Spec. Zoo Design questions

[Chlidonias]

Not sure if this is the right thread for this question, but I’ll ask here and hope someone can redirect me if needed.

What is (or is there) the general stance on use of the following in captivity?
- Wild-caught animals
- Animals originating from pets or exotic breeders

I have my own opinions on both, but I was just curious as to whether mine differed from others.

The "general stance" amongst who? Zoochatters? General public? Zoos? AZA zoos? American zoos?

Animals which are pets or come from exotic breeders are in captivity. Are you asking if people think animals should be kept privately?

 

[Van Beal]

The "general stance" amongst who? Zoochatters? General public? Zoos? AZA zoos? American zoos?

Animals which are pets or come from exotic breeders are in captivity. Are you asking if people think animals should be kept privately?

I was looking on the stance of zoochatters. Meanwhile I was a bit unclear with my “captivity” statement. I was referring to zoos specifically, and whether people believed zoos should source their animals via wild individuals or individuals in the pet/private-breeding trades

 

[Mickey]

I was looking on the stance of zoochatters. Meanwhile I was a bit unclear with my “captivity” statement. I was referring to zoos specifically, and whether people believed zoos should source their animals via wild individuals or individuals in the pet/private-breeding trades

If a species is endangered and no animals are present in captivity and a zoo wants to start a conservation/breeding programs they can't exactly conjure them up through magic.
This being any zoo not just western zoos.
Even rescues are wild animals, so they're technically caught but the term changes to rescued/saved depending on the situation, which is objectively correct in my opinion.

 

[Chlidonias]

I was looking on the stance of zoochatters. Meanwhile I was a bit unclear with my “captivity” statement. I was referring to zoos specifically, and whether people believed zoos should source their animals via wild individuals or individuals in the pet/private-breeding trades

I really doubt there is any "general stance" on this amongst Zoochatters, and there will be differences in opinions based on things like nationality, age, and experience. Even your quote above is poorly worded in that you say "whether people believed zoos should source their animals via wild individuals..." - I doubt any (or many) Zoochatters would state that zoos should source their animals from the wild, but many would say that there is nothing wrong with this if it is necessary and appropriately handled. Heck, there are people on here who deliberately choose to visit terrible zoos because they "have" to see species X, and there are even some people on here who support and defend smuggling and the illegal animal trade because it means they can see rare species. At the other end there have been posts sometimes from members shocked that not all animals in zoos were bred in zoos.

 

[BenFoxster]

I noticed I couldn't find any pictures of Omaha's recent Orangutan exhibit, and can't find any great photos of it online, especially not from the guests perspective.

On another note, what are your thoughts on the idea of a Madagascar themed children's section? Various playful lemurs on display, a Madagascar themed petting zoo educating on Madagascar farming and agriculture, a rest area and food stand for the adults based on Madagascar themed architecture, etc. If so anyone know what Madagascar farm animals could be kept in the petting zoo? Maybe nice educational themed ideas or other possible attractions within the area?

 

[Mr Gharial]

Barred mudskipper (Periophthalmus argentilineatus)
Green pufferfish (Dichotomyctere fluviatilis)
Target fish (Terapon jarbua)
Finescale tigerfish (Datnioides microlepis)
Banded archerfish (Toxotes jaculatrix)
Spotted scat (Scatophagus argus)
Green chromide (Etroplus suratensis)
Indo-Pacific tarpon (Megalops cyprinoides)
Silver moony (Monodactylus argenteus)
Doria's bumblebee goby (Brachygobius doriae)
Knight goby (Stigmatogobius sadanundio)
Freshwater moray (Gymnothorax polyuranodon)
Klunzinger's freshwater sole (Leptachirus klunzingeri)

Could all these Brackish water fish be held in a tank with the same salinity?

