If you wanted to stick to an African grassland theme you could easily have a mixture. A large Werribee stle paddock for the hoofstock that could incorportate a bus ride then a walking trail that would incorporate the carnivores (including fennec foxes and servals), primates (baboon, vervets) and small animals (meerkats).
Perth Zoo Open Plains Zoo for Perth???
- Thread starter Jaywa
- Start date
most people love the safari-bus concept, so its not something i would exclude from a modern open range zoo, even though the 'do it at your own pace" style sits better with me personally.
i agree with jason, that a combination is what works best.
personally the temptation for me would be to be to also have a river safari, where you can view elephants and hippos and other species from the confines of a submerged cable running boat.
i agree with jason, that a combination is what works best.
personally the temptation for me would be to be to also have a river safari, where you can view elephants and hippos and other species from the confines of a submerged cable running boat.
I adore the concept of an "open-range" zoo, but as I've said on here before (and many have agreed) it is somehow much more difficult to spend an inordinate amount of time at such an establishment. For example: Monarto Zoo near Adelaide has an hour long bus tour...and then there isn't a lot else to see. One can now disembark at scheduled stops and get a closer look at some animal species (ie: giraffe) but there is clearly not enough "go at your own pace" exhibits. The tour is too short and doesn't give enough time for someone to hang around and view the lions, hyenas, cheetahs, etc.
It is vital that any open-range collection has lots of walking trails for those that are true fans of taking the time to view the animals. An hour long ride in a bus with tourists means that sometimes exhibits are passed in literally seconds, without even a pause or being able to come to a full stop. The San Diego Wild Animal Park was a tad frustrating to visit, as inside the monorail car a visitor appears to be so far away from the action. However, they also have a number of lengthy walking trails to satisfy hardcore zoo fans who wish to get up close and personal with typical zoo exhibits.
It is vital that any open-range collection has lots of walking trails for those that are true fans of taking the time to view the animals. An hour long ride in a bus with tourists means that sometimes exhibits are passed in literally seconds, without even a pause or being able to come to a full stop. The San Diego Wild Animal Park was a tad frustrating to visit, as inside the monorail car a visitor appears to be so far away from the action. However, they also have a number of lengthy walking trails to satisfy hardcore zoo fans who wish to get up close and personal with typical zoo exhibits.
ZYBen
Well-Known Member
All that is planned!
@ZooYouthBen: I seem to remember that you are a massive fan of Monarto, and love spending hours and hours at the zoo. Hopefully there will be some more boardwalks constructed that allow visitors to amble along at their own pace, snapping photos and taking it easy as they venture along raised platforms. I realize that the brand new chimpanzee exhibit will have viewing platforms for the public.
The bus ride would be good if you could do it more than once. There is a huge difference in your enjoyment depending on how full, the typre of people and the time of the trip. I will never forget a trip to Werribee that had a bunch of old women on it and the entire time they all gossiped loudly and all at the same time about grand children, other holidays, illnesss' etc and not one of them took a bit of notice of the wildlife, fair ruined my tour. I could see what that particular trip was going to be like but had no choice but to go on it.
I like Pats idea of the river trip. Wouldn't it be great iff we could get together and design Perths OPZ for them. I think there would be some great ideas.
I like Pats idea of the river trip. Wouldn't it be great iff we could get together and design Perths OPZ for them. I think there would be some great ideas.
a boat ride could be ultra-cool i reckon.
submerged walls, stopping just shy of the surface could create the illusion that bathing elephants and hippo are sharing the same water as the boats, with no barriers.
it would also be a great place to view other animals from, with monkey islands and waterbirds all potential candidates for being featured on the "river safari"
another cool idea would be to have a train (or bus i guess) that features "stations". thus one could get out at each themed station (i'm imagining one for each different geographic precinct) and wander around looking at smaller animals on trails as well as viewing the larger savannah inhabitants before resuming the safari, through the animal paddocks to the next area. no ticket, just line up and jump onboard the looping train/buses.
