Dr. Loxodonta
Well-Known Member
Paignton’s originally came from Manchester Museum, which imported the wild-caught group from Suriname.
Paignton Zoo Paignton Zoo news 2025
- Thread starter TriUK
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...and given this, alongside the fact that true Atelopus spumarius does not occur in Suriname, being restricted to a tiny patch of Peru, your above post about the animals in question having been genetically-tested and proving to be said taxon cannot be accurate
the undescribed population does fall within the historical highly-polyphyletic classification of spumarius however.However...
Manchester currently keeps a different species, Atelopus varius , having sent the whole Atelopus nov.sp population to Paignton.
Dr. Loxodonta
Well-Known Member
...and given this, alongside the fact that true Atelopus spumarius does not occur in Suriname, being restricted to a tiny patch of Peru, your above post about the animals in question having been genetically-tested and proving to be said taxon cannot be accurate
However...
Manchester currently keeps a different species, Atelopus varius , having sent the whole Atelopus nov.sp population to Paignton.
Thank you for the clarification, that’s very helpful. It seems the historical application of A. spumarius has led to the confusion, especially since its monophyly has beem suggested, while intergeneric, interspecific, and intraspecific relationships within the genus remain poorly understood. I was referencing information provided by keepers, but as you’ve pointed out, such identifications may be unreliable. I appreciate the correction and the additional context.
Typhlonectes
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the clarification TLD, I knew there was more than one Atelopus sp in the country...and given this, alongside the fact that true Atelopus spumarius does not occur in Suriname, being restricted to a tiny patch of Peru, your above post about the animals in question having been genetically-tested and proving to be said taxon cannot be accurate
However...
Manchester currently keeps a different species, Atelopus varius , having sent the whole Atelopus nov.sp population to Paignton.
There's a whole raft of cryptic species nested within the classic spumarius complex; one of those annoying situations where it's known the species exist, where they are located and what they look like, but no one has the time or resources to describe them all - and in the meantime many of them have gone extinct due to chytrid, or are heading that way.
Karlsruhe recently imported a group of one of the other undescribed taxa, the Wampucrum from Ecuador.
I got good viewing of the Giant Toads last week, in the reptile house. They were perched on branches. However, there were so many reptiles that were so hard to spot, as they’ve placed small lizards in huge vivariums. This is great for animal welfare, and sound if you have heaps of patience, but most visitors just walk past and say “there’s nothing in there!!”. A balance is needed, perhaps.
The desert house looks wonderful as a botanic walkthrough, but the porcupine are not a good animal to house in a very bright sunlit enclosure.
The Cassowary chick looks to be doing great, as do the Crowned Crane chicks.
I dearly hope the curators are working to source new zebra, takin and a male Bongo?
I hope the zoo has had good visitor numbers and a good spend per head, but the summer weather may have diverted more families to the bays beaches?
There should be a new CEO arriving soon and hopefully he/she has a budget to work with.
The desert house looks wonderful as a botanic walkthrough, but the porcupine are not a good animal to house in a very bright sunlit enclosure.
The Cassowary chick looks to be doing great, as do the Crowned Crane chicks.
I dearly hope the curators are working to source new zebra, takin and a male Bongo?
I hope the zoo has had good visitor numbers and a good spend per head, but the summer weather may have diverted more families to the bays beaches?
There should be a new CEO arriving soon and hopefully he/she has a budget to work with.
Now I haven't been Paignton for over 35yrs so I don't remember it(only recollection are old photographs) but now the giraffe have access to the old elephant enclosure is it now a huge enclosure or just average?
Could the old elephant enclosure be transformed into accommodating another large species or is it better kept as an extension for the giraffes?
Could the old elephant enclosure be transformed into accommodating another large species or is it better kept as an extension for the giraffes?
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Dr. Loxodonta
Well-Known Member
A couple of days ago, I made my “annual” trip over to Paignton. Despite blue skies on my arrival, as the day progressed the weather turned rather rapidly just after lunch. The zoo was pleasantly busy and there was a well-managed queue outside the entryways.
