BlobfishBoy
Well-Known Member
I’m curious if that’s either a birth defect or a healed injury.
Captive Orca Population
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I'd lean more to it being a healed injury; possibly sustained after capture?
Sacchi
Well-Known Member
China Cetacean Alliance say they suspect Katenka is pregnant again.
One of the trainers said she wasn't around a month ago. Obviously if it was suspected by visitors and therefore noticeable, she would need to be a while in gestation which wouldn't add up with previous statements by staff there.
I guess we'll have to just wait and see! Any further growth could potentially indicate a pregnancy; but given Katenka's still a fairly young whale we can't rule out normal growth as well.
It’s possible. I know of many facilities (including zoological) who have dismissed pregnancies when in reality the animal is pregnant. This is usually done to avoid negative PR, especially if it’s a well known animal; in the case of an unsuccessful pregnancy/birth.
Of course, I’m hopeful she is pregnant again. It’s interesting that the other females haven’t managed to conceive (at least naturally). I suppose groupings may have something to do with this, and Katenka is the dominant female so maybe this has something to do with her quick conceptions thus far.
Just a further update on this;
Females Jade, Nukka and the young calf Loki are still at the Chimelong Holding facility.
We can therefore assume either Jade or Nukka mothered Loki. It's unknown yet as to when they will be transferred to the spaceship.
Jonathan Petersson
Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the updates on Chimelong Jambo! I highly doubt that Katenka is pregnant as Mike Burn, the current head trainer at Ocean Kingdom, is very against pregnant females performing slide out behaviors which lead to issues with the calf during pregnancy. Most likely she is just putting on a little weight as the transients are known to be chunkier in general.
Killer Whale Population Updates:
Marineland Antibes: Inouk is recovering well from his ailment and has started high energy behaviors again along with participating in shows due to his lethargy going away. His coloration also seems to be coming back which is a great sign of recovery. The move to Japan is still on at the moment with the whales leaving in March of 2024. Marineland is trying to export the whales no matter the case due to the serious financial issues they are currently facing so I highly doubt it will ever be called off as members have speculated.
Mundo Marino: After receiving so much international backlash and criticism, Mundo Marino seems to have finally stepped up their care for Kshamenk and he is starting to gain his weight back with a better diet. His peanut head is almost completely gone and he is doing high energy behaviors again compared to a couple months ago where he could barely accomplish a pec wave and other low-energy behaviors. However he is still not out of the woods yet. Mundo Marino has started feeding ground up fish in circular shapes as it is cheaper than normal fish but it severely lacks the nutrients he needs for survival. The stadium as well is starting to go into disrepair with walls starting to crumble and crack, rust forming, and paint chipping off. As well he is still showing signs of lethargy with logging behavior or other sedentary acts being demonstrated when he is not performing. Hopefully he can continue well on his recovery and Mundo Marino will keep stepping up and providing the care he desperately needs.
Moskvarium: Naja’s pregnancy seems to be progressing well with no major updates coming out of the aquarium recently. I am pleasantly surprised with how open Moskvarium has been surrounding the pregnancy and plans for the future and if all goes well there should be a calf born sometime next month.
Shanghai Ocean Park: Dora’s pregnancy seems to be going smoothly and she should be due any day now if all goes well. It appears Cookie is not pregnant as some suspected.
