Taronga Zoo Future of Taronga Zoo (Speculation / Fantasy)

[Zoofan15]

The area the tigers are in if they got rid of that stupid fake village and plane combined with the sun bear exhibits. Could easily be redeveloped into newer sunbear exhibits and a leopard exhibit that compliments the tigers. And it would give you 3 prominent predators from the region right next to each other. If they were going to redevelop an area for clouded leopard, if they were to move the pygmy hippos out to there own enclosure the combined space of the two enclosures there plus behind the scenes space would surely be large enough for clouded leopard. They would be a great fit with the small clawed otter and Fracious langur.

I really like the idea of redeveloping the tiger complex to include Sri Lankan leopard; with a tall multi-level cage constructed. It’s a requirement to have all leopards exhibited in fully enclosed exhibits, so this is a necessity.

I mean take this with a grain of salt, I havent gotten the tape measure out. But I have always had the impression that the current bongo exhibit is small while the pygmy hippo enclosures were larger. Could just be how they were built as well, giving of that impression.

In saying that though, if they did bring in Brazilians they would be able to open up both exhibits giving them a single larger exhibit.

The bongo exhibit isn’t large by today’s standards; but the Pygmy hippopotamus exhibits are definitely small. They’re around a third of the size of Melbourne’s exhibits, which were built in 1992.

Spoiler: Pygmy Hippopotamus Exhibit Size Comparison

Taronga Zoo:

Exhibit 1: 237 m2
Exhibit 2: 202 m2

Yard 1: 16 m2

Stall 1: 12 m2
Stall 2: 12 m2
Stall 3: 12 m2

Melbourne Zoo:

Exhibit 1: 600 m2
Exhibit 2: 600 m2

Yard 1: 46 m2
Yard 2: 46 m2

Stall 1: 4 m2
Stall 2: 4 m2
Stall 3: 4 m2

Ssss

 

[Tiger91]

I really like the idea of redeveloping the tiger complex to include Sri Lankan leopard; with a tall multi-level cage constructed. It’s a requirement to have all leopards exhibited in fully enclosed exhibits, so this is a necessity.

The tiger exhibit, especially the one with the fig tree is fully enclosed with the new mesh that they use for the carnivores, same as the stuff used for the lions. Doing a leopard enclosure in something like that would look appealing and not like a metal cage while being fully enclosed. They have the space for it there, and ironically if they stuck to some nicely themed education boards it would provide more education around actual animal exhibits, then what they have now. Last I was there you can skip the plane, no one stops in the fake village or the fake market. remaking the bear exhibits and that area to include leopards in the same theme/style of exhibits they have for the tigers would look so good. While increasing education as well. At least education people would engage with more.

The bongo exhibit isn’t large by today’s standards; but the Pygmy hippopotamus exhibits are definitely small. They’re around a third of the size of Melbourne’s exhibits, which were built in 1992.

Spoiler: Pygmy Hippopotamus Exhibit Size Comparison

Taronga Zoo:

Exhibit 1: 237 m2
Exhibit 2: 202 m2

Yard 1: 16 m2

Stall 1: 12 m2
Stall 2: 12 m2
Stall 3: 12 m2

Melbourne Zoo:

Exhibit 1: 600 m2
Exhibit 2: 600 m2

Yard 1: 46 m2
Yard 2: 46 m2

Stall 1: 4 m2
Stall 2: 4 m2
Stall 3: 4 m2

Ssss

They were the original Malaysian tapir exhibits, which was small even for them. However they are semi enclosed if not fully. So wouldn't be hard to convert into clouded leopard enclosures, with wild cat conservation wanting to breed. Taronga would be ideal to house a single or sibling pair, and just be a non breeding holder. They are a spectacular species.

