinos from Assam and Kaziranga. However, the record makes for depressing reading with most rhinos succumbing with several months to 2 years.

Breeding has been surprisingly sparse given despite the fact that several Indian zoos like Delhi, Kanpur and Patna have good track records in breeding rhinos.

However, both San Diego WAP (cb. female) and Nagoya (cb. male) had Guwahati Zoo animals and represented in the captive population.
 
jelle said:
In the past Guwahati Zoo served as a rescue center for wild rhinos from Assam and Kaziranga. However, the record makes for depressing reading with most rhinos succumbing with several months to 2 years.
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Yes, not surprisingly perhaps, as the enclosure(s) at Guwahati Zoo were very run-down looking and depressing with the rhinos just standing in pools of Mud. I also saw them(pair) at Delhi Zoo but that was a considerably better exhibit.
 
Indian zoos: source of unrelated males

India may well be the best place to source some unrelated males. The population is extremely skewed towards males in Indian zoos and some individuals are directly imported from Assam or Kaziranga (and not just Guwahati Zoo).

US zoos have now entered into a coop with the better Indian zoos exhibiting Indian rhinos. Perhaps, the EEP might reciprocate and provide management and husbandry advice in exchange for several unrelated male rhino from Indian zoos!
 
The bad thing about doing exchanges of animals with India is you can be sure the exchanged animals will be going to live in far worse conditions, and will probably have a shortened lifespan in their new home..: (

bUt to balance it out, the animals received fom India will benefit from propably far superior housing and a longer lifespan.:)
 
nono, Zooboy. All I'm saying is that animals in bad INDIAN (or other third world)Zoos are likely to live shorter lives due to much poorer living conditions.

I would rate conditions in Australian, American, English or Westen European Zoos as all being equivalent to each other (given local diffences of course.)
 
And to add to that. I don't have any evidence to say animals FROM those poorer zoos will have shortened lives if moved elsewhere. What I said was, (provided they aren't in too poor condition on arrival)they are likely to then have extended, better lives. The animal that goes from an Indian Zoo to Dubbo is likely to be better off- the animal that goes from Dubbo to an Indian Zoo is likely to be worse off.....;)
 
Yeah, and thinking of Indian rhinos. ALL founder Indian rhinos in zoos in foreign countries have originated from India of course. Several of those were bred in Indian Zoos such as Delhi or Mysore. I have never heard of any case of an Indian Rhino dying, having a shorter life or arriving in very poor condition after coming direct from India- so with this species at least, there seems no problem with a direct importation from India.

Whipsnade's 'Roopa' was born in Delhi Zoo- she's about 35!
 
Guys,

Please check this notion: I wrote "US zoos have now entered into a coop with the better Indian zoos exhibiting Indian rhinos. Perhaps, the EEP might reciprocate and provide management and husbandry advice in exchange for several unrelated male rhino from Indian zoos!".

The argument now seems that conditions are sub standard in Indian zoos and that exchange programmes do not work on an equal level. Indian zoos do evolve thanks to their own regional zoo organisation. Many zoos have adopted new masterplans that will see investment in new more naturalistic habitats for the animals in their care and setting up of proper breeding programmes through the Central Zoo Authority of India.

What I meant to say was that in order to import several unrelated male Indian rhinos from Indian zoos European zoos could provide sound advice regarding animal husbandry and management of wild animals and assisting in building regional breeding programmes for endangered species.

The spirit of international cooperation defines that we should assist each other to make better captive environments for wildlife. Just taking out a valuable species and not giving anything back is not.

Anyway, I would like to set up a new thread regarding Indian zoos in the Asia section and will continue the discussion on the issue there if you all like.
 
jelle said:
Guys,
The argument now seems that conditions are sub standard in Indian zoos and that exchange programmes do not work on an equal level.
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All I was hinting at was that for some species-and not necessarily rhinos- transferring animals to an Indian zoo is likely to shorten their lifespan, while exporting a (healthy) animal from an Indian zoo is more likely to prolong its life. Having seen conditions in a few Indian Zoos, I would stand by that.

However, to be perfectly fair, and regarding Indian Rhinos, for very many years I have regarded Whipsnade Zoo's Indian Rhino accomodation as 'substandard' too. In Indian zoos they at least have a good climate. For fifty years or more, Whipsnade's have been kept in paddocks with either hard ground or cold mud,(or both) while exposed to the rain, wind etc and with only spartan draughty shelters, with no form of heated pool, for indoor living. Recently, husbandry has improved but the indoor housing is still very primitive. For this reason I'm very pleased to hear that there are plans to build new indoor accomodation for them.

At present, Whipsnade's enclosures for this species are still not comparative with the other European collections keeping them.
 
MARK said:
Could not agree with you more on this, conditions there are primitive
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Its always bugged me ever since I first started visiting there. The shelters in the first paddock(1950's onwards) were just like a couple of Garages. And after they were moved to the current area, things aren't much better. That it hasn't improved much over such a very long time is bad.
 
surely the new indoor accomodation will have indoor viewing along with an indoor pool but with the herd expanding as it is, indoor viewing might not be a priority
 
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