European animals in North American collections

ColumbusZoo001 said:
I would stick to ungulates and birds to enhance North Carolina's impressive collection and those are the most endangered groups of European animals.
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We have quite a few endangered species in Europe from mammals all the way up to invertebrates. You would be surprised how many. This is indicative how little perception there seems to be overseas re. Europe's wildlife. We do have wide open spaces, we do have wildlife,... and yes we have - at least in western Europe - quite modified our direct environment, but to say we do not have any wildlife nor endangered species is simply not correct.
 
Ituri said:
European badgers are EXTREMELY different from American badgers both in looks and behavior. Wisent are also quite distinctive from plains bison (though I have heard taxonomists who lump them in the same species as Bos bison) Otters are a distinct species from river otters, though the physical differences are not that great. I think in cases where some of those animals are already in other sections of the zoo (ie vultures, though I don't think that NC has Cinereous vultures anywhere) it would be rather interesting/educational/different/fun to place those animals in a European context. It would help change perceptions of European wildlife in North America. For example did you know there are golden jackals in Europe?
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Thanks for the interesting info. As for the bison, I know at least a few zoos (ie, Toronto) that display both continent's bison. I also agree with you that they could display some of these animals in both Europe and another place (Africa, North America). For example, it would be interesting to display flamingos -- as they are seen in southern Spain. I personally think a new Europe section in the North Carolina Zoo (or some other zoo) could be very interesting. They could intermingle it with some European architecture (and perhaps some landmarks), as well as serve some tasty European food.

Hey, North Carolina Zoo folks: Are you listening?
 
I also meant to tack on (to my last email) that this Europe section wouldn't have to be nearly as expensive as previous sections (Africa, North America) of the zoo. Most of the animals could be year-round and thus wouldn't require expensive indoor viewing. Also most of the animals aren't so big as to require a lot of space.

Once open, the Zoo could reap an advertising bonanza as the nation's only full-fledged exhibit of European animals.
 
Kifaru Bwana said:
We have quite a few endangered species in Europe from mammals all the way up to invertebrates. You would be surprised how many. This is indicative how little perception there seems to be overseas re. Europe's wildlife. We do have wide open spaces, we do have wildlife,... and yes we have - at least in western Europe - quite modified our direct environment, but to say we do not have any wildlife nor endangered species is simply not correct.
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Don't get me wrong, Kifaru! Of course we know you have wildlife over there. But wildlife and wide open spaces are NOT the first thing we Americans think of when we think "Europe". It's clearly not the same image we have as when we think "Africa" or "Australia".
 
ANyhuis said:
Just a quick response: I would think they would only want to display animals that they are not already exhibiting (over in their North American section). So that would eliminate the polar bears, otters, and (I think) badgers. Also, would the European versions of brown bear and bison (wisent) be all that different from the North American versions they already have? I'm not sure, but I think some of those vultures might be in their African section.
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True, they probably wouldn't display or move the otters and polar bears but since it is hypothetical I would. There are no badgers or the two vulture species I previously mentioned on display so they could be in the Europe section. Personally, I think the brown bears and wisent would work because they do have differences in how they look from their North American counterparts and signs could also talk about the difference between the two (like crocs and gators).
 
ANyhuis said:
I also meant to tack on (to my last email) that this Europe section wouldn't have to be nearly as expensive as previous sections (Africa, North America) of the zoo. Most of the animals could be year-round and thus wouldn't require expensive indoor viewing. Also most of the animals aren't so big as to require a lot of space.

Once open, the Zoo could reap an advertising bonanza as the nation's only full-fledged exhibit of European animals.
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Ain't gonna happen.

San Diego used to show wisent next to North American bison--now they have neither.... because they wanted/needed space to display a charismatic mega-vertebrate that will bring people into the zoo (elephants). As zoo collections become more homogeneous because of commercial pressures ("crowd-pleasers") and need to manage populations (SSPs etc.), the hugely diverse and esoteric collections ala Berlin and (formerly) San Diego will become a thing of the past.
 
There are three species that are WIDELY available in the states that could anchor a European exhibit. Those being fallow deer, red deer, and wild boar. This wouldn't be the showstopper exhibit of all exhibits but would be an interesting one that would be possible for even a small zoo to take on.

