Lets get back to another option, IF Australia Zoo were to build another small barn they could take them because of the sheer amount of room they have off exhibit its far more than what is needed just for 4 elephants!
Australasian Asian Elephant Population 2022
- Thread starter Amberangel112
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If Australia Zoo have no intention of importing a bull for breeding, then it would be preferable to see them fulfill this role as a retirement home for these two cows.
Assuming the two cows at Taronga can be reintroduced to the Dubbo herd, it's likely the region will never again find itself in this situation with all cows held in cohesive multigenerational herds at the open range zoos.
Auckland have stated they'll never again work with Australia Zoo on sending Burma there, so I'm unsure if this is something they'd go back on.
I believe due to the age of these cows sending them that long distance is not the best option for them. I was unaware that Auckland Zoo would never again work with AZ that is not a good situation or a good look!
Werribee will have the space for a bachelor group of males if required - they have plenty of room, even if Permai and Burma were to live separately from the main herd.
I think if it really comes down to the point where Burma and Permai have no options whatsoever, Werribee may be one to step in and take in these elephants. They don't NEED these two females, but if there's no chance of sending them elsewhere, I don't think there's any reason why Werribee won't accept those two girls on humane grounds.
I hope this is the case, Also I wonder if its possible to fast track the project somewhat!
I believe due to the age of these cows sending them that long distance is not the best option for them. I was unaware that Auckland Zoo would never again work with AZ that is not a good situation or a good look!
A regional transfer would certainly be preferable. Although Auckland's director said that at the time, I'm sure if Australia Zoo could demonstrate a serious commitment to taking these cows, then that would be recognised as the best option.
Personally I think it's a shame neither Auckland or Perth will rconsider their phase out and provide a retirement home for these females.
I guess this could be done- but they still have to wait for the calves to reach at least a year of age before a transfer can be made; and if Burma and Permai were to be sent to Werribee it would probably be advisable for them to arrive following the Melbourne herd's move so this could still be two years away unfortunately.
Another option may be to transfer the Sydney bulls into the breeding program sooner, and transfer Burma and Permai there. But there's really no options for those males within the region in the meantime, besides Australia who don't even have facilities for a bull at the moment.
Sydney do have two enclosures though, so they may be able to accommodate the two females alongside the bulls in the meantime.
I can't see SZ wanting to lose 2 young elephants and replace them with 2 older girls or even if they brought in the 2 girls and they did not get along its a big problem for them!
The girls aren't that old though; both could live potentially live another three decades- and by that time Sydney will be able to consider whether they have the adequate space to hold elephants and go from there.
If they don't get along though - that's a huge issue. But I guess risks will have to be taken rather than keeping them sitting at their current homes by themselves.
I would be very surprised if they could live that long, the risk of putting 2 older cows together in a place with only one option of a yard is to greater a risk and not even worth trying!
Burma is 40 so will likely live another 15-20 years and even then, there's no guarantee of that.
I too can't imagine Sydney relinquishing their young bulls. Aside from the fact they're likely to be around another 40 years, a tusked bull is an impressive attraction and they won't come with the age related health issues of senior cows (which are expensive to treat).
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A new video has been released of the new female calf.
She’s now ventured out into the outdoor enclosure; and we can see great signs from Mali too who seems to be flanking Dokkoon and assisting with protecting the calf from any hazards around the exhibit.
The calf also seems to be progressing well which is a very good thing - but does look to be on the smaller side, so it’ll be interesting to see her birth weight.
Zoos Victoria on Instagram: "Melbourne Zoo's newest arrival is in very good company She has had a busy few days getting acquainted with the other female Asian Elephants in her herd! For now, we're giving bub a chance to bond with her mother and the rest of her herd but rest assured we will announce as soon as you're able to see her for yourself. Visual description: An Asian Elephant calf walks across yellow sand, between two adult Asian Elephants. The adult Elephants gently guide and caress the calf with their trunks."