 

[Zoofan15]

The tiger exhibit, especially the one with the fig tree is fully enclosed with the new mesh that they use for the carnivores, same as the stuff used for the lions. Doing a leopard enclosure in something like that would look appealing and not like a metal cage while being fully enclosed. They have the space for it there, and ironically if they stuck to some nicely themed education boards it would provide more education around actual animal exhibits, then what they have now. Last I was there you can skip the plane, no one stops in the fake village or the fake market. remaking the bear exhibits and that area to include leopards in the same theme/style of exhibits they have for the tigers would look so good. While increasing education as well. At least education people would engage with more.



They were the original Malaysian tapir exhibits, which was small even for them. However they are semi enclosed if not fully. So wouldn't be hard to convert into clouded leopard enclosures, with wild cat conservation wanting to breed. Taronga would be ideal to house a single or sibling pair, and just be a non breeding holder. They are a spectacular species.

From what I’ve seen, educational content often falls flat at zoos. You can times this by 10 if it’s not interactive. I’m by no means suggesting content should be dumbed down; but people don’t want to read signage boards beyond knowing what the animal is called (and even then, they’ll sometimes ignore the sign and call it whatever comes to mind). If a sign has historical information (not generic animal facts I already know or can find online), I’ll stop and read it; but even then will sometimes just take a photo and read it in my own time, so as not to hold my family or friends up.

It’a hard to imagine fake villages etc as anything more than a thoroughfare to get to the next exhibit. It’d be far more meaningful to have rows of exhibits/tanks; and to integrate theming more into exhibits - Taronga having a ranger truck in their tiger exhibit; zoos having dingies to shade their Little blue penguins etc.

 

[Zoofan15]

Great food for thought - Really really like that idea alot, one of the several reasons really think its a great idea is because of said terrain issue (when saw the Congo precinct plans while very excited and impressed thought ''hang on, is the whole area really big enough for this (while must be from surveyencing it is very layered in different elevation, think the old stone steps that go up to the current Lemur exhibit too might be heritage protected or destined to be protected, could be wrong though, hope am wrong lol).

But the current Gorilla complex groundspace would work excellently for multiple adjoining Pygmy Hippo habitat exhibits.

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibits:

I really like the idea of multiple Pygmy hippopotamus exhibits. It’d be nice to see Taronga hold 1.2 adults across three exhibits and then have a fourth exhibit (also on display); and a fifth exhibit (off display) to retain offspring bred on site into adulthood.

Exhibit 1: 500 m2
Exhibit 2: 400 m2
Exhibit 3: 400 m2
Exhibit 4: 350 m2
Exhibit 5: 350 m2 (off display)
Total: 2000 m2

This (and the required night house, modified from
existing bull barn) could all be built on the site of Gung’s exhibit, which is 2500 m2 (exhibit and yard), allowing 500m2 of additional room for visitor boardwalks etc.

With the Hippopotamus IRA now approved, Taronga can import a new bull and with two cows, Kambiri (2010) and Lololi (2024), hopefully begin breeding in the coming years.

 

[Jambo]

@Zorro yes I had thought it was a deer species, for the life of me just couldn't remember which

It would've been great to have had Philippine Spotted Deer. Being an endangered species it was likely a regional breeding program would've been established. It appears they were later replaced in plans - by the Chital Deer.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zorro yes I had thought it was a deer species, for the life of me just couldn't remember which

It would've been great to have had Philippine Spotted Deer. Being an endangered species it was likely a regional breeding program would've been established. It appears they were later replaced in plans - by the Chital Deer.

I guess even though they were a small deer, the driving force between deciding not to continue with Chital deer was the lack of space in city zoos to hold decent sized herds.

I’m so glad Taronga has held Eastern bongo up until now, though there’s every reason to believe Ekundu will be the last. Even then, they’ve gone from holding breeding pairs to a solitary bull; with open range zoos likely the site of any future Australasian breeding.

 

[Zorro]

@Zorro yes I had thought it was a deer species, for the life of me just couldn't remember which

It would've been great to have had Philippine Spotted Deer. Being an endangered species it was likely a regional breeding program would've been established. It appears they were later replaced in plans - by the Chital Deer.

Your welcome. Yes they are very attractive and highly endangered it would be nice to have a few of these small interesting deer species!

