North American Asian and African Elephant Populations: Discussion and Speculation

Can anyone confirm if the Tulsa, Oklahoma zoo has a younger cow named asha from Ringling? I know asha from OKC zoo was there for a time so this is a different asha.

If this is true then hopefully Sneezy will have a chance to pass down his genetics. He has no living offspring as far I know.

Thanks.
 
ZCChip said:
Can anyone confirm if the Tulsa, Oklahoma zoo has a younger cow named asha from Ringling? I know asha from OKC zoo was there for a time so this is a different asha.

If this is true then hopefully Sneezy will have a chance to pass down his genetics. He has no living offspring as far I know.

Thanks.
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Ringling’s Asha was at Tulsa for a while but she returned to Ringling a few years back. She should be at White Oak with her many half-sisters now. Sneezy and Asha did not produce any calves unfortunately… I fear he may never have any surviving calves but Tulsa is building a new habitat so perhaps they’ll bring in some breeding cows once it opens. Asha is also roughly 20 years old and hasn’t had any calves yet so I’m really hoping that she’s pregnant or that White Oak will bring the bulls in and get her and the rest of the breeding cows pregnant.
 
ZCChip said:
Can anyone confirm if the Tulsa, Oklahoma zoo has a younger cow named asha from Ringling? I know asha from OKC zoo was there for a time so this is a different asha.

If this is true then hopefully Sneezy will have a chance to pass down his genetics. He has no living offspring as far I know.

Thanks.
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Asha is now at White oak Conservation she is the daughter to Charlie and Alana
 
https://www.syracuse.com/news/2022/...d-gifford-zoo-is-pregnant.html?outputType=amp

Well, it’s been confirmed that Mali at the Rosamond Gifford Zoo is pregnant and is due this fall in 2022. I recently learned from @Hyak_II who’s a very credible source I understand correctly has said Belle at Fort Worth Zoo is almost certainly pregnant. There’s 2-3 females pregnant at Lion Country Safari in Canada, and then additional females that he can’t say but are not too hard to guess.

I also heard a while back Columbus was trying to acquire a new Asian Elephant bull but I don’t know if that’s still case or not. Anyways here’s who I speculate of Asian Elephant females that are currently pregnant in the US

Confirmed pregnancies
Mali - Rosamond Gifford Zoo and due in fall 2022.

Most likely pregnant
Belle - Fort Worth Zoo
Rose Tu - Oregon Zoo
Shanti? - Houston Zoo

Unlikely pregnant
Rudy - Columbus Zoo
Sunny - Columbus Zoo
Rani - Saint Louis Zoo
Maliha - Saint Louis Zoo
Jade - Saint Louis Zoo
Priya - Saint Louis Zoo
Rosanna - Albuquerque Zoo

curious what the rest of you think but that’s my opinion anyway.
 
John Marchwick said:
https://www.syracuse.com/news/2022/...d-gifford-zoo-is-pregnant.html?outputType=amp

Well, it’s been confirmed that Mali at the Rosamond Gifford Zoo is pregnant and is due this fall in 2022. I recently learned from @Hyak_II who’s a very credible source I understand correctly has said Belle at Fort Worth Zoo is almost certainly pregnant. There’s 2-3 females pregnant at Lion Country Safari in Canada, and then additional females that he can’t say but are not too hard to guess.

I also heard a while back Columbus was trying to acquire a new Asian Elephant bull but I don’t know if that’s still case or not. Anyways here’s who I speculate of Asian Elephant females that are currently pregnant in the US

Confirmed pregnancies
Mali - Rosamond Gifford Zoo and due in fall 2022.

Most likely pregnant
Belle - Fort Worth Zoo
Rose Tu - Oregon Zoo
Shanti? - Houston Zoo

Unlikely pregnant
Rudy - Columbus Zoo
Sunny - Columbus Zoo
Rani - Saint Louis Zoo
Maliha - Saint Louis Zoo
Jade - Saint Louis Zoo
Priya - Saint Louis Zoo
Rosanna - Albuquerque Zoo

curious what the rest of you think but that’s my opinion anyway.
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Well about Columbus, they would have to move at least Beco out in order to bring in a second bull. Unless they can use Beco on Rudy and Sunny. He is 13 so it’s possible he can breed them.

who is Frankie’s sire? I do not see an announcement on this anywhere. He will be one year old this month.
 
ZCChip said:
Well about Columbus, they would have to move at least Beco out in order to bring in a second bull. Unless they can use Beco on Rudy and Sunny. He is 13 so it’s possible he can breed them.

who is Frankie’s sire? I do not see an announcement on this anywhere. He will be one year old this month.
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Beco to my understanding has been unsuccessful in breeding with Sunny and Rudy and Frankie’s sire is Hank.
 