a old faux steam train train could be particularly fun.
submerged walls, stopping just shy of the surface could create the illusion that bathing elephants and hippo are sharing the same water as the boats, with no barriers.
it would also be a great place to view other animals from, with monkey islands and waterbirds all potential candidates for being featured on the "river safari"
another cool idea would be to have a train (or bus i guess) that features "stations". thus one could get out at each themed station (i'm imagining one for each different geographic precinct) and wander around looking at smaller animals on trails as well as viewing the larger savannah inhabitants before resuming the safari, through the animal paddocks to the next area. no ticket, just line up and jump onboard the looping train/buses.
a old faux steam train train could be particularly fun.
OK, I can see we will have to form a board of some description and present our thoughts on paper formally to the Minister before going to press in the West Australian and announcing to the public what they can expect. It is so great to feel the excitement coming off the forum - the Minister was clearly excited at the thought!
Currumbin Sanctuary has a similar thing to this idea and it works really well. Also i beleive The Australia Zoo has am open sided bus that does the same thing?
If they had enough space i think that the ultimate zoo would have Melbournes asia trail but with enough space for Malayan Tapirs and clouded leopard, Werribees african savanah but with some viewing that you don't need to be on the bus, an african rainforest with herds of bongo and congo buffalo (ever since a read it in another post i fell in love with it), a great open range australia section like werribees but with a few more species and maybe a south american section 'cos it has so many cool animals but is always overlooked.
And it's not like they would have any trouble getting any orang-utans from perth.
And it's not like they would have any trouble getting any orang-utans from perth.
i think, realistically, that an open range zoo for Western Australia is some decades away yet. particularly a Government funded venture as this forum is suggesting.
Perth Zoo is quite unique in that its actually, to me, rather undeveloped. the whole zoo is superb, and on the whole the enclosures are amazing, but with no steep hillsides and heritage listed building dotting the site, many of these enclosures could be expanded upon.
the asian elephant encloure, for instance, could possibly be doubled or even tripled in size by enlarging it up the hill towards the sunbears/tigers. theres the massive primate lake at the start of the zoo, where gorillas are slated to go, and the african savannah could still be expanded into the world of birds/primate sections. the Australian section is also incredibly spacious and again could be developed more.
if Perth Zoo ever needs an open range counterpart, i suspect it wont stem from space concerns but rahter commercial reasons. such as urban spread resulting in declining visitation.
for those who find my comments to be a bit damp, visit Perth Zoo for yourselves. for now, investing in the city site to keep it as one of the worlds best small zoos is a sensible option.
Perth Zoo is quite unique in that its actually, to me, rather undeveloped. the whole zoo is superb, and on the whole the enclosures are amazing, but with no steep hillsides and heritage listed building dotting the site, many of these enclosures could be expanded upon.
the asian elephant encloure, for instance, could possibly be doubled or even tripled in size by enlarging it up the hill towards the sunbears/tigers. theres the massive primate lake at the start of the zoo, where gorillas are slated to go, and the african savannah could still be expanded into the world of birds/primate sections. the Australian section is also incredibly spacious and again could be developed more.
if Perth Zoo ever needs an open range counterpart, i suspect it wont stem from space concerns but rahter commercial reasons. such as urban spread resulting in declining visitation.
for those who find my comments to be a bit damp, visit Perth Zoo for yourselves. for now, investing in the city site to keep it as one of the worlds best small zoos is a sensible option.
apparently all gone. they were only wild in a small area of WA from memory and probably died out in the late 80's early 90's.
why thankyou, because that was i that that made the suggestion. as a teenager i opened and issue of NG to discover that in the heart of africa were massive swampy clearings where herds of bongo and congo buffalo shared space with gorillas, elephants, red river hogs etc..
ever since i have wished to see taronga/dubbo put their bongo and buffalo together.