 

[Trua]

Yeah Philippine Deers were the other species. Chital Deer were a late fill in - sourced regionally, there's a lot on deer farms around the country.

 

[Zoofan15]

If/when Taronga build a new Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit/exhibits, it’ll be interesting to see what happens with the existing exhibits; and indeed the Eastern bongo exhibit. Capybara are well accommodated elsewhere in the zoo; and so it seems unlikely one (or certainly both) of the existing hippo pools would house this species in the future.

My preference would be the following:

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit 1:

Expand the adjoining Asian small-clawed otter exhibit into this space to house a large breeding group.

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit 2:

Clouded leopard exhibit

Eastern bongo exhibit:

Clouded leopard exhibit

The two Clouded leopard exhibits could be linked via an overhead pathway. The location would be ideal as it’s a reasonable distance from any apex predator.

 

[steveroberts]

If/when Taronga build a new Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit/exhibits, it’ll be interesting to see what happens with the existing exhibits; and indeed the Eastern bongo exhibit. Capybara are well accommodated elsewhere in the zoo; and so it seems unlikely one (or certainly both) of the existing hippo pools would house this species in the future.

My preference would be the following:

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit 1:

Expand the adjoining Asian small-clawed otter exhibit into this space to house a large breeding group.

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit 2:

Clouded leopard exhibit

Eastern bongo exhibit:

Clouded leopard exhibit

The two Clouded leopard exhibits could be linked via an overhead pathway. The location would be ideal as it’s a reasonable distance from any apex predator.

Agree with you about completely, good concept.

...I do know one species that was scrapped by Taronga (Babirusa), ... I'm of the opinion they may have been exhibited in one half of the current Pygmy Hippo complex, which then held Malayan Tapir...

I think the concept was to always to have the two Malayan Tapir exhibits, and that Babirusa would share with the Deer (as well as importing the Philippine Spotted Deer) but as we know they couldnt get either of the latter two.

 

[Jambo]

If/when Taronga build a new Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit/exhibits, it’ll be interesting to see what happens with the existing exhibits; and indeed the Eastern bongo exhibit. Capybara are well accommodated elsewhere in the zoo; and so it seems unlikely one (or certainly both) of the existing hippo pools would house this species in the future.

My preference would be the following:

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit 1:

Expand the adjoining Asian small-clawed otter exhibit into this space to house a large breeding group.

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit 2:

Clouded leopard exhibit

Eastern bongo exhibit:

Clouded leopard exhibit

The two Clouded leopard exhibits could be linked via an overhead pathway. The location would be ideal as it’s a reasonable distance from any apex predator.

I would also like to see an expansion of the current otter complex; the next door Pygmy Hippo enclosure would be perfect for this. They could simply just knock down a wall and allow the habitats to interconnect.

Another option I'd like to see is perhaps a species of Crocodile. Even Freshwater Crocodiles would be nice for the underwater viewing exhibit, as the enclosure wouldn't need to be fully climate controlled.

 

[Zoofan15]

Agree with you about completely, good concept.





I think the concept was to always to have the two Malayan Tapir exhibits, and that Babirusa would share with the Deer (as well as importing the Philippine Spotted Deer) but as we know they couldnt get either of the latter two.

It’s a shame breeding of Malayan tapir was never more successful in the region, though I acknowledge they’re poorly suited to the Australian climate and a phase out was inevitable.

Breeding pairs of Brazilian tapir at Dubbo and Adelaide bred exceedingly well, so hopefully the new pairs will similarly thrive.

 

[Zoofan15]

Another option I'd like to see is perhaps a species of Crocodile. Even Freshwater Crocodiles would be nice for the underwater viewing exhibit, as the enclosure wouldn't need to be fully climate controlled.

Freshwater crocodiles would be the best choice since they don’t require a climate controlled exhibit; but personally, I’d love to see additional holders of False gharial.

Auckland Zoo advised they won’t be importing a male False gharial and breeding, so sadly their ambassador females will likely be the only ones in the region for the foreseeable.