ZCChip said:
Well about Columbus, they would have to move at least Beco out in order to bring in a second bull. Unless they can use Beco on Rudy and Sunny. He is 13 so it’s possible he can breed them.
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He should be able to breed the girls and has been trying, but I think they’re wanting another bull for genetic diversity since Beco comes from a very well represented line and his mom Phoebe is already breeding at the zoo.

ZCChip said:
who is Frankie’s sire? I do not see an announcement on this anywhere. He will be one year old this month.
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His sire is Hank via artificial insemination since Hank’s a behavioral non-breeder. This has been mentioned a few times on here iirc. He’s turning 1 tomorrow :)
 
@IndianRhino i want to ask hot because you seem to know a lot and are a very insightful person but elephant breeding wise in the United States does it seem to you that a lot more Asian elephants are breeding or is that just my imagination?
 
John Marchwick said:
@IndianRhino i want to ask hot because you seem to know a lot and are a very insightful person but elephant breeding wise in the United States does it seem to you that a lot more Asian elephants are breeding or is that just my imagination?
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Thanks, I’ve learned a lot from some of the more experienced zoochatters in the elephant threads :)

I think the population is doing fairly well in terms of breeding and has potential. Management could be better though since zoos like STL are left without suitable breeding bulls and cows aren’t bred till their late teens, etc. 2021 was a good year for Asian elephant births and hopefully 2022 will be as well (we’ve got one calf and a pregnancy so far, hopefully we get a few more calves/pregnancies before the end of the year). EEHV is also a really big problem that’s preventing zoos from sustaining the population but I’m hoping this won’t be as much of an issue going into the future with Chester trialing a vaccine.
 
IndianRhino said:
Thanks, I’ve learned a lot from some of the more experienced zoochatters in the elephant threads :)

I think the population is doing fairly well in terms of breeding and has potential. Management could be better though since zoos like STL are left without suitable breeding bulls and cows aren’t bred till their late teens, etc. 2021 was a good year for Asian elephant births and hopefully 2022 will be as well (we’ve got one calf and a pregnancy so far, hopefully we get a few more calves/pregnancies before the end of the year). EEHV is also a really big problem that’s preventing zoos from sustaining the population but I’m hoping this won’t be as much of an issue going into the future with Chester trialing a vaccine.
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Personally, I find Saint Louis Zoo the biggest issue management wise for Asian elephants in the US. I don’t understand why they can’t just get rid of Raja and bring in a new bull? Columbus seems to acknowledge in doing something about Rudy and Sunny needing to breed ASAP based off of what I heard but I know speaking of Asian elephant breeding that Achara is turning 8 this year at the Oklahoma City Zoo and I heard the moment she does turn 8 Oklahoma City Zoo intends to start breeding her immediately in the near future and when I mean near future I mean this upcoming year. Is the zoo breeding her with Kandula by chance?
 
John Marchwick said:
Is the zoo breeding her with Kandula by chance?
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I emailed the zoo about this a few months ago and was told they were going to wait till she is a little older to breed her. But yes, the plan is to breed all 3 of Asha’s daughters to Kandula once they’re old enough.

RhinoHippoElephantGiraffe said:
Maliha - Saint Louis Zoo
Jade - Saint Louis Zoo
Priya - Saint Louis Zoo
@John Marchwick I highly doubt that any of these three are pregnant, as the only male at the Saint Louis Zoo is their dad, Raja.
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That’s why they’re in the “Unlikely Pregnant” section ;)

There is a small chance STL has AI’d those girls since they probably wouldn’t want to send their precious Raja out to another zoo.
 
IndianRhino said:
I emailed the zoo about this a few months ago and was told they were going to wait till she is a little older to breed her. But yes, the plan is to breed all 3 of Asha’s daughters to Kandula once they’re old enough.


That’s why they’re in the “Unlikely Pregnant” section ;)

There is a small chance STL has AI’d those girls since they probably wouldn’t want to send their precious Raja out to another zoo.
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that makes sense regarding the breeding situation with Oklahoma. If I recall Kandula genetic wise is valuable on his mothers side but his father side is not so much. I mean Achara is still 7 so it makes sense why they want to wait a bit. Achara though I do know when I did reach out to Oklahoma City Zoo they told me next year or two for sure they will start breeding her with Kandula. They were very honest with me anyway about how critical it is to breed Asian Elephants when they’re young and first hit sexual maturity.
 
I highly doubt STL is even breeding anymore. Their exhibit is a bit too small at least from what I have seen from several years ago. If they seriously wish to breed they need to send out Sri, Donna, Pearl and Raja.
 