Abuse at Loro Parque:
I figured since many people were questioning why most cetacean facilities have such strong opinions on Loro Parque I would explain the whole situation. The main issue with Loro Parque revolves around diet. An inspection done by a member of the IAAAM found that 17 cetaceans had digestive issues including delayed digestion, full stomachs, enlarged pyloric stomachs, enlarged intestinal loops, inflammation, liver inflammation, and ascites. One of the dolphins showed a severe case of intermittent partial ileus and transient intussusception. Multiple dolphins and orcas had pericardial effusion, pleural involvement, and bronchopneumonia along with almost every individual suffering from strong periportal cuffing which lead most to inflammatory bowel disease. These dietary problems lead to sclerosing cholangitis forming in Skyla and was what eventually killed her. The worst case of dietary issues at Loro Parque was with poor Ula. After Ula was separated from Morgan due to issues with Morgan’s milk production, Ula was put on a severely improper diet that led to her eventual death. Throughout her short life she suffered from severe fluid-filled dilated bowel loops, weight loss, and constant regurgitation. Loro Parque created these problems which would not have occurred otherwise by means of a full-fish diet for her first couple years of life. Loro Parque has all their cetaceans on a full herring diet leading to a severe lack of nutritional elements the whales and dolphins need to survive and improper rations for each individual. As time went on, Loro Parque thought it would be a good idea to reduce the volume of food Ula was intaking. Well this just like her original diet was a mistake and poor Ula began to develop severe ascites along the conditions already listed worsening. She began to develop pneumatosis and mucosal integrity loss. Her ascites developed septation and adhesion began to form. A severe gastrointestinal issue formed as air bubbles formed in her liver. Ula’s condition got so bad that she was very unresponsive and apathetic leading Loro Parque to decide to withhold all food from her and only give her an electrolyte solution for hydration. When she began to show interest in food again Loro Parque decided to introduce fish gruel as her primary diet. Well what do you know but this leads to sludge formation and reduced motility, extreme vomiting and regurgitation, as well as mesenteric vein enlargement and digestive tract issues. Now at this stage after so much mismanagement with her diet, Ula’s intestines started to twist and inflammation in her blood and rapid weight loss occurred. Her ascites became hyper-echoic and she developed peritonitis. After these conditions worsened, Ula passed away on August 10, 2021 after spending her entire life in pain. A necropsy was performed and Ula had complete mesenteric torsion with nine loops and chronic inflammatory processes in the digestive system, as well as fibrosis in her portal system. Her death and life long suffering was completely the result of mismanagement and improper care by Loro Parque. So now you might understand why a facility like Marinlenad Antibes who is desperate to get rid of their killer whales would not even send them to Loro Parque. Ula was not the first nor the last case of a death due to Loro Parque’s mismanagement. Kohana's death was a result of volvulus, infectious endocarditis, and necrotizing bronchopneumonia. Skyla as I mentioned above died from torsion due to an improper diet. Victoria passed away as well from similar issues. It is obscured that every single death of a Killer Whale at Loro Parque could have been prevented and was instead caused by the facilities own mismanagement and improper care of Killer Whales. And that is why Loro Parque is known as one of the worst facilities and why parks like Marineland would never send their whales away to such an awful place. This mismanagement is as well one of the reasons SeaWorld left its partnership with Loro Parque as the care standards are so bad they are often below most Chinese facilities (ex. Chimelong and Shanghai). Hopefully this clears this up for everyone and explains why Loro Parque is such an awful facility.
Thanks for all the updates on Chimelong Jambo! I highly doubt that Katenka is pregnant as Mike Burn, the current head trainer at Ocean Kingdom, is very against pregnant females performing slide out behaviors which lead to issues with the calf during pregnancy. Most likely she is just putting on a little weight as the transients are known to be chunkier in general.
Hopefully he outranks Julien Forestier who at one point was director of animal training, not sure what he does there now, but he was a senior trainer at Loro Parque. Slightly better optics to have a former Sea World trainer managing the killer whales (even if he was at Marineland Ontario prior to Sea World which in my opinion rivals L.P. in terms of welfare) than a Loro Parque trainer.
Hopefully he outranks Julien Forestier who at one point was director of animal training, not sure what he does there now, but he was a senior trainer at Loro Parque. Slightly better optics to have a former Sea World trainer managing the killer whales (even if he was at Marineland Ontario prior to Sea World which in my opinion rivals L.P. in terms of welfare) than a Loro Parque trainer.
I find it disgusting that any facility is actively breeding these animals. They should be completely phased out from captivity, either by rehab and release or just letting the population quietly retire and live out their days in peace until the inevitable happens.
That would make a huge amount of sense as I believe Mike advised the public that Katenka was not pregnant a few months ago. It's also important to remember these whales are still fairly young and so will certainly still be growing.
Very glad to hear he's improving.
Would've been much better if the Argentinian government would've allowed him to be exported rather than forcing him to stay at a facility that is obviously lacking the proper care and facilities for him.
Hopefully we have two healthy calves before the year ends!
There also seems to be a strong likelihood now that Naja and her calf will be sent to China once the calf is healthy enough for transfer.
Jonathan Petersson
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Last I heard he does outrank Mr. Forestier (If he even deserves the respect to be called by a formal title) but I personally don't fine either of them to be the greatest people and good trainers. Burn's whole reasoning for going to Chimelong was for the money and high mangement position. He was very supportive of the wild catching of the whales and only really cares about the money hence not wanting a pregnancy to go wrong as then no money could be made from a calf. Marineland and Loro Parque are definitely some terrible facilities for cetaceans along with MSQ.
It would be incredible if Kshamenk could be transferred out of that hell hole but as you mentioned I doubt we will ever see it happen due to issues with the law. I mean SeaWorld would most likely be happy to take him in as they have shown interest in bringing in whales with them offering to take in both Toki and Toa. We can one day hope that the Argentinian government will listen and allow for Kshamenk to be transferred to a facility where his needs and welfare are actually met.