 

[Van Beal]

What is the ideal social grouping structure of bats? Particularly, I'm looking at four species, being Seba's Short-tailed Bat, Common Vampire Bat, Straw-colored Fruit Bat, and Egyptian Fruit Bat

 

[MOG2012]

Barred mudskipper (Periophthalmus argentilineatus)
Green pufferfish (Dichotomyctere fluviatilis)
Target fish (Terapon jarbua)
Finescale tigerfish (Datnioides microlepis)
Banded archerfish (Toxotes jaculatrix)
Spotted scat (Scatophagus argus)
Green chromide (Etroplus suratensis)
Indo-Pacific tarpon (Megalops cyprinoides)
Silver moony (Monodactylus argenteus)
Doria's bumblebee goby (Brachygobius doriae)
Knight goby (Stigmatogobius sadanundio)
Freshwater moray (Gymnothorax polyuranodon)
Klunzinger's freshwater sole (Leptachirus klunzingeri)

Could all these Brackish water fish be held in a tank with the same salinity?

Not really. You should maybe split these fish into groups (moderately brackish, a bit brackish, and almost marine) as some of the fish don’t do well in the high salinity conditions that other fish prefer.

 

[MOG2012]

I noticed I couldn't find any pictures of Omaha's recent Orangutan exhibit, and can't find any great photos of it online, especially not from the guests perspective.

On another note, what are your thoughts on the idea of a Madagascar themed children's section? Various playful lemurs on display, a Madagascar themed petting zoo educating on Madagascar farming and agriculture, a rest area and food stand for the adults based on Madagascar themed architecture, etc. If so anyone know what Madagascar farm animals could be kept in the petting zoo? Maybe nice educational themed ideas or other possible attractions within the area?

The AZA doesn’t have lemurs as qualified ambassador animals. Some species that could be in this area though could include a boa species (Dumeril’s ground, Madagascar tree, Madagascar ground, etc.), a chameleon, Madagascar hissing cockroach, zebu (introduced)

 

[MOG2012]

What is the ideal social grouping structure of bats? Particularly, I'm looking at four species, being Seba's Short-tailed Bat, Common Vampire Bat, Straw-colored Fruit Bat, and Egyptian Fruit Bat

Seba’s short-tailed bat colonies typically consist of harems while common vampire bats tend to have an emphasis on female bats but it’s still pretty close in the amount per gender. Straw-colored fruit bat form some of the largest colonies in the world, even going up to the millions sometimes but it’s usually driven by seasonal migrations and the availability of fruit. Egyptian fruit bats typically are in colonies with several harems in it, ranging from hundreds to thousands of individuals

 

[MOG2012]

Not sure if this is appropriate or really counts as a zoo design question, but for my spec zoo I was looking to exhibit various hero’s throughout the zoo in each respective themed exhibit area, right now prioritizing Africa, Asia, and South America. So instead of a single herp house, spreading hero’s across the zoo in their respective continents as many zoos are starting to implement now.

Just looking for recommendations on particular herps I could exhibit, looking to house about 5-9 terrariums for each continent, a mix of reptiles, amphibians, and insects that are other iconic, critically endangered and in need of awareness, or fit the theme of fellow species exhibited in the area. for example, if near a mixed species Savanna then herps from the savanna that contribute to its ecosystem, if near a lion looks, then herps from the African kopjes, or herps in the SA exhibit that share their environment with the trees of the tamarins, herps from the Amazon rivers, Asian herps of the Indonesian islands, etc.

Some species for a savanna could be leopard tortoise, and rainbow agama. Some species for the Kopje could be agama, pancake tortoise, and flat rock lizards. For the Amazon River, there could be Giant anaconda mixed with giant Amazon turtle ( mix is at New England aquarium ). Indonesian islands could have a frog species mixed with tokay gecko

 

[MOG2012]

1. Is it realistic for an American zoo to import cape fur seal, a species commonly found in European zoos?
2. What bioluminescent species are commonly found in AZA captivity?
3. Are there any major realistic headliner species (other than pachyderms) for a Deccan plateau exhibit?
4. Could southern tamandua and various gran Chaco armadillo species live outside in Las Vegas year round?
5. What birds from the atacama desert coast are compatible with Humboldt Penguin, and could live outside in Las Vegas year round?
6. What is an average size of a desert dome, and what would be the cost?

