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I genuinely think it’s more likely Disney gets pandas than the Smithsonian gets to keep theirs lol. One of them is on much better terms with the CCP than the other.

EDIT: To be clear, I also don’t think Disney is likely to get pandas as they’ve never publicly expressed any interest.
 
D2K4 said:
Just read on the Memphis Zoo Facebook page that the current giant panda loan agreement with the Chinese Association of Zoological Gardens that was set to end next year will not be renewed and their giant pandas, Ya Ya and Le Le will be returning to China.
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I was there a couple months ago, and a keeper told me this was probably going to happen. She also said that China considers pandas to be Chinese citizens. These two have been here for 20 years and China wants them returned to live out their remaining years on Chinese soil. At that time she was unsure if they would be replaced due to the political situation, but was hopeful they would be, and said the Memphis Zoo was working hard to make it happen.
 
A lot of their return will be based on what FedEx wants to do. They were the main backer and mode a transportation. If FedEx doesn't have much interest, their return is doubtful
 
PSO said:
A lot of their return will be based on what FedEx wants to do. They were the main backer and mode a transportation. If FedEx doesn't have much interest, their return is doubtful
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You're saying that an international shipping company - who has no say in the permitting process or ownership of the animals - can somehow torpedo the transfer of them back to China, just because they shipped them in the first place and for whatever reason, likes pandas?

They'll return to China regardless of what FedEx wants.
 
RetiredToTheZoo said:
I was there a couple months ago, and a keeper told me this was probably going to happen. She also said that China considers pandas to be Chinese citizens. These two have been here for 20 years and China wants them returned to live out their remaining years on Chinese soil. At that time she was unsure if they would be replaced due to the political situation, but was hopeful they would be, and said the Memphis Zoo was working hard to make it happen.
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I was also going to say, these extensions have happened numerous times and that near the end of their lives, China will want these bears to pass away in China at the Research Center - not in some far away country. So while it may appear political, the Memphis pair and DC pair are old, so it makes sense their lease (both sets extended multiple times) are returning home.

I also have a colleague who works with the panda pair in Memphis and they have also stated that the Zoo are working hard to bring a new pair back to Tennessee.
 
NAIB Volunteer said:
You're saying that an international shipping company - who has no say in the permitting process or ownership of the animals - can somehow torpedo the transfer of them back to China, just because they shipped them in the first place and for whatever reason, likes pandas?

They'll return to China regardless of what FedEx wants.
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I think he's saying it the other way around. As in, if FedEx has no interest to shipping new animals back to the US, it won't happen. This is a somewhat equally ridiculous claim to make, as there will be someone willing to transport the bears even if FedEx doesn't want that business anymore for some reason. I don't know of any exclusive contract FedEx has between the US and Chinese governments involving panda transports, though.

~Thylo
 
Cat-Man said:
If this is largely political (I don’t think there’s any doubt this is the case) then there is no way the CCP will allow another pair of Panda’s to go to the national zoo of the United States. I know I’m speculating but it does seem there won’t be any more Panda’s in America for a while.
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I disagree that this is political and think it's more just timing. Memphis and DC pairs have had their lease extended multiple times for over 20 years. Under the lease agreement, the pairs would return to China towards the end of their lives and here we are. Out of the four Zoos in the US who has or had pandas, National would be in the strongest position and most likely to succeed in acquiring another pair. Unlike Memphis and San Diego which gave more open ended statements about pandas returning, National has been more forthright stating a new pair would return to DC.
 
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Your missing the first part I said. Shipping was the publicity (like UPS with Atlanta). Of course being the transport doesn't determine a thing. They were the backers financially!!!! Every US panda holder had/has someone footing the bill. DC=U.S. Government, Atlanta=too many to name plus government influence, Memphis=FedEx, SDZ=the largest annual budget for a zoological facility with the exception of Disney.
 
PSO said:
Your missing the first part I said. Shipping was the publicity (like UPS with Atlanta). Of course being the transport doesn't determine a thing. They were the backers financially!!!! Every US panda holder had/has someone footing the bill. DC=U.S. Government, Atlanta=too many to name plus government influence, Memphis=FedEx, SDZ=the largest annual budget for a zoological facility with the exception of Disney.
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Yeah, but they'll return to China regardless. I don't understand your point that their return depends on FedEx. Nothing on their return to China will have anything to do with the financial backing of FedEx. They do not hold the exclusive rights to transport the pandas. While they have sponsored or donated transportation services in the past for high profile animals, the Zoo would foot the bill if no donor stepped up to pay for the transfer and would use any number of shipping companies to complete the transfer.
 