 

[steveroberts]

@Jambo

Initially thought perhaps Philippine Crocodile (possibly even False Gharial like Zoofan points out) could work for Kambiri and Lololi's current exhibit, but agree with Zoofan personally that Otters really need an expansion and its the perfect site for being adjoining.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Jambo

Initially thought perhaps Philippine Crocodile (possibly even False Gharial like Zoofan points out) could work for Kambiri and Lololi's current exhibit, but agree with Zoofan personally that Otters really need an expansion and its the perfect site for being adjoining.

Auckland Zoo have a large otter exhibit. It’s just a shame after allowing their breeding group to reach 15 otters that it’s since dwindled to three males.

By the look of the masterplan, Adelaide’s otter exhibit will be phenomenal; but Taronga could aspire to something on the scale of Auckland’s at least.

 

[steveroberts]

Do you guys think with the unliklihood of Okapis and Mandrills (might have missed something, while do know about hard to source one of the genders if wanting to acquire a potential breeding pair of Okapis; on the subject of Mandrills, is it a no-go because the region has lost interest or is there some 'redtape' in the way blocking further Mandrill imports?) wonder if perhap Taronga's future while hopefully continuing with Gorillas and Pygmy Hippos if there would be consideration to the following: continuing with Eastern Bongos (unless further imports are banned?), Eastern B+W Colobuses and De Brazzas Guenons perhaps.

If say the current Gorilla habitat site became multiple exhibits for Pygmy Hippos and the Congo precinct did go ahead.

Could the land around the Elephant Temple including the current Cotton-top Tamarin island and former Saltwater Crocodile exhibit, be considered for Bornean Orangutans habitat (o-lines and climbing towers would not come into contact with Sky Safari gondola lines). If say the Cotton-top Tamarins could be rehomed adjacent to the Squirrel Monkeys on Alligator lake perhaps. Or if were to leave this adjoining section for something else or way it is largely, there is an adjoining 665 sq m lawn adjoining the back of Gung's/the Camel's former yard which gives a ground surface area of approximately 2,665 m2. {Elephant Temple itself would be remaining historically important relic of former Elephants in area, like how Adelaide's Elephant House stands alone albeit former yard behind now for Giraffes, but geographically different).

Additionally wonder perhaps if the Ringtailed Lemurs need to move if perhaps either they take over the Alligator lake islands and or current Cottontop Tamarins area + empty former Crocodile site (though still think Philippine Crocs or similar might be a good idea), and or perhaps the Capybaras are accomodated in one of the areas albeit would need renovations, and the Lemurs move back where they were before in the old Seal Pool (although strong thinking with this latter suggesting is the thoughts ''leave well enough alone for some time'' with this last paragraph of whatifs).

 

[Zoofan15]

Do you guys think with the unliklihood of Okapis and Mandrills (might have missed something, while do know about hard to source one of the genders if wanting to acquire a potential breeding pair of Okapis; on the subject of Mandrills, is it a no-go because the region has lost interest or is there some 'redtape' in the way blocking further Mandrill imports?) wonder if perhap Taronga's future while hopefully continuing with Gorillas and Pygmy Hippos if there would be consideration to the following: continuing with Eastern Bongos (unless further imports are banned?), Eastern B+W Colobuses and De Brazzas Guenons perhaps.

If say the current Gorilla habitat site became multiple exhibits for Pygmy Hippos and the Congo precinct did go ahead.

Could the land around the Elephant Temple including the current Cotton-top Tamarin island and former Saltwater Crocodile exhibit, be considered for Bornean Orangutans habitat (o-lines and climbing towers would not come into contact with Sky Safari gondola lines). If say the Cotton-top Tamarins could be rehomed adjacent to the Squirrel Monkeys on Alligator lake perhaps. Or if were to leave this adjoining section for something else or way it is largely, there is an adjoining 665 sq m lawn adjoining the back of Gung's/the Camel's former yard which gives a ground surface area of approximately 2,665 m2.

