Melbourne Zoo Melbourne Zoo visits...
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on a side note, i have noticed when steve was around, all the planned exhibits, were mainly that of animals he had close interqactions with, orangs, elephants, cheetah, tigers. all featured in documentaries with him extremely close and in very personal encounters. now all these exhibits are planned.
Australia Zoo has sent out news via its website that they plan to have gorillas and orangutans, as well as a massive African Safari in their long-term plans. The idea is for a drive-thru savannah that will probably be as large as the rest of the zoo combined. The lemur exhibit should be completed within a couple of years. The elephants are extremely old, and there could definitely be issues with importing more due to the problems that Melbourne and Taronga both went through...but the current exhibit is extremely large which is crucial for the world's largest land mammal.
Patrick: You have an affinity for Melbourne Zoo because it's your home zoo and you've obviously visited it many times over the years. I basically agree with everything that you said, and your message was full of valid information.
The Melbourne Zoo's elephant exhibit is top-notch (better than Taronga's), the orangutans, gorillas and siamangs all have excellent enclosures, and the sumatran tigers also have a good exhibit. Have you seen Adelaide's sumatran tiger enclosure? That is almost ideal as it can be difficult to spot the cats, and they have a huge pool by lengthy windows.
At Melbourne the baboon, syrian brown bear, and all of the big cats have adequate exhibits at best, and hopefully after the new seal pools are finished the zoo can turn its development team towards these old, poorly contructed areas of the zoo. No zoo is perfect, and when I visited the "world-famous" San Diego Zoo last year there were plenty of exhibits that definitely could be improved even though overall the place was fantastic. The zoo was amazing but space was a concern in some sections of the zoo, as it is in all zoos.
Patrick: You have an affinity for Melbourne Zoo because it's your home zoo and you've obviously visited it many times over the years. I basically agree with everything that you said, and your message was full of valid information.
The Melbourne Zoo's elephant exhibit is top-notch (better than Taronga's), the orangutans, gorillas and siamangs all have excellent enclosures, and the sumatran tigers also have a good exhibit. Have you seen Adelaide's sumatran tiger enclosure? That is almost ideal as it can be difficult to spot the cats, and they have a huge pool by lengthy windows.
At Melbourne the baboon, syrian brown bear, and all of the big cats have adequate exhibits at best, and hopefully after the new seal pools are finished the zoo can turn its development team towards these old, poorly contructed areas of the zoo. No zoo is perfect, and when I visited the "world-famous" San Diego Zoo last year there were plenty of exhibits that definitely could be improved even though overall the place was fantastic. The zoo was amazing but space was a concern in some sections of the zoo, as it is in all zoos.
exactly.
i would say the most important issues are:
brown bears (exhibit too small, too concrete)
baboons (unsightly cages)
batchelor gorillas (living in unsuitable 70's ape grottoes)
i would consider the big cat rows adequate but probably not the most modern of exhibits. they are heavily planted out and reasonably sized. the only inhabitant to is guarenteed a place at melbourne at present is the snow leopards. they could be cheaply redeveloped to hold a number of these rare cats, provided the den facilities are adequate. but i think a big question mark may hang over this area at present as it was originally earmarked as a temperate zone, but since then brown bears have been earmarked for phase out leaving very few temperate species on the long-term melbourne list (pandas, snow leopards) and no doubt a reluctance to spend money on the exhibit for two rather aged bears.
i suspect this area may stay largely as is for the time, instead the rather generic cages serving as tempoarily rehousing for a mixed bag of species whilst they recieve better exhibits in their respective zones. for example i suspect when the bears die the baboons will land the bear exhibit until funding is allocated to build them an exhibit at werribee.
so essentially since the bears getting a new exhibit is unlikely and the baboons getting their exhibit (which will be reasonably suitable for them) is hypothetical but in my view probable (melbourne has no current listing to keep sunbear) in the event the primates have not already been moved to werribee, *gasp for breath*
THEN...
the next project melbourne should undertake is the development of the ape grottoes into a new, second, gorilla exhibit.
but thats just speculation based on what i believe is the priorities, who knows what the CEO wants next after the seals?!