As an interesting side note, from the SD Zoo's 1984 Bioclimatic collection plan:

Western Eurasian temperate forest
Barbary macaque
Scottish wildcat
Cuvier's gazelle
mouflon sheep
Cretan goat
roe deer
wisent
owls
grouse
pheasant

Eurasian Montane
gelada baboon
Tibetan macaque
snow leopard
Persian leopard
Pallas cat
hairy-eared bear
squirrel
takin
goral
markhor
blue sheep
lammergier
eagle owl
waldrapp
black grouse
Chinese monal
 
Ituri said:
There are three species that are WIDELY available in the states that could anchor a European exhibit. Those being fallow deer, red deer, and wild boar. This wouldn't be the showstopper exhibit of all exhibits but would be an interesting one that would be possible for even a small zoo to take on.

As an interesting side note, from the SD Zoo's 1984 Bioclimatic collection plan:

Western Eurasian temperate forest
Barbary macaque
Scottish wildcat
Cuvier's gazelle
mouflon sheep
Cretan goat
roe deer
wisent
owls
grouse
pheasant

Eurasian Montane
gelada baboon
Tibetan macaque
snow leopard
Persian leopard
Pallas cat
hairy-eared bear
squirrel
takin
goral
markhor
blue sheep
lammergier
eagle owl
waldrapp
black grouse
Chinese monal
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Gelada baboon????

Last I checked Ethiopia was not a candidate to join the European Union!
 
reduakari said:
Ain't gonna happen.

San Diego used to show wisent next to North American bison--now they have neither.... because they wanted/needed space to display a charismatic mega-vertebrate that will bring people into the zoo (elephants). As zoo collections become more homogeneous because of commercial pressures ("crowd-pleasers") and need to manage populations (SSPs etc.), the hugely diverse and esoteric collections ala Berlin and (formerly) San Diego will become a thing of the past.
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You're probably right. But the image in my mind is a great Epcot Center-like exhibit area, with exhibits of unique European animals (Barbary apes, chamois, wisents, reindeer, raccoon dogs, etc.) intermingled with matching architecture (from the country the animal is native to). I would have the bathrooms, gift shops, and animals' night quarters all built to resemble the classic architecture of Spain, Germany, or wherever. I'd also add in separate snack bars featuring German, Italian, and other nations' cuisine -- again near the animals from those particular countries. I can visualize this as a great cultural and unique animal attraction.
 
Cuvier Gazelle and Gelada are African and not European animals. The barbary ape is also home at the Atlasmountains in Morocco, there is only a small population on Gribaltar, which is not temperate forest.
 
ANyhuis said:
You're probably right. But the image in my mind is a great Epcot Center-like exhibit area, with exhibits of unique European animals (Barbary apes, chamois, wisents, reindeer, raccoon dogs, etc.) intermingled with matching architecture (from the country the animal is native to). I would have the bathrooms, gift shops, and animals' night quarters all built to resemble the classic architecture of Spain, Germany, or wherever. I'd also add in separate snack bars featuring German, Italian, and other nations' cuisine -- again near the animals from those particular countries. I can visualize this as a great cultural and unique animal attraction.
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Another thing that may be fun would be to present what are traditionally thought of as African or Asian animals in an historic Europe context. Striped hyenas once ranged from Great Britain to China! Lions would also make a fascinating exhibit in a European context. In my mind Asian lions would be used because they would be closer to the European lion (feel free to correct my assumption if it's false) Mix those in with red deer, wisent, wild boar, and white storks. I think that would be pretty neat. I like your idea with the cultural immersion. Cultural immersion is very frequently used in African, Southeast Asian, and Central/South American exhibits with varying degrees of accuracy, but a European immersion exhibit would be most unique indeed!
 