Additionally wonder perhaps if the Ringtailed Lemurs need to move if perhaps either they take over the Alligator lake islands and or current Cottontop Tamarins area + empty former Crocodile site (though still think Philippine Crocs or similar might be a good idea), and or perhaps the Capybaras are accomodated in one of the areas albeit would need renovations, and the Lemurs move back where they were before in the old Seal Pool (although strong thinking with this latter suggesting is the thoughts ''leave well enough alone for some time'' with this last paragraph of whatifs).

Yes, aside from Australia not having a Giraffe/Okapi IRA, the main issue with acquiring Okapi is the absence of surplus cows, especially in North America. I feel like it would also be beneficial for the region to hold a minimum of three pairs, to allow exchanges between the zoos; rather than 1.1 being imported, hoping they breed and then sending any offspring back to North America.

Mandrill can be imported, the region has just lost interest. Although Mandrill aren’t endangered, they’re charismatic animals and the world’s most colourful mammal. They resonate with the general public due to the Lion King and its numerous spin-offs and would make for a popular display. Like baboons, it’s recognised medium to large groups are optimal for social welfare, which is difficult to accomodate in city zoos.

Eastern bongo can be imported. They’re on the live import list and the Bovid IRA was approved three years ago. Like Mandrill, the female live in large social groupings in the wild; but that doesn’t preclude city zoos from housing solitary bulls - with the open range zoos accomodating larger breeding herds. There doesn’t appear to be an overwhelming surplus available to the region, being a critically endangered species.

Your orangutan idea is fantastic by the way. It’d be so great to see Bornean orangutan make a return to Taronga. I often wonder how things would have panned out had Datuk (1989-1998) survived; or had his father Horst (1978-2023) or half-brother Isim (1994) replaced him.

 

[steveroberts]

@Zoofan15

Thanks man

Oh yeah thats right the Giraffidae IRA of course lol almost forgot thanks for reminding me.

Yeah the Rafiki phenomenem with him as a cartoon character having Mandrill coloured snout. Mandrills are one of best visually recognisable monkeys hey even if to many they are ''a Baboon'' (imagine many zoos make a note of on their information signs after naming them the information would read: ''The Mandrill also known as the Forest Baboon...'', especially if the zoo has no Baboon species it kind of gives Baboons representation still; well Taronga is a Baboon-less and Baboon-like-less zoo of late so wonder if would consider.

If Taronga did open up their impressive architectural plans for the Congo precinct again (think Tropical Africa best way to approach the theming because of some of the species not neccesarily found in Congo countries/Central Africa itself; but have to admit the name Congo is exciting as part of the world and always inspires a sense of wonder and adventure). Would consider prioritising Bongo where Okapi were designated on the concept plans, and look at expanding the precinct even if not on same direct pathway due to elevation, by giving the Pygmy Hippos the space where current Gorilla complex is as you brilliantly suggested.

*if going with your idea which really like about Clouded Leopards and Otter exhibit expansion within Rainforest Trail, wonder if perhaps to bring the precinct back to its initially intended southern Asian focus too if the Squirrel Monkeys in the aviary enclosure are ever found a new home (nothing personal, really think theyre adorable personally, just long term thinking) perhaps Taronga might be open to Dusky Langurs a very striking monkey (though they have Francois Langurs already but nothing wrong with them having two Asian monkey species of course).


Yeah perhaps with Taronga and Bornean Orangutans it really would have had circumstances occured differently (well Auckland certainly 'took up the mantle' so incredibly, but sure they would appreciate a regional partner now).
We've talked about before so next sentence forgive if repetitive lol:

But think firstly when Taronga (under the navigation of the late great Dr John Kelly) began to show focus on Bornean Orangs', it was that first hurdle of creating a better living environment for their hybrid Orangs', then the media was very harsh on them when word got out they were looking to acquire Bornean Orangs from overseas (because the plan was 'floated' in considering sending all their hybrids to zoos in India again, and perhaps some other zoos overseas) and the media went in on the attack for the 'Orangutan Rainforest' exhibit precinct having been funded for the vastly improved wellbeing of the zoo's hybrid Orangs' quality of life.