ZCChip said:
I highly doubt STL is even breeding anymore. Their exhibit is a bit too small at least from what I have seen from several years ago. If they seriously wish to breed they need to send out Sri, Donna, Pearl and Raja.
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Raja should join a bachelor heard considering he has no genetic value whatsoever. Pearl, Donna and Sri I’d sent maybe to the San Diego Zoo and then a new bull I’d sent to Saint Louis Zoo would be Tucker who’s currently at the Houston Zoo, Samudara who’s currently at the Oregon Zoo, and maybe even Billy who’s currently at the Los Angeles Zoo to breed with Rani, Maliha, Jade, and Priya. I’m gonna reach out to Saint Louis Zoo today to see if they’re still breeding their elephants or not. They just had a calf born 2 years ago but it died a month later after it was born.
 
John Marchwick said:
Raja should join a bachelor heard considering he has no genetic value whatsoever. Pearl, Donna and Sri I’d sent maybe to the San Diego Zoo and then a new bull I’d sent to Saint Louis Zoo would be Tucker who’s currently at the Houston Zoo, Samudara who’s currently at the Oregon Zoo, and maybe even Billy who’s currently at the Los Angeles Zoo to breed with Rani, Maliha, Jade, and Priya. I’m gonna reach out to Saint Louis Zoo today to see if they’re still breeding their elephants or not. They just had a calf born 2 years ago but it died a month later after it was born.
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San Diego zoo is supposed to be moving away from Asian Elephants seeing as the SSP and AZA are wanting to move away from Asian/African mixed herds. So I doubt they'd go there. If anything St Louis would send them to a facility for "retirement" like Phoenix or Audubon.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see Tucker remain at Houston seeing as he is unrelated to any female calf Shanti has and would make breeding her offspring inexpensive since AI wouldn't be required. I could see one of the other males going but not him.

I personally would just do a bull swap with Columbus, Beco goes to St Louis and Raja to Columbus. St Louis gets the younger cows bred and Columbus gets a proven male for Sunny Rudy and even Phoebe if they wanted to spice it up a bit.
 
NOVAElephantEnthusiast said:
San Diego zoo is supposed to be moving away from Asian Elephants seeing as the SSP and AZA are wanting to move away from Asian/African mixed herds. So I doubt they'd go there. If anything St Louis would send them to a facility for "retirement" like Phoenix or Audubon.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see Tucker remain at Houston seeing as he is unrelated to any female calf Shanti has and would make breeding her offspring inexpensive since AI wouldn't be required. I could see one of the other males going but not him.

I personally would just do a bull swap with Columbus, Beco goes to St Louis and Raja to Columbus. St Louis gets the younger cows bred and Columbus gets a proven male for Sunny Rudy and even Phoebe if they wanted to spice it up a bit.
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Phoenix is phasing out of elephants (first hand information here as I know the manager). They are moving into Indian rhinos and already have a male.

Columbus does seem to be realistic and close enough.
 
NOVAElephantEnthusiast said:
San Diego zoo is supposed to be moving away from Asian Elephants seeing as the SSP and AZA are wanting to move away from Asian/African mixed herds. So I doubt they'd go there. If anything St Louis would send them to a facility for "retirement" like Phoenix or Audubon.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see Tucker remain at Houston seeing as he is unrelated to any female calf Shanti has and would make breeding her offspring inexpensive since AI wouldn't be required. I could see one of the other males going but not him.

I personally would just do a bull swap with Columbus, Beco goes to St Louis and Raja to Columbus. St Louis gets the younger cows bred and Columbus gets a proven male for Sunny Rudy and even Phoebe if they wanted to spice it up a bit.
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I never thought about that Columbus and Saint Louis swap but that actually makes the most sense. I thought Beco was somehow related to Jade, Pryia and Maliha through his mothers side but if he’s not than I think that’s a great idea. I know Columbus is trying to get a new bull at least that’s what I heard a while back anyways.

Tucker could stay at the Houston Zoo however Shanti only has 1 daughter that Tucker can breed with and that’s Joy. I’ve heard a suggestion what Houston could do anyways is sent Shanti and Joy to the Smithsonian National Zoo, have Baylor, Duncan and eventually Nelson when he’s older go to the Phoenix Zoo and create a bachelor herd there while Winnie, Tess, Tupelo, Tilly, Mai Thai, and Thailand stay at the Houston Zoo considering that herd is multi generational and Tucker be sent to another AZA facility to breed.
 
ZCChip said:
Phoenix is phasing out of elephants (first hand information here as I know the manager). They are moving into Indian rhinos and already have a male.

Columbus does seem to be realistic and close enough.
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I didn’t know Phoenix Zoo was phasing out Asian Elephants. You know realistically speaking there is still one facility that could maybe hold some of these bachelors and that’s the Los Angeles Zoo potentially. If I’m not mistaken the Los Angeles can hold more elephants than they have now correct?
 
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