 

[Mossman Joe]

Barred mudskipper (Periophthalmus argentilineatus)
Green pufferfish (Dichotomyctere fluviatilis)
Target fish (Terapon jarbua)
Finescale tigerfish (Datnioides microlepis)
Banded archerfish (Toxotes jaculatrix)
Spotted scat (Scatophagus argus)
Green chromide (Etroplus suratensis)
Indo-Pacific tarpon (Megalops cyprinoides)
Silver moony (Monodactylus argenteus)
Doria's bumblebee goby (Brachygobius doriae)
Knight goby (Stigmatogobius sadanundio)
Freshwater moray (Gymnothorax polyuranodon)
Klunzinger's freshwater sole (Leptachirus klunzingeri)

Could all these Brackish water fish be held in a tank with the same salinity?

Aside from living in different salinities, these fish are vastly different in size and will predate on one another. Bumblebee gobies are especially small and prone to predation from even the Knight Gobies. Tarpon are huge and will feed on anything that fits its mouth.

 

[MOG2012]

1. Is it realistic for an American zoo to import cape fur seal, a species commonly found in European zoos?
2. What bioluminescent species are commonly found in AZA captivity?
3. Are there any major realistic headliner species (other than pachyderms) for a Deccan plateau exhibit?
4. Could southern tamandua and various gran Chaco armadillo species live outside in Las Vegas year round?
5. What birds from the atacama desert coast are compatible with Humboldt Penguin, and could live outside in Las Vegas year round?
6. What is an average size of a desert dome, and what would be the cost?

1. Is it possible to keep Pahrump pool fish and devils hole pupfish, species not found in captivity but are native to my zoo’s state?
2. What species are compatible with animals with electricity (electric eels, elephant nose fish, etc.) and are biogeographically accurate?
3. What amphibian species are found in AZA captivity, and are native to the great rift valley? (Other than African bullfrogs)

 

[Mr Gharial]

What species are compatible with animals with electricity (electric eels, elephant nose fish, etc.) and are biogeographically accurate?

Elephantnose fish are held with other fish semi-regularly, like Central African tetras, Small cichlids, Reedfish, Bichirs, Freshwater butterflyfish, Pufferfish, Catfish, etc. Elephantnose fish use their electricity to hunt worms so it's safe for most fish. Electric eels, on the other hand, use it to hunt fish, so they can't be held with a lot of fish species. They are sometimes held with tetras, guppies or armoured catfish, but no doubt you'll miss a few every now and then

What birds from the atacama desert coast are compatible with Humboldt Penguin, and could live outside in Las Vegas year round?

Inca terns

 

[Mr Gharial]

Not really. You should maybe split these fish into groups (moderately brackish, a bit brackish, and almost marine) as some of the fish don’t do well in the high salinity conditions that other fish prefer.

Aside from living in different salinities. (...)

In what groups would I need to separate them?

(...) these fish are vastly different in size and will predate on one another. Bumblebee gobies are especially small and prone to predation from even the Knight Gobies. Tarpon are huge and will feed on anything that fits its mouth.

This would be a very large mudflats enclosure with a lot of smaller creeks and a few larger basins, essentially recreating a real Mangrove area with plenty of space for the smaller fish to avoid the larger ones.

 

[MOG2012]

In what groups would I need to separate them?



This would be a very large mudflats enclosure with a lot of smaller creeks and a few larger basins, essentially recreating a real Mangrove area with plenty of space for the smaller fish to avoid the larger ones.

I would seperate them like this;
Tank #1 - Salinity: ~1.005 - 1.010

• Doria's Bumblebee Goby
• Green Chromide
• Knight Goby
• Klunzinger's Freshwater Sole

Tank #2 - Salinity: ~1.010 - 1.015

• Banded Archerfish
• Barred Mudskiper
• Silver Moony
• Spotted Scat

Tank #3 - Salinity: 1.015 - 1.020

• Finescale Tigerfish
• Indo-Pacific Tarpon
• Target Fish

The Green Pufferfish is aggressive and requires a salinity of ~1.005 - 1.010, and can only be kept with very robust species while the Freshwater Moray is predator and can only be housed with non-aggresive fish that are larger than its mouth with a salinity of ~1.010 - 1.015.