So feel this sort of overshadowed the exciting arrival in '95/'96 or the Borneans; and personally think having to share the technically limited site (one big outdoor enclosure, big, but for a species that requires multiple adjoining exhibits) that sharing the space with 5 sterilised other (hybrid) Orangs' also made the situation in late '90s, first year of '00s really tricky; so can see why in 2001 they went with a different direction and abandoned the Orangutan project for the most part (obvs' not finalised until Willow & Jantan left in late 2018).

 

[Zoofan15]

Yeah the Rafiki phenomenem with him as a cartoon character having Mandrill coloured snout. Mandrills are one of best visually recognisable monkeys hey even if to many they are ''a Baboon'' (imagine many zoos make a note of on their information signs after naming them the information would read: ''The Mandrill also known as the Forest Baboon...'', especially if the zoo has no Baboon species it kind of gives Baboons representation still; well Taronga is a Baboon-less and Baboon-like-less zoo of late so wonder if would consider.

Yeah perhaps with Taronga and Bornean Orangutans it really would have had circumstances occured differently (well Auckland certainly 'took up the mantle' so incredibly, but sure they would appreciate a regional partner now). We've talked about before so next sentence forgive if repetitive lol, but think firstly with Taronga under the brilliant Dr Kelly beginning to show focus on Bornean Orangs, it was that first hurdle of creating a better living environment for their hybrid Orangs', then the media was very harsh on them when word got out they were looking to acquire Bornean Orangs from overseas because the plan was to consider sending all their hybrids to India etc and the media went in on the attack for the Orangutan Rainforest being funded for the benefit of the zoo's hybrid Orangs' quality of life, so feel this sort of overshadowed the exciting arrival in '95/'96 or the Borneans; and personally think having to share the technically limited site (one big outdoor enclosure, big, but for a species that requires multiple adjoining exhibits) that sharing the space with 5 sterilised other (hybrid) Orangs' also made the situation in late '90s, very early '00s really tricky so can see why in 2001 they went with a different direction and abandoned the Orangutan project for the most part (obvs not finalised until Willow & Jantan left in late 2018).

It’s a real shame Taronga (and other zoos in the region like Auckland, Wellington, Melbourne and Adelaide) phased out Chacma baboon, as they’re my favourite baboon species. Their hierarchy is much more complex than the Hamadryas baboon, with females inheriting their mother’s ranking and young sisters outranking their older sisters. A female’s ranking in turn influences her birth intervals/reproductive success (same with Mandrill).

It’s amazing to think Taronga once held so many orangutans within the Orangutan Rainforest complex. From what I can ascertain, they had three social groupings in the mid-1990’s. I believe the Hong Kong females joined Wanita and Willow, as the sisters were living together previously and Wanita later made the move with them to Auckland Zoo. Juveniles and even adolescents seem reasonably amenable when it comes to social groupings, with conflicts often arising by young adulthood (possibly why Willow, then 16, never joined the trio exported to Auckland).

 

[Tiger91]

If/when Taronga build a new Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit/exhibits, it’ll be interesting to see what happens with the existing exhibits; and indeed the Eastern bongo exhibit. Capybara are well accommodated elsewhere in the zoo; and so it seems unlikely one (or certainly both) of the existing hippo pools would house this species in the future.

My preference would be the following:

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit 1:

Expand the adjoining Asian small-clawed otter exhibit into this space to house a large breeding group.

Pygmy hippopotamus exhibit 2:

Clouded leopard exhibit

Eastern bongo exhibit:

Clouded leopard exhibit

The two Clouded leopard exhibits could be linked via an overhead pathway. The location would be ideal as it’s a reasonable distance from any apex predator.

Hopefully the zoo will address the woe decline in larger species and bring in some new rainforest species for display. Hopefully, though I won't hold my breath they will remember that they are a zoo.

Clouded leopard would be a fantastic species for them to invest in.