I personally have no clue about the future of Naja. I have heard rumors about a transfer to China but to me it just doesn't make sense as they are bringing her pregnancy to the spotlight so much and will most likely do the same with a calf. After making the world so aware of these two whales the backlash would be very intense if they moved them to China. What I see is the more likely situation is the Moskvarium will keep Naja and her calf for the rest of their lives at the aquarium while making false claims that they are trying to build a seaside sanctuary for them. I know the park was having some trouble with their dolphins showing aggressive behavior towards each other which led to some space issues but I think that has been sorted out now. It just doesn’t make sense for the Moskarium to send away their stars and seems more likely that they will hold onto them but create false hope of the two whales moving to a sanctuary for good publicity.
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There were plans back in the early 2000's to send him to Six Flags to pair him with Shouka but that unfortunately fell out. Seaworld have previously expressed in providing a home for Kshamenk if needed and Mundo Marino have tried to offload him; it's just the Argentinian Government standing in the way refusing to approve his transfer as he's 'natural fauna'. Unless they budge, their refusal will probably end up not letting Kshamenk live his maximum lifespan in captivity.
Sacchi
Well-Known Member
Thank you for the updates. Much appreciated. However, can I make a request that we (everyone, myself included), start posting links to sources when posting news. I like to save interesting stuff and sometimes share news elsewhere.
I saw the stuff about Loro Parque on Twitter the other day (here is the 2023 IAAAM conference video for anyone who hasn't seen it. The Loro Parque bit starts at 30 mins. You can also click through the conference info, but they don't make it easy to find things), but I still haven't seen any pics or videos of Inouk when he was sick, or Kshamenk looking better. I've searched but can't find anything. I don't have an Insta or TikTok, so I probably miss a lot of stuff posted there.
I saw the stuff about Loro Parque on Twitter the other day (here is the 2023 IAAAM conference video for anyone who hasn't seen it. The Loro Parque bit starts at 30 mins. You can also click through the conference info, but they don't make it easy to find things), but I still haven't seen any pics or videos of Inouk when he was sick, or Kshamenk looking better. I've searched but can't find anything. I don't have an Insta or TikTok, so I probably miss a lot of stuff posted there.
I normally get my info from twitter too like you. I don't think there's a lot that goes through Insta or Tiktok tbh.
I'm certainly happy to post links to my updates; I had just assumed everyone would be able to access it themselves as it does spread around the ceta community fairly quickly.
Jonathan Petersson
Well-Known Member
I remember how exited we all were when that happened as both whales would finally get a campaign but It was a said day when the deal was cancelled. I didn't know SeaWorld has even offered a home for him before which is very interesting.
Thanks for adding in the links for the Loro Parque mistreatment, the one I had was given to me under terms of privacy so I was unsure whether or not I would be able to share the actual source (content mentioned in it was allowed to be shared).
I personally use Instagram some for information as there are some great accounts. My main source for information are often private facebook groups or talking orally with visitors to the different parks and the reports of what they saw. This makes it a little complicated to share sources but I'll see what can be done in the future.
Wisp O' Mist
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This isn't actually all that surprising, Kshamenk has sired two calves via A.I. for SeaWorld.
Makani of SeaWorld San Diego and Kamea of SeaWorld San Antonio are his son and daughter, respectively.
Yup, I think Takara's miscarriage in 2012 was also sired by Kshamenk as I think they AI'd her and Kasatka at the same time if I remember right. Seaworld announced she (Takara) was pregnant around the end of August 2011 and then that she was no longer pregnant in March 2012. Surprised they didn't use him for AI with Katina given how successful she is/was as a breeding female.
BlobfishBoy
Well-Known Member
Kshamenk's main obstacle is the stubbornness of the Argentinian government. I think it's pretty obvious to anyone that his situation isn't animal trafficking (I assume that's the main reason the laws regarding the export of Argentinian native fauna exist) and Mundo Marino should be permitted to send him to a new home. If enough pressure is put on them there's a chance they let him move but I personally think it's unlikely.
Yeah Seaworld flew over to Mundo Marino in early 2011 to collect sperm for their whales. Kasatka and Takara were both AI'd in around August 2011 but obviously as we know Takara had absorbed the fetus she was carrying at around six months. They AI'd her again five or so months later, and we have Kamea as a result.
There were rumors flying around that Katina may be used for breeding again around that time, but when you consider her representation its obvious why Seaworld didn't allow her to breed further. It's also believed Kalina was in the early stages of pregnancy when she died in 2010 too but we'll never get confirmation on that.
Actually regarding AI at Orlando, they had plans to try and AI Kayla at the time (presumbly with Kshamenks sperm) but not sure if this eventuated. If they did attempt it, she obviously never fell pregnant.
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