 

[Mossman Joe]

In what groups would I need to separate them?

I'd follow @MOG2012 's example and separate them partially by salinity, though I'd do a few things differently:

• Separate Doria's Bumblebee Gobies into a separate tank (1.000 - 1.005)

This species is communal and benefits greatly from a species-only tank. They are also at risk of predation from other species with a mouth large enough to feed on them such as the sole and Knight Goby. If a tankmate is needed, Javan Ricefish (Oryzias javanicus) can be added as they are similarly skittish and will stick to the surface whereas the bumblebee gobies will primarily inhabit the bottom of the tank.

• Replace the Klunzinger sole with another species, Achiroides leucorhynchos

This species is much smaller at 8-9cm compared to Klunzinger's sole which grows to 20cms, possibly feeding om the Knight Goby.

• Separate Barred Mudskipper into its own tank (1.005 - 1.010)

Mudskippers need relatively shallow water and deep muddy substrate, so I'd separate them into their own tank.

My suggestion is to make these tanks/basins appear connected, so they appear like tide pools that get bigger as you reach the proverbial ocean. You can even have water trickle from one tank to another if they share similar salinities.

 

[Mr Gharial]

I would seperate them like this;
Tank #1 - Salinity: ~1.005 - 1.010

• Doria's Bumblebee Goby
• Green Chromide
• Knight Goby
• Klunzinger's Freshwater Sole

Tank #2 - Salinity: ~1.010 - 1.015

• Banded Archerfish
• Barred Mudskiper
• Silver Moony
• Spotted Scat

Tank #3 - Salinity: 1.015 - 1.020

• Finescale Tigerfish
• Indo-Pacific Tarpon
• Target Fish

The Green Pufferfish is aggressive and requires a salinity of ~1.005 - 1.010, and can only be kept with very robust species while the Freshwater Moray is predator and can only be housed with non-aggresive fish that are larger than its mouth with a salinity of ~1.010 - 1.015.

Thanks. I know the Target fish can be kept in both fully saltwater and fully freshwater aquariums, do you know if any of the other fish can also be kept in any salinities (at least, in terms of Freshwater-Marine habitats, I'm not talking about Hypersaline environments)

If a tankmate is needed, Javan Ricefish (Oryzias javanicus) can be added as they are similarly skittish and will stick to the surface whereas the bumblebee gobies will primarily inhabit the bottom of the tank.

• Replace the Klunzinger sole with another species, Achiroides leucorhynchos

This species is much smaller at 8-9cm compared to Klunzinger's sole which grows to 20cms, possibly feeding om the Knight Goby.

I did my best to look through pet store websites to find available Asian Brackish water species, so I probably didn't get all available species. Do you have any other species recommendations?

Separate Barred Mudskipper into its own tank (1.005 - 1.010)
Mudskippers need relatively shallow water and deep muddy substrate, so I'd separate them into their own tank.

Well, the Mudskippers would be able to roam the mudflats freely and enter different salinities, just like they do in the wild. Along with a few crab species.

My suggestion is to make these tanks/basins appear connected, so they appear like tide pools that get bigger as you reach the proverbial ocean. You can even have water trickle from one tank to another if they share similar salinities.

That was indeed the new plan

 

[Mossman Joe]

I did my best to look through pet store websites to find available Asian Brackish water species, so I probably didn't get all available species. Do you have any other species recommendations?

It's not complete, but here are some suggesyions:
- Freshwater Frogfish (Antennarius biocellatus)
- Leaf Goblinfish (Neovespicula depressifrons)
- Glassfish (Parambassis sp.)
- Wrestling Halfbeak (Dermogenys pusilla)
- Snakehead Gudgeon (Giuris margaritaceus)
- Mangrove Jack (Lutjanus argentimaculatus)
- Barramundi (Lates carcarifer)