Money and political influence talks @NAIB Volunteer

Again I very much know the in and outs of keeping Giant pandas. Of course the current pandas will return to China. Heck they never reproduced. And the donor at Memphis was FedEx not just the transportation. If you didn't know as well FedEx headquarters is in Memphis
 
PSO said:
Money and political influence talks @NAIB Volunteer

Again I very much know the in and outs of keeping Giant pandas. Of course the current pandas will return to China. Heck they never reproduced. And the donor at Memphis was FedEx not just the transportation. If you didn't know as well FedEx headquarters is in Memphis
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I still don't understand your point, but I'll leave it at that to keep this forum for Zoo news.
 
Fair enough, again don't want to see them leave but I understand. Personally want to see the China theme going at Memphis
 
Persephone said:
I genuinely think it’s more likely Disney gets pandas than the Smithsonian gets to keep theirs lol. One of them is on much better terms with the CCP than the other.

EDIT: To be clear, I also don’t think Disney is likely to get pandas as they’ve never publicly expressed any interest.
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While it is embarassing that Disney has been so supportive of the Chinese Communist Party, the feeling is not mutual - many of Disney's biggest releases since the pandemic period have been being blocked in the country and China has been pivoting back to emphasizing donestic releases at the box office. They seem to be moving on.

Good riddance to pandas in the US in any case. I expect Atlanta will be next.
 
Corangurilla said:
Ok, what is the deal with the panda slander (or "slanda") here? Why are so many people here happy that pandas are getting the heave-ho?
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It's expensive for a zoo to house pandas, since the CCP loans them out for upwards of 1 million dollar (the number in one of the Memphis articles was 1.1 million). And that number is per year, so we're talking an expensive continual expense for the zoo. This alone is a huge financial burden on zoos interested in pandas, so many feel zoos are better off spending that money on different species instead or on other projects that better the zoo (i.e. new exhibits). Furthermore, and this is probably the bigger point for most of us "slandah-ers", that money is going to the Chinese Communist Party. There is little oversight into where this money is going once in China, so many of us are uncomfortable with the idea of zoos sending money to an oppressive government to do whatever they want with. Giant pandas in zoos is a way more political topic than any other zoo animal is, so really it boils down to what someone's views on foreign policy and China are. Getting pandas is a way more complex and delicate situation (some like myself would argue unethical also) than just about any other animal species.
 
Neil chace said:
It's expensive for a zoo to house pandas, since the CCP loans them out for upwards of 1 million dollar (the number in one of the Memphis articles was 1.1 million). And that number is per year, so we're talking an expensive continual expense for the zoo. This alone is a huge financial burden on zoos interested in pandas, so many feel zoos are better off spending that money on different species instead or on other projects that better the zoo (i.e. new exhibits). Furthermore, and this is probably the bigger point for most of us "slandah-ers", that money is going to the Chinese Communist Party. There is little oversight into where this money is going once in China, so many of us are uncomfortable with the idea of zoos sending money to an oppressive government to do whatever they want with. Giant pandas in zoos is a way more political topic than any other zoo animal is, so really it boils down to what someone's views on foreign policy and China are. Getting pandas is a way more complex and delicate situation (some like myself would argue unethical also) than just about any other animal species.
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I hate that you're right and I wish this wasn't the case.
 
NAIB Volunteer said:
I disagree that this is political and think it's more just timing. Memphis and DC pairs have had their lease extended multiple times for over 20 years. Under the lease agreement, the pairs would return to China towards the end of their lives and here we are. Out of the four Zoos in the US who has or had pandas, National would be in the strongest position and most likely to succeed in acquiring another pair. Unlike Memphis and San Diego which gave more open ended statements about pandas returning, National has been more forthright stating a new pair would return to DC.
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I’ll accept the first part, but if another pair isn’t obtained and it isn’t due to cost then I think we can say with a degree of certainty it’s political.

San Diego clearly has the resources to obtain another pair of Pandas, and they were the zoos star attraction. So why has the exhibit been empty for three years?
 
I do not think the zoo will put the red pandas in the former panda exhibit but can be proven wrong. They have a pair in cat country and another pair in a recently renovated exhibit behind the langurs in the China exhibit. They can easily move the pair over to where the pandas are but they recently (like within the last year and a half) made the exhibit behind the langurs specifically for red pandas.
 
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