another reason why its highly unlikely Perth Zoo needs an open range zoo is that there are no overriding issues of space with species they already have. currently Perth Zoo has no antelopes on display and almost all of the animals people on this forum are suggesting arent part of their collection plan.
one of the primary reasons WPZ, Weribee and Monarto were created was to alleviate problems of overcrowding. the commercial imperatives driving the expansion of the latter two in particular are relatively recent events.
one of the primary reasons WPZ, Weribee and Monarto were created was to alleviate problems of overcrowding. the commercial imperatives driving the expansion of the latter two in particular are relatively recent events.
Wow Glyn!!! If I didn't know better, I would say you were on the Perth's payroll??? No need to be so defensive - I am not asking for Perth Zoo to be levelled. I did pass your comments by a current keeper and volunteer from the zoo and both were blown away by your perspective of this block of land as being sooooo huge! not to mention the plans for increasing the size of the exhibits. They believe alot of the animals would end up in the Swan River! You seem to know so much??? Even future government plans??? Wow!! You know, instead of revisiting the same old zoos all over the world, why not try the zoo in Dubai, or the Alexandria Zoo in Egypt, maybe even the struggling Bali zoo and offer your suggestions as to what they can do?? Meanwhile, along with the elephant keepers at Perth and the majority of visitors - we will never stop pushing for better conditions for these large animals. See what Patrick has to say about elephants in city zoos - Big Animals in City Zoos 14.12.07.
wow jaywa, im sorry for seeing defensive, maybe im naive and an open range zoo can actually be started by pressuring ministers into it.....
if i did hope to seem anything its realistic. in my first post i said i feel an open range zoo for WA seems a few decades away, between ten and twenty years to be exact. the current masterplan has indicated that within the life of the plan an open range counterpart may be needed, but this would stem from the needs of the zoo itself; operational and commercial, obviously government funding and on a wider scale regional management strategies for the exotic animals slated for such a development.
i am familiar with the perth zoo site, and whilst i didnt suggest that it was huge i do maintain that extensive and very central areas of the zoo are relatively underutilised, without elements of lasting value or massive investment and could be developed without disrupting visitor circulation and operational capacity and extend the sites functionality for many years to come.
many of the animals you have expressed disquiet about are, as im sure you are aware as you seem incredibly familiar with the zoo and its plans, due for new enclosures in the next few years. this would be a happy occurrence, dependent upon funding naturally. wait to see if this funding materialises. if it does, than long-term funding may be forthcoming. historically, of course, Perth Zoo like the majority of our state run zoos, has enjoyed only sporadic bouts of funding and given the zoos recent financial situations will obviously be dependent on such funding and capital allocation for an open range zoo.
i dont get your comments about the world zoo thing....but as you seem to think that all you need to do is ambush planning ministers at unis and forward comments from an internet based forum to keepers and volunteers to get something happening im sure to take this advice on board. and finally, as a member of this forum for three years, i am well aware of Patricks perspecitves on a number of issues. in fact id go so far as to say i know pretty much what hes going to say 99% of the time. and i agree with 99% of what he has to say. but i dont think he has ever accused me of being defensive. a tad rational at times though
good luck with your plans Jaywa.
if i did hope to seem anything its realistic. in my first post i said i feel an open range zoo for WA seems a few decades away, between ten and twenty years to be exact. the current masterplan has indicated that within the life of the plan an open range counterpart may be needed, but this would stem from the needs of the zoo itself; operational and commercial, obviously government funding and on a wider scale regional management strategies for the exotic animals slated for such a development.
i am familiar with the perth zoo site, and whilst i didnt suggest that it was huge i do maintain that extensive and very central areas of the zoo are relatively underutilised, without elements of lasting value or massive investment and could be developed without disrupting visitor circulation and operational capacity and extend the sites functionality for many years to come.