lintworm said:
The barbary ape is also home at the Atlasmountains in Morocco, there is only a small population on Gribaltar,
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True but the small population on Gibraltar gives reason to add primates to a European exhibit. I think of it as "what will attract the average visitor?". That is why I added polar bears and muskox to the Europe section in an earlier post. Another thing to consider is not just the collection but the way exhibits are done. Besides the polar bear, neither of the other two bear exhibits at NC have underwater viewing or allow visitors to get face to face to the bears. If a new European brown bear exhibit was built with under water viewing and big glass viewing windows so the visitors and bears can be nose to nose then people would be attracted to the exhibit and not care about the species. But zoo fanatics like us would appreciate both. Also if a lot of people go to see a certain charasmatic other animals in the section will benefit from it. It would be like if people went to a zoo to feed giraffes on the savannah exhibit that was also occupied by blesbok, jacksons hartebeeste and cape buffalo. Average visitors will look at the other species and think " a cow and a couple of antelope" but will wait for ever and spend a decent amount of money to feed a giraffe a cracker. I on the other hand I could care less about the giraffes and would watch the other three species because of their rarity in captivity. Even though I am more interested in the species besides the giraffe I realize its the giraffe bringing in the money so the other species can be exhibited. That is why adding polar bears, barbary apes or another species to a Europe section could help bring in some of the rarer species.
 
I could also foresee a "British" children's exhibit themed around the stories of Beatrix Potter, as she wrote and illustrated all kinds of animal stories. You could have pictures of animals from her books in back of exhibits of the actual animals (hedgehogs, toads, rabbits, foxes, badgers, ducks). This would not only be popular with kids, but also encourage them to read.
 
ANyhuis said:
I could also foresee a "British" children's exhibit themed around the stories of Beatrix Potter, as she wrote and illustrated all kinds of animal stories. You could have pictures of animals from her books in back of exhibits of the actual animals (hedgehogs, toads, rabbits, foxes, badgers, ducks). This would not only be popular with kids, but also encourage them to read.
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And maybe go to the library:D
 
ANyhuis said:
I could also foresee a "British" children's exhibit themed around the stories of Beatrix Potter, as she wrote and illustrated all kinds of animal stories. You could have pictures of animals from her books in back of exhibits of the actual animals (hedgehogs, toads, rabbits, foxes, badgers, ducks). This would not only be popular with kids, but also encourage them to read.
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I absolutely could see an European themed children's zoo.
 
ANyhuis said:
I actually thought about this thread while in bed last night. I think one of the key reasons (in addition to what Kifaru said above) why there is not much emphasis on European species in American zoos is ---- perception. When Americans think of Africa, Australia, South America, and much of Asia, we think of the wild places -- the African savannah, jungles of Asia and the Amazon, and the Australian outback. But when we think of Europe, we think of cities and people, not animals. If you asked the average American to name 3 animals that live in Europe, most would probably say "Dog, cat, and horse".

Another example of perception here in America is the lack of Central American animals in our North American exhibit areas. There are excellent North American areas in North Carolina, Columbus, Minnesota, Fort Worth, Oklahoma City, Oregon, Lowry Park, Tulsa, Sedgwick County, and elsewhere. But none of these North American areas feature spider monkeys, tapirs, toucans, or any other animals from Central America. Why? Because the "perception" is that Central America is more like South America. In fact, one recent poster even argued with me that Central America is NOT even a part of North America -- which of course, it officially is.
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Actually zoos dont usually theme their areas solely of the policital continents that they are named for, but the zoogeographic realms. In zoogeography...Central American is combined with South America to creat the Neotropics, the rest of North American is the Nearctic. Europe and Northern Asia are the Palearctic and the rest of Asia is Oriental. Africa represents the Ethiopian realm and the last contains Australia.

This is the reason why there are no spider monkeys in North American exhibits.
 
okapikpr said:
Actually zoos dont usually theme their areas solely of the policital continents that they are named for, but the zoogeographic realms. In zoogeography...Central American is combined with South America to creat the Neotropics, the rest of North American is the Nearctic. Europe and Northern Asia are the Palearctic and the rest of Asia is Oriental. Africa represents the Ethiopian realm and the last contains Australia.

This is the reason why there are no spider monkeys in North American exhibits.
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Not always. Stone Zoo originally had spider monkeys at the entrance to their Sierra Madre exhibit and it is, essentially, a south Texas/central America section. I always thought it was neat they did that because they do come from this region and (your right, okapikpr) most zoos don't think to do that.
 
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