She’s now ventured out into the outdoor enclosure; and we can see great signs from Mali too who seems to be flanking Dokkoon and assisting with protecting the calf from any hazards around the exhibit.
The calf also seems to be progressing well which is a very good thing - but does look to be on the smaller side, so it’ll be interesting to see her birth weight.
Zoos Victoria on Instagram: "Melbourne Zoo's newest arrival is in very good company She has had a busy few days getting acquainted with the other female Asian Elephants in her herd! For now, we're giving bub a chance to bond with her mother and the rest of her herd but rest assured we will announce as soon as you're able to see her for yourself. Visual description: An Asian Elephant calf walks across yellow sand, between two adult Asian Elephants. The adult Elephants gently guide and caress the calf with their trunks."
Social Dynamics in the Melbourne Herd
With Dokkoon’s new calf being introduced to the other cows in the herd, it’ll be interesting to see the dynamics of the herd change with two more calves arriving in the next two months. Mali, who is attentive to the new calf now, will soon be preoccupied with her own calf; and similarly, Dokkoon will be limited in the support she can provide to Mali.
There are positives. Alloparenting has been observed at both Melbourne and Dubbo and I’d expect to see it on an even greater level with the calves being suckled by all three cows - reinforcing the bonds of this already cohesive herd.
The other positive is that it will bypass the problems of age-staggered calves, where the adults spend considerable time protecting the younger calf from the exuberance of an older calf. This was the case for Mali and Ongard (nine month age gap) and even more so with Sabai and Kanlaya (two year age gap) until the younger calf was robust enough to withstand their interactions.
With Dokkoon’s new calf being introduced to the other cows in the herd, it’ll be interesting to see the dynamics of the herd change with two more calves arriving in the next two months. Mali, who is attentive to the new calf now, will soon be preoccupied with her own calf; and similarly, Dokkoon will be limited in the support she can provide to Mali.
There are positives. Alloparenting has been observed at both Melbourne and Dubbo and I’d expect to see it on an even greater level with the calves being suckled by all three cows - reinforcing the bonds of this already cohesive herd.
The other positive is that it will bypass the problems of age-staggered calves, where the adults spend considerable time protecting the younger calf from the exuberance of an older calf. This was the case for Mali and Ongard (nine month age gap) and even more so with Sabai and Kanlaya (two year age gap) until the younger calf was robust enough to withstand their interactions.
I expect the new state of the art elephant complex at Werribee to open a whole new world for the Melbourne herd, I hope the herd thrives, one can see the expected calfs doing well under these outstanding conditions. If there were further female calfs it would set the herd for years to come not to mention the arrival of the Perth bull.
An interesting observation from the staff at Melbourne is the elephants interact more with each other since protected contact was implemented. This will occur on an even broader scale once the elephants move to this expansive complex, which will promote self management.
While the zoo (and the region) won’t have the capacity to allow natural birth intervals, we’ll surely see more regular breeding than in the past - with the facilities to manage the transition of adolescent bulls out of the matriarchal herd and into a bachelor herd.
Perhaps to much keeper contact was a distraction for the herd
Yes, the keepers while attentive, inadvertently took on the role of decision makers which meant the elephants weren’t thinking for themselves as they do now.
Their involvement also fulfilled social roles that have now been assumed by the herd e.g. elephant birthing partners rather than keepers/vet staff.
I would of thought this would of been common knowledge among the elephant world?
I think it was as much a continuation of 20th Century practices of keeping cows under full contact. It was usual for our region’s zoos to only have one or two elephants and so the stimulation they received from keeper interaction was essential to their wellbeing - as it is for Burma at Auckland Zoo at this point in time.
Aside from the reasons behind shifting to protected contact, elephants are now in a better position to self manage within large matriarchal herds. Skills will be passed down matrilineal lines as they are in the wild. It’s dawn of a new and exciting era.
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