many of the animals you have expressed disquiet about are, as im sure you are aware as you seem incredibly familiar with the zoo and its plans, due for new enclosures in the next few years. this would be a happy occurrence, dependent upon funding naturally. wait to see if this funding materialises. if it does, than long-term funding may be forthcoming. historically, of course, Perth Zoo like the majority of our state run zoos, has enjoyed only sporadic bouts of funding and given the zoos recent financial situations will obviously be dependent on such funding and capital allocation for an open range zoo.
i dont get your comments about the world zoo thing....but as you seem to think that all you need to do is ambush planning ministers at unis and forward comments from an internet based forum to keepers and volunteers to get something happening im sure to take this advice on board. and finally, as a member of this forum for three years, i am well aware of Patricks perspecitves on a number of issues. in fact id go so far as to say i know pretty much what hes going to say 99% of the time. and i agree with 99% of what he has to say. but i dont think he has ever accused me of being defensive. a tad rational at times though
good luck with your plans Jaywa.
Ambushing (???) ministers by asking for a sister zoo at an open forum the Minister requested the public attend??? Come, come now Glyn, get your emotions under control. The worldwide thing? Were you not the one telling us all about all the zoos you intended visiting at one stage? Yeah, you are obviously in a position to travel the world and update yourself on the next concrete box being created wherever - why not spread your vast knowledge around to the zoos where they are shooting animals because they can't afford to feed them - offer up all your worldly knowledge. But then again you may have commitments within the zoo industry? How about that. A public forum throws out a complaint like the disgusting way the zebra was treated at Werribee and a zoo employee from that zoo who call himself xxxxxxx from Botswana jumps to the defence with the most incredible background story of what he says REALLY happened. Mmmmmmmmmmmmm food for thought.
jaywa, im not really getting where youre headed man.
ive been to perth zoo, in 2006 actually. and i have seen already quite alot of the major european zoos in 2005, from edinburgh to artis, barcelona to rome.
within australia the only major urban zoo ive yet to see is adelaide.
is that what your asking? have i actually been to the zoo im talking about? in this case, Perth?
yes, i have.
in the first place i never attacked your post. all i merely did was offer suggestions as to why such a project is unlikely to materialise in the short term. sorry i expressed an opinion.
ive been to perth zoo, in 2006 actually. and i have seen already quite alot of the major european zoos in 2005, from edinburgh to artis, barcelona to rome.
within australia the only major urban zoo ive yet to see is adelaide.
is that what your asking? have i actually been to the zoo im talking about? in this case, Perth?
yes, i have.
in the first place i never attacked your post. all i merely did was offer suggestions as to why such a project is unlikely to materialise in the short term. sorry i expressed an opinion.
What gave you away Glyn was a couple of things. Firstly, you come across loud and clear as a bean counter - not an animal lover. Zoos are all about animals - we don't love concrete jungles, but we do love the animals and you are the only one that doesn't seem to fit in here with your ideas. Secondly, the bragging about all the information you know - that was easy. Thirdly, I didn't mention to this forum that I had a broken leg and was on crutches the night the Minister spoke. I couldn't get her attention at question time as I was sitting way near the entrance to the door. The only way I could ask her about the second zoo was to put my hand on hers when she passed by and she stopped to listen - that's the ambush you referred to. Don't be shy Glyn, tell us what you do in the Zoological Parks world - we are all ears.
whooooaaa! listen jaywa, you are way, way, waaaay outta line here and i think you best stop on this tangent of yours because its rapidly becoming more offensive and more nonsensical.
this has nothing at all to do with if glyn wants perth to have an open range zoo. this is glyn giving a well-thought out opinion (and quite a realistic one in many senses) as to why its far off happening. it has nothing at all to do with his personal beliefs about how elephants, or any animal for that matter, should be treated and your continuing comments along this line are getting you nowhere.
glyn has given nothing away, nothing except an indication that he is a lot more articulate and rational than you are.