As I walked up towards the Big Cats, I spotted Carrie lying low in her enclosure, almost perfectly camouflaged. It's a pity she’ll soon be moving to another zoo, but at least her departure may help to rekindle breeding prospects at Paignton. Dao (the 3-year-old male who’s currently still in quarantine) will have a genetically compatible younger female tiger to join him at Paignton. Both cassowaries were visible in their separate enclosures, and the chick was with its father, Madrid. Paignton Zoo’s bird keepers manage the studbook for the cassowary EEP, so this is excellent news that their efforts are paying off, particularly as this is their first successful breeding since 2004. The lions were unsurprisingly out for the count, but it was still nice to see them stretched out in their enclosure.
Just around the corner, by A.B.C, were at least two scarlet ibis chicks. Nearby, in their excellent enclosure, were the bongos. Paignton have their eye out for a breeding male to accompany Ada and Koffi, hopefully leading to some future breeding success.
As I made my way down the slope toward the Ape Islands, Wousan was rather energetically clambering around. The same couldn’t be said for the gorillas, however, as neither Kiondo nor N’dowe were outside (despite the then pleasant sun).
Manyara, their one remaining black rhino, was sleeping for the majority of the day. He has now begun to suffer from arthritis, and consequently only has access to the right-hand indoor enclosure. Up the path, only eight dwarf mongooses (2.6.0) were out, due to one of the young males being recently caught in a fight. It sounds as if the mongoose in question is alright and is undergoing treatment. Also, the potoroo Delilah is now pregnant, and you could even see the joey wriggling inside her pouch.
The construction site of Hamadryas Hills has been opened to walk around, but work has now ceased (hopefully temporarily) due to a lack of funding. Also, there aren’t any current plans to source new zebra, but if (or when) they are obtained they will likely be plains. Nothing on the takin, nor Maisy.
It was delightful to see the Diana monkeys out, especially Akea’s baby. It seems that her ovarian tumour is not cancerous, and consequently not life-threatening but is still being monitored.
Crocodile Swamp was brilliant, and rather warm after a nasty downpour! Inside, the layout was pretty much unchanged, with Spice having access to the first two pools and Lima having access to the last two pools (the land divider was also taken here). There are no plans to get more Sunda gharials, nor more crocodile species whilst the two are held. For anyone currently wondering, the swamp is currently home to:
As I walked up towards the Big Cats, I spotted Carrie lying low in her enclosure, almost perfectly camouflaged. It's a pity she’ll soon be moving to another zoo, but at least her departure may help to rekindle breeding prospects at Paignton. Dao (the 3-year-old male who’s currently still in quarantine) will have a genetically compatible younger female tiger to join him at Paignton. Both cassowaries were visible in their separate enclosures, and the chick was with its father, Madrid. Paignton Zoo’s bird keepers manage the studbook for the cassowary EEP, so this is excellent news that their efforts are paying off, particularly as this is their first successful breeding since 2004. The lions were unsurprisingly out for the count, but it was still nice to see them stretched out in their enclosure.
Just around the corner, by A.B.C, were at least two scarlet ibis chicks. Nearby, in their excellent enclosure, were the bongos. Paignton have their eye out for a breeding male to accompany Ada and Koffi, hopefully leading to some future breeding success.
As I made my way down the slope toward the Ape Islands, Wousan was rather energetically clambering around. The same couldn’t be said for the gorillas, however, as neither Kiondo nor N’dowe were outside (despite the then pleasant sun).
Manyara, their one remaining black rhino, was sleeping for the majority of the day. He has now begun to suffer from arthritis, and consequently only has access to the right-hand indoor enclosure. Up the path, only eight dwarf mongooses (2.6.0) were out, due to one of the young males being recently caught in a fight. It sounds as if the mongoose in question is alright and is undergoing treatment. Also, the potoroo Delilah is now pregnant, and you could even see the joey wriggling inside her pouch.