i would say the most important issues are:
brown bears (exhibit too small, too concrete)
baboons (unsightly cages)
batchelor gorillas (living in unsuitable 70's ape grottoes)
i would consider the big cat rows adequate but probably not the most modern of exhibits. they are heavily planted out and reasonably sized. the only inhabitant to is guarenteed a place at melbourne at present is the snow leopards. they could be cheaply redeveloped to hold a number of these rare cats, provided the den facilities are adequate. but i think a big question mark may hang over this area at present as it was originally earmarked as a temperate zone, but since then brown bears have been earmarked for phase out leaving very few temperate species on the long-term melbourne list (pandas, snow leopards) and no doubt a reluctance to spend money on the exhibit for two rather aged bears.
i suspect this area may stay largely as is for the time, instead the rather generic cages serving as tempoarily rehousing for a mixed bag of species whilst they recieve better exhibits in their respective zones. for example i suspect when the bears die the baboons will land the bear exhibit until funding is allocated to build them an exhibit at werribee.
so essentially since the bears getting a new exhibit is unlikely and the baboons getting their exhibit (which will be reasonably suitable for them) is hypothetical but in my view probable (melbourne has no current listing to keep sunbear) in the event the primates have not already been moved to werribee, *gasp for breath*
THEN...
the next project melbourne should undertake is the development of the ape grottoes into a new, second, gorilla exhibit.
but thats just speculation based on what i believe is the priorities, who knows what the CEO wants next after the seals?!
patrick come on, you havent been to wild asia since it opened at taronga, you havent seen GSO or even ventured into Wollemi! dont forget the Elephant Temple development due to open within 18 months or so too. (alls fair in zoo love and zoo war).
i love melbourne zoo....
trail of the elephants
sumatran tiger exhibit
orang sanctuary
gorilla exhibit
the reptile and frogs
butterflies
aviaires
australian section
but at the same time
the monotreme house is sad
the maned wolves and big cats hark back to a very early era
the penguin pool. red panda exhibits and babboon exhibits, as well as the big cats and primate islands, small cats and brown bear enclosures are incredibly daggy
and there is a noticable range of empy exhibits such as the tapir, hippo,
and the overall visitor experience could be enhanced in terms of food outlets, singnage etc.
i really believe melbourne zoo is one of the wolrds best zoos, and will be remain at the forefront of the world zoo community. strengthening its emphasis on rainforest and temperate wildlfife species in the future (for example expanding trail of the elephants to cover the savannah) will allow them to utilise space more effectively and capitalise on Weribbe and Healesville's position.
i love melbourne zoo....
trail of the elephants
sumatran tiger exhibit
orang sanctuary
gorilla exhibit
the reptile and frogs
butterflies
aviaires
australian section
but at the same time
the monotreme house is sad
the maned wolves and big cats hark back to a very early era
the penguin pool. red panda exhibits and babboon exhibits, as well as the big cats and primate islands, small cats and brown bear enclosures are incredibly daggy
and there is a noticable range of empy exhibits such as the tapir, hippo,
and the overall visitor experience could be enhanced in terms of food outlets, singnage etc.
i really believe melbourne zoo is one of the wolrds best zoos, and will be remain at the forefront of the world zoo community. strengthening its emphasis on rainforest and temperate wildlfife species in the future (for example expanding trail of the elephants to cover the savannah) will allow them to utilise space more effectively and capitalise on Weribbe and Healesville's position.
australia zoo have gorillas in ten years? not if the EEP won't give them any!...
I believe they are(or were when Steve Irwin was alive) friends with Aspinall/Howletts in the UK. Howletts operate largely as they please- that's the mostly likely way Australia Zoo would get gorillas...
They would still have the import restrictions to overcome though...
1. Bear exhibit- yes, it would 100% better for the Hamadryas baboons than their existing cages. They might have to roof it though to prevent escapes? If they filled in the water moat and added a glass viewing wall along the public perimeter it would provide even more space and viewing effect. But maybe that would be too much expense, especially if its not planned to be their permanent home.
2. Old Ape grottoes. I'd certainly be all for their redevelopment. I'm not sure exactly along what lines though. There's always a chance Motaba and his two sons may have to be seperated as the two young ones mature- some batchelor males will live happily on a permanent basis, but some won't. So the design would be better if it took that possibility into account.
Port Lympne(UK) main batchelor gorilla cage contains built-in sliding divisions to allow segretation of males if necessary- they have to use them sometimes too.
ha ha! yes all is fair, except i have done to the woolemi exhibit and for your information i think its terrific!!
but yes, melbourne has possibly the most pathetic penguin "pool" i have ever seen! - but they get a newbie in the coastal section..
and as for the maned wolves/big cats, they may appear old and no doubt the dens are probably outdated, but for carnivores a cage is a cage. they are reasonably sized by zoo standards and have plenty of trees and landscaping.
and i'm not knocking taronga (those days are over
) so much as building melbourne up a bit. i think melb has heaps of mediocre exhibits and at least two that are downright aweful. but really, last time i was at taronga (just prior to the wild asia opening) the red panda exhibit was exactly the same setup at melbournes, only it didn't even have any large trees!!and you have to admit the new orang exhibit is totally unsuitable for orangs. and i know you think the panda, i mean gorilla exhibit at taronga is lame too!
tarongas all hagenbeck grottoes, the sunbears have a god aweful exhibit. what about the lameo thar mountain, thats a relic (a heritage listed one too i believe!) and the barbary sheep exhibit is totally concrete hallstrom era.
(okay now i am knocking taronga!!!!
)grant - yep, they best make those grottoes two seperate enclosures i think. although both other males are motaba's sons, apparently he really favours ganyeka and is not so keen on yakini (i think zookiah mentioned that?). there is a melbourne zoo education activity sheet here:
http://www.zoo.org.au/education/learningresources/mz/later/mz03-wildbydesign-gorilla.pdf
on the last page it mentions a few ideas, including the need potentially two exhibits and that the batchelors need to be able to see the breeding group, for potential reintroduction at later stages...
i'm hoping the tree roos will go back to being displayed in a mixed exhibit with echidna alongside cassowary as they used to."Northern Neighbours" was a very popular exhibit and the echidnas proved just as interesting as the tree-kangaroos. they have the space to realistically create a small rainforest section in the australian zone for these species and then some.
melbourne has two hybrid orangs, mother and daughter - and auckland has one. pretty sure thats it for the region (we are lucky).
but i would be very supprised if taronga bailed out of keeping orangs!!
glad tahr mountain has had a makeover. post pics?
and we are talking bout the same panda and sunbear enclosures. i don't like em. last i saw the bears were pacing, and had no view as its essentially a pit from memory?
i still can't beieve the zoo hasn't righted that ficus tree that fell over in the sheep enclosure! (or that the sheep haven't eaten it all by now!!)
melbourne has two hybrid orangs, mother and daughter - and auckland has one. pretty sure thats it for the region (we are lucky).
but i would be very supprised if taronga bailed out of keeping orangs!!
glad tahr mountain has had a makeover. post pics?
and we are talking bout the same panda and sunbear enclosures. i don't like em. last i saw the bears were pacing, and had no view as its essentially a pit from memory?
i still can't beieve the zoo hasn't righted that ficus tree that fell over in the sheep enclosure! (or that the sheep haven't eaten it all by now!!)
no, the sheep exhibit tree is great, always has foliage, as well as animals climbing all over it, why fix it, its great!.
if we are talking bout same exhiit, o well diff of opninons. i hope we do get new panda exhibits, mabe next to the snow leopards. as for the sun beras, plans are to move them into kodiak exhibit when those 2 pass, not to mention it will have a lovely torpical makeover.
i do hope taronga does keep orangs, thats one thing it has over melb- all 3 ape speices!
if we are talking bout same exhiit, o well diff of opninons. i hope we do get new panda exhibits, mabe next to the snow leopards. as for the sun beras, plans are to move them into kodiak exhibit when those 2 pass, not to mention it will have a lovely torpical makeover.
i do hope taronga does keep orangs, thats one thing it has over melb- all 3 ape speices!
It's amusing to see the rivalry between Sydney and Melbourne include the two urban zoos. What's next? A Western Plains Zoo vs Werribee Zoo thread, or has that already been done?
As a Canadian who has been to each zoo once, I've already talked about both Melbourne and Taronga a number of times on this forum. With the Aussie backyard, Wild Asia, and Great Southern Oceans investment Taronga has probably pulled ahead overall. But just like Melbourne has the infamous brown bear and baboon enclosures, Taronga has the awful spider monkey concrete jungle and the small cat section that reeks to high heaven and is probably 50 years old.
Elephants = Melbourne gets the nod.
Orangs = Melbourne again.
Seals = Taronga's GSO looks good on their informative website, while I haven't seen the definitive plans for Melbourne's $20 million "sea stories" expansion.
Zoo Map = Taronga's is one of the most detailed I've ever seen
Aviary = Melbourne's great flight aviary is massive and very well done
Chimps = Taronga's chimps are what Melbourne might be lacking, as one can hang out and watch those apes forever.
One big drawback to Melbourne is that all of the newer, high-quality exhibits are along one side of the zoo. At that point the visitor thinks that Melbourne is one of the all-time great zoos...only to hit the other side and the hit-and-miss enclosures. Taronga, with all of their new development, just squeaks it as the better establishment. They are both worth many, many more visits.
As a Canadian who has been to each zoo once, I've already talked about both Melbourne and Taronga a number of times on this forum. With the Aussie backyard, Wild Asia, and Great Southern Oceans investment Taronga has probably pulled ahead overall. But just like Melbourne has the infamous brown bear and baboon enclosures, Taronga has the awful spider monkey concrete jungle and the small cat section that reeks to high heaven and is probably 50 years old.
Elephants = Melbourne gets the nod.
Orangs = Melbourne again.
Seals = Taronga's GSO looks good on their informative website, while I haven't seen the definitive plans for Melbourne's $20 million "sea stories" expansion.
Zoo Map = Taronga's is one of the most detailed I've ever seen
Aviary = Melbourne's great flight aviary is massive and very well done
Chimps = Taronga's chimps are what Melbourne might be lacking, as one can hang out and watch those apes forever.
One big drawback to Melbourne is that all of the newer, high-quality exhibits are along one side of the zoo. At that point the visitor thinks that Melbourne is one of the all-time great zoos...only to hit the other side and the hit-and-miss enclosures. Taronga, with all of their new development, just squeaks it as the better establishment. They are both worth many, many more visits.
It was a lot longer ago than that. My last visit to Melbourne and Taronga was about 1990 and there were no chimps at Melbourne by then. It s more like 20 years or even more? It was a good move though.
I saw them in the Ape grottoes- they were already quite a big group by then. Presumably they'd had old cages before the grottoes though?
Glad to hear that. Can't open the document(my computer is on the way out I think...) but its good to hear they are planning it this way allowing for splitting them and also they will be able to see the main group too- that's very good. It sounds like Motaba may not tolerate Yakini later on. Some batchelor groups have had problems with males fighting. Seems like Melbourne have been advised properly over this...
ohhh two silverbacks fighting!!!! (i secretly wanna see that!)
i'm sure the chimps were there when i was in early high school, how long ago was that? bout 16 years ago......
they had them in the grottoes - one grotto for chimps, one for orangutans and two for bulluman/betsy and rigo/yuska.
apparently a pretty world-class great ape exhibit when it first opened...
i'm sure the chimps were there when i was in early high school, how long ago was that? bout 16 years ago......
they had them in the grottoes - one grotto for chimps, one for orangutans and two for bulluman/betsy and rigo/yuska.
apparently a pretty world-class great ape exhibit when it first opened...
I've got some photos somewhere of two silverbacks fighting at Basle zoo- they are standing bipedally and slapping and biting at each other.
There was a TV zoo programme which showed my namesake Pertinax - the only silverback in the Paignton batchelor group- being mixed for the first time with a younger male who didn't defer to him- he gave him a real beating and all hell let loose among the group as the other young males defended the youner one, with screaming, fur flying etc.
(Male) Gorillas can inflict ugly wounds on each other using their canine teeth. One of the batchelor silverbacks at Port Lympne had his mouth ripped open to the cheek by another male- so much for 'gentle giants'!!! A female at Bristol had her elbow gashed wide open by a new male- it was horrible to look at for a while. These nasty wounds can heal quite rapidly.
Melbourne Chimps. My first visit was in 1984. I saw the chimps in the grottoes then. My next visit was about 1991. They had gone by then...
Amazing how our conceptions of 'world class' exhibits changes eh?
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