The construction site of Hamadryas Hills has been opened to walk around, but work has now ceased (hopefully temporarily) due to a lack of funding. Also, there aren’t any current plans to source new zebra, but if (or when) they are obtained they will likely be plains. Nothing on the takin, nor Maisy.
It was delightful to see the Diana monkeys out, especially Akea’s baby. It seems that her ovarian tumour is not cancerous, and consequently not life-threatening but is still being monitored.
Crocodile Swamp was brilliant, and rather warm after a nasty downpour! Inside, the layout was pretty much unchanged, with Spice having access to the first two pools and Lima having access to the last two pools (the land divider was also taken here). There are no plans to get more Sunda gharials, nor more crocodile species whilst the two are held. For anyone currently wondering, the swamp is currently home to:
- Spice, the 16-year-old female Cuban crocodile
- Lima, the 18-year-old female Sunda gharial (who have been present since closure)
- Pierre, a 19-year-old male mangrove monitor lizard
- Biscuit and Basil, 10-year-old pair of northern caiman lizards who live with Dwayne and Billy-Bob, the male yellow-spotted turtles
- Lyra, a 16-year-old reticulated python (unsure where Nagini is, sadly)
Dr. Loxodonta
Well-Known Member
Thank you. Yes, he was trundling around as per usual.
Nagini died some time before October 2018. Lyra has been the occupant since roughly that time - the information sign was inaccurate.
Just to note a few things mentioned.
Takin is off the table for the time being, the deal with Highland Wildlife Park fell through. The Kune Kune pigs are currently in the quarry but soon to be replaced by some Markhor. The pigs house has been repaired and they’ll be going back soon.
We went to a meet the CEO meeting back in July and he said the new baboon enclosure was cancelled. The previous team had started it and the zoo simply couldn’t afford it. He was very upfront that it would have killed the zoo.
Exciting news from the visit today is that they are in talks to get a male giraffe to restart breeding. The keeper we spoke to said she believes one is coming from Whipsnade, but not confirmed yet. (Although looking on their website they have reticulated giraffes, is that doable?).
Lovely to see the baby Cassowary today and to see how big the cranes have got!
Takin is off the table for the time being, the deal with Highland Wildlife Park fell through. The Kune Kune pigs are currently in the quarry but soon to be replaced by some Markhor. The pigs house has been repaired and they’ll be going back soon.
We went to a meet the CEO meeting back in July and he said the new baboon enclosure was cancelled. The previous team had started it and the zoo simply couldn’t afford it. He was very upfront that it would have killed the zoo.
Exciting news from the visit today is that they are in talks to get a male giraffe to restart breeding. The keeper we spoke to said she believes one is coming from Whipsnade, but not confirmed yet. (Although looking on their website they have reticulated giraffes, is that doable?).
Lovely to see the baby Cassowary today and to see how big the cranes have got!
Dr. Loxodonta
Well-Known Member
It's a shame about the baboons, but that was the general impression I gathered from the way the keepers spoke about the situation. On a more positive note, the addition of the markhor will be a welcome one. However, I'm uncertain as to how a giraffe bull could be sourced from Whipsnade, as their herd consists of Reticulated giraffes.
I’ve just looked on their website and realised the same thing. Assuming she had the zoo mixed up. But her and 2 other keepers where very adamant talks are happening to get a bull. Fingers crossed!
Whipsnade do indeed have only Reticulated giraffe so a pointless transfer unless Paignton want to go out of Rothschilds(doubt it though).
Out of the 0:4 giraffe they have left the oldest is 20yrs and the youngest is 8.
Hope the stress of a new arrival doesn't affect the herd especially Janica the oldest
Out of the 0:4 giraffe they have left the oldest is 20yrs and the youngest is 8.
Hope the stress of a new arrival doesn't affect the herd especially Janica the oldest
So how does this news affect Baboon Rock? Hard to imagine Paignton without baboons but the same could be said for a lot of species they’ve lost in recent years.
Markhor will do nicely. Domestic pigs in the quarry was always pretty silly, them not being cliff dwellers n all.
Good news imho about the baboons. I really like Baboon Rock.
Very much so